U.S. Air Force, SpaceX Strike Deal for Cape Canaveral Launches

[nacnud]

http://www.space.com/news/070426_spacex_capecanaveral.html

[wannamoonbase]

SLC 40 is a nice seaside piece of real estate.  Love it there, its a great area of the Cape.

Stacking the HLV will be interesting.  Won't be able to do that with an erecting table like Delta 4 or Falcon 1 because the 3 body wide configuration will have to fit over the flame trench opening properly which is perpendicular to where an erector would usually be.

I suspect they will use the Titan 4 ECS systems.  Anyone know if the facility hardware was Lockheed or Air Force property?  Was it Lockheed and revert back to the Air Force afterward?

It will be interesting to say the least.

Best of luck SpaceX

[Jim]

wannamoonbase - 26/4/2007  4:07 PM


1. Stacking the HLV will be interesting.  Won't be able to do that with an erecting table like Delta 4 or Falcon 1 because the 3 body wide configuration will have to fit over the flame trench opening properly which is perpendicular to where an erector would usually be.

2.  I suspect they will use the Titan 4 ECS systems.  Anyone know if the facility hardware was Lockheed or Air Force property?  Was it Lockheed and revert back to the Air Force afterward?

1.  They can stack vertically

2.  They are the USAF's

[wannamoonbase]

Jim - 26/4/2007  4:19 PM
1.  They can stack vertically

Using the existing MST or their own crane?

It would be incredible to see 27 engines all running at the same time.

[Crispy]

27 engines. when you put it like that. Man.
N-1 1st stage had 30, reflect on that.

[NotGncDude]

Crispy - 26/4/2007  7:33 PM

27 engines. when you put it like that. Man.
N-1 1st stage had 30, reflect on that.

Soyuz and Energia had 24 *chambers* roaring at a time. But yeah, that's cheating, they're only 5 and 8 actual engines respectively .
 

[jongoff]

Crispy - 26/4/2007  4:33 PM

27 engines. when you put it like that. Man.
N-1 1st stage had 30, reflect on that.

Well, one thing to remember is that they only plan to field Falcon IX Heavy if they actually get customers for it.  Which seeing as how nobody has paid Atlas V to field their Heavy version yet (unless I'm mistaken), I think the 27 engine version may never fly.  But yeah, that's a seriously large number of engines.

~Jon

[wannamoonbase]

jongoff - 26/4/2007  8:59 PM
Well, one thing to remember is that they only plan to field Falcon IX Heavy if they actually get customers for it.  Which seeing as how nobody has paid Atlas V to field their Heavy version yet (unless I'm mistaken), I think the 27 engine version may never fly.  But yeah, that's a seriously large number of engines.

~Jon

If they can pull off the Falcon 9 and have it fly successfully, which will be no small feat, and if SpaceX can maintain their claimed pricing structure then perhaps they will get clients based on cost.

I think the Atlas V HLV would be a great vehicle but there is only one potential client and the cost to develop and launch would be in the 100's of millions charged right to the defense department.  If SpaceX funds it themselves then customers might come along.  (Emphasis on might.)

Lots of ifs and buts before then but certainly interesting.  Even the single core vehicle will be a huge accomplishment.

At least they aren't even going to try and use their little south pacific island.  Somethings as large and the IX has to be done in an area that is more accessible.

[Jim]

VIB is schedule to come down soon.

[wannamoonbase]

pad rat - 27/4/2007  9:41 AM

"SLC 40 is a nice seaside piece of real estate. Love it there, its a great area of the Cape."

Sure it is - with 40 years worth of hypergolic residuals in the soil and in the plumbing. Decontaminating the umbilical tower propellant plumbing and the associated servicing equipment is going to be a true headache. To the best of my knowledge, USAF had taken no action on that equipment, deciding to wait until a tenant came along to bear that cost. I suppose SpaceX is their pigeon.

I meant outside the fence and up to the ocean.  I agree the site itself has alot of cleaning up to do.  No question, some very nasty stuff.

I wonder if the lease agreement requires the USAF to clean up those griblies before SpaceX comes in with new LOx and RP1 tanks etc.  Although I suppose they could get real mid evil and preload the RP1 right from a tanker.  Doesn't get much cheaper than that, just a hose and a pump.  Not too many ways to get around handling that much LOx.

[rocketmantitan]

I believe much of the hazardous propellant residue is already cleaned up.  The Air Force Titan program office budgeted/funded/and executed the contracts to have the hazardous stuff cleaned up as each pad finished launching.  They started on the old Titan IIIB/Titan II pad at Vandenberg (SLC-4W), cleaning out and removing the nitrogen tetroxide and UDMH storage vessels/propellant loading units.  I think they have now cleaned up SLC-4W, SLC-4E and LC-40 (including pulling the hydrazine lines out of the umbilical tower, etc).  Starting in 2007, the Air Force launch wing takes over budgeting/funding/executing the final demolition, now that the hazards are cleaned up.  This includes the VIB demolition mentioned earlier in the chain.  I haven't heard about the remaining items: MST, UT, Pad buildings, ITL warehouse, SMARF, SMAB.  Still waiting for initial schedule for demolition of launch complexes at Vandenberg.

SpaceX doesn't pay for remediation, since that was Air Force responsibility.  Undoubtedly SpaceX will want to negotiate for some items to remain in place - lightning towers probably a prime item.

wannamoonbase - 27/4/2007  12:51 PM

I meant outside the fence and up to the ocean.  I agree the site itself has alot of cleaning up to do.  No question, some very nasty stuff.

I wonder if the lease agreement requires the USAF to clean up those griblies before SpaceX comes in with new LOx and RP1 tanks etc.  Although I suppose they could get real mid evil and preload the RP1 right from a tanker.  Doesn't get much cheaper than that, just a hose and a pump.  Not too many ways to get around handling that much LOx.

[Jim]

SMAB isn't going to be demolished for the near term.  It houses the SPIF and the IUS East Bay (don't know what it has been renamed).  I doubt the SMARF will be neither.

[JWag]

Here's the Wikipedia article on SLC-40.    As always, take Wikipedia articles with a grain of salt.  However, for people like me who are mostly or completely ignorant about the place there's plenty of helpful information there (including maps, some history, and other links).

[ShuttleDiscovery]

MondoMor - 30/4/2007  7:21 PM

Here's the Wikipedia article on SLC-40.    As always, take Wikipedia articles with a grain of salt.  However, for people like me who are mostly or completely ignorant about the place there's plenty of helpful information there (including maps, some history, and other links).

It still says 'It is under consideration for Ares I/V'.  You can tell stuff like this rarely gets updated.

[kevin-rf]

I think you can find more on astronautix : http://www.astronautix.com/sites/capllc40.htm

As always, same grain of warning