Norm Hartnett - 27/6/2007 11:02 PM1. Jim are you seriously suggesting that NASA would be willing to pay a COTS provider or Russia to fly a private industry payload to the ISS? Maybe they might do a space available deal but how likely is it that there would be space available on any foreseeable ISS re-supply missions even if COTS comes to full fruition?2. As for the astronauts, even with six on board they are going to be working full time on housekeeping and NASA/partner work, I doubt that they are going to have a lot of free time to monitor/conduct outside experiments. While I cannot swear to it I thought I heard Gerstenmaier say that NASA would charge during the June 25th teleconference.3. Finally, and what is the nail in the coffin for NASA vs Bigelow, the sheer tonnage of paper work that NASA requires to take anything to the ISS is bound to be a deal breaker for private industry if not for other government agencies.
The report released Monday says NASA plans to cover the costs for cargo transportation, crew support and station maintenance under agreements with future users.Those users would not have to pay access fees or provide separate lab equipment. But they would be required to cover any costs associated with their own research projects and payload devices, said Mark Uhran, assistant associate administrator for the space station.
MKremer - 27/6/2007 11:42 PMThis story explains it fairly well:NASA seeks public, private partners interested in using space stationFor costs: QuoteThe report released Monday says NASA plans to cover the costs for cargo transportation, crew support and station maintenance under agreements with future users.Those users would not have to pay access fees or provide separate lab equipment. But they would be required to cover any costs associated with their own research projects and payload devices, said Mark Uhran, assistant associate administrator for the space station.So, they have to fund (or get grants for) their own research time, and any extra people needed, plus all their research equipment required - including the R&D/development/construction/testing of the payload experiment.The transportation and on-orbit setup/maintenance/monitoring/possible sample handling and collection & return would be covered by NASA.Not a bad deal, IMO, if it comes to fruition.
Norm Hartnett - 27/6/2007 10:50 PMSo NASA quashes another private space effort.
James Lowe1 - 27/6/2007 11:35 PMI spoke to Chris about coverage and he recieved an e-mail, along with a few other journalists, saying that no information would be released, this came from Bigelow PAO. Even the e-mail saying this was tagged as not to be published. They said they will send a statement from Bigelow himself several hours after launch if successful.Launch is still on for Thursday and we'll hope the Russians on here will be able to help more than some automated clock on another site.
MKremer - 27/6/2007 9:53 PMBut Bigelow themselves aren't going to be flying anything at all - they only plan on selling the modules to others (who'll have to do all the launch contracting and payments, and also figure out and plan and pay for getting the people/equipment to the Bigelow module they bought once it's in orbit).
MKremerJust because NASA is saying they'll pay the freight to orbit and ISS, doesn't mean the experiments/research/PIs will have an advantage over a purely commercial orbital station. Doing research on the ISS still means they'll have to abide by all of NASA's rules and regulations for ISS hardware requirements and limitations; data collection and download&upload bandwidths; and time allocations & restrictions for operation and on-orbit maintenance/servicing/data&sample collection. Those may or may not be much more restrictive and limiting than a private entities' restrictions and requirements for a Bigelow module-based research experiment - maybe enough that the extra costs for launching and delivering/setup of research/experiment hardware are worth the extra expense to use the Bigelow site over ISS.
Norm Hartnett - 27/6/2007 11:50 PMSo NASA quashes another private space effort. Interesting, is that in their mission statement somewhere?I can understand it though, they have done such a poor job with the billions the taxpayers have given them it would be a shame if private industry did a better job with mere millions.Enough! Time to get radical.
Norm Hartnett - 27/6/2007 11:37 PMI hope Bigelow sues the pants off them.
I really don't see how NASA's ISS announcement really impacts Bigelow much, if at all. They're attempting to reach two different markets. NASA's 'National Lab' call is clearly aimed at government agencies and scientists at major institutions that want to place experiment packages into a technical environment. Bigelow's plan seems more aimed at the Hiltons, Hyatts, and International Hotels Groups (PLC) of the world, as well as the national space agencies themselves, simply to provide bulk accommodations. So, in ten years, I could maybe see a country like India (but not China) buying a couple modules and lofting them to form an Indian space station, if the Bigelow price were right.
If, on the other hand, a single Indian researcher just wanted to put an experimental package on the ISS to study, say, the background drift of dark matter in local space, that could happen, but I don't think that potential investment would have ever been large enough, or even appropriate, for the purchase of a BA330 module.
stockman - 28/6/2007 3:13 PMAre there any russian sources that can verify what is truly going on?
James Lowe1 - 28/6/2007 6:35 AMI spoke to Chris about coverage and he recieved an e-mail, along with a few other journalists, saying that no information would be released, this came from Bigelow PAO. Even the e-mail saying this was tagged as not to be published. They said they will send a statement from Bigelow himself several hours after launch if successful.Launch is still on for Thursday and we'll hope the Russians on here will be able to help more than some automated clock on another site.
