Author Topic: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)  (Read 16648 times)

Offline kevinof

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Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« on: 04/11/2022 01:52 am »
The cloud is not N2O4 but HNO3 and  dust but still not nice.


Edit2 : They have replaced the video and edited out that part where they all run away

Edit: Seriously these guys are fruit cakes. They have been smoking something that is messing with their brains. When I first saw this last night I really thought it was a joke (April 1st!) but it's now. They are going to kill or maim someone.

Hopefully health and safety inspectors are already making travel plans to pay them a visit and lock the doors.


https://twitter.com/sciguyspace/status/1513319622350716929?s=21&t=B4nyDhlj7TZ-PQPN_ilA0g

Damn, Pythom Space has some work to do on their safety culture—this video is a masterclass in how not to do rocket science.



https://t.co/2qGT3MInSr https://t.co/3o4qH9l8CB
« Last Edit: 04/11/2022 12:34 pm by kevinof »

Offline trimeta

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #1 on: 04/11/2022 04:29 am »
If you want another laugh, check out their uniquely terrible website, which includes an image of their engine's injector with the caption "Oxidizer (Hydrazine) is injected into the chamber through a variable pintle." Your guess is as good as mine as to how hydrazine could be an oxidizer, or why it's mentioned when elsewhere (for example, this press release talking about stacking the test stage seen in the above video) they confirm that nitric acid is the oxidizer and furfuryl alcohol is the fuel.

For even more of their ridiculous claims, you can check out this Twitter thread (for which I've provided the unrolled link, as well as the initial tweet below).

https://twitter.com/KerbalSystems/status/1513341542655619074

Offline tankat0208

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #2 on: 04/11/2022 04:50 am »
Their second stage of 150kg microsat launcher is supposed to be reused wet-workshop style into interplanetary transport. What were they smoking??!

Offline Skyrocket

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #3 on: 04/11/2022 07:05 am »
I am pretty sure that Pythom Space must be some kind of weird comedy act...
Hopefully...
Or did they really do their "testing" this way?   :o

« Last Edit: 04/11/2022 10:12 am by Skyrocket »

Offline kevinof

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #4 on: 04/11/2022 07:45 am »
It cracks me up but it shouldn't as this is dangerous stuff  -  Appears they only decided to chain it down at the last minute which gives me hope that someone has a little sense. But so much is wrong with their setup, design and plans that nobody should go anywhere near them with investment $$.


If you want another laugh, check out their uniquely terrible website, which includes an image of their engine's injector with the caption "Oxidizer (Hydrazine) is injected into the chamber through a variable pintle." Your guess is as good as mine as to how hydrazine could be an oxidizer, or why it's mentioned when elsewhere (for example, this press release talking about stacking the test stage seen in the above video) they confirm that nitric acid is the oxidizer and furfuryl alcohol is the fuel.

For even more of their ridiculous claims, you can check out this Twitter thread (for which I've provided the unrolled link, as well as the initial tweet below).

https://twitter.com/KerbalSystems/status/1513341542655619074

Offline Kryten

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #5 on: 04/11/2022 12:02 pm »
 Aside from the safety and procedural issues that have been pointed out already - why were they trying to do hop tests on the side of a hill? Did they want it to fall over?

Offline libra

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #6 on: 04/11/2022 01:31 pm »
"This rocket is dynamite !"

"Tis but a scratch. I've been through worse."

"Run awaaaay !"
« Last Edit: 04/11/2022 01:32 pm by libra »

Offline zubenelgenubi

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #7 on: 04/11/2022 04:01 pm »
The original video 📹 has apparently been edited. The scene of the crew fleeing the exhaust plume is gone.
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Offline trimeta

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #8 on: 04/11/2022 04:14 pm »
The original video 📹 has apparently been edited. The scene of the crew fleeing the exhaust plume is gone.
Eric Berger posted an article discussing Pythom, including a link to a YouTube video where someone preserved the original video in its entirety.


Online abaddon

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #9 on: 04/11/2022 05:15 pm »
I thought the "rocketry" in the new Fast and Furious 9 movie was ridiculous (and it was) but this... yeesh.

Do you have to have some kind of license to do this stuff?  Or is it a case of a "as long as nobody is around and everyone is informed" kind of thing?
« Last Edit: 04/11/2022 05:16 pm by abaddon »

Offline Bizgec

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #10 on: 04/11/2022 05:20 pm »
Must be comedy. I'd say it's satire on SpaceX, and I doubt there's any hydrazine or nitric acid involved at all. Alcohol, however ... lots of it, just not particularly pure.  :o

Offline ClayJar

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #11 on: 04/11/2022 08:06 pm »
Their "Pythom Hot Test Jan 12, 2021" video on Vimeo (which starts with a title card that says "PYTHOM Asterex 4.0 Rocket Engine Test Jan 12, 2020") is worthy of attention.  Is it just me, or is the countdown at 2:45... off nominal?

10... 9... 8... 7... 6... 5... 3 ??? ... 4 :o ... 2... 1...

I suppose I shouldn't be too harsh on someone just for getting some dates and numbers and stuff wrong.  I mean, it's not like it's rocket science.


Offline webdan

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #12 on: 04/11/2022 08:41 pm »
I think we need Jim’s thoughts on this one.

Offline ParabolicSnark

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #13 on: 04/11/2022 10:44 pm »
Public statement by Pythom below.  :o yikes

Quote from: Pythom
After the micro-jump of Eiger stage one last month, suddenly Pythom seems to be on everyone's radar in the US, including Eric Berger (author of "Untold stories of SpaceX"), Jordan Noone (co-founder of Relativity Space), Jeff Greason, (co-founder of the legendary Rotary Rocket project), and many others.

In true Pythom spirit of showing things like they are, we had posted a video of the jump, including the "scary" parts,  normally swept under the rug in the aerospace industry. People loved it and we got lots of positive feedback until Andrew Rettenmaier, a propulsion engineer at Blue Origin, raised safety concerns. Then "a friend" sent the discussion to Berger who sent us an email Sunday evening and published a story early Monday (within 12 hours), without waiting for a comment. Now Pythom really got the attention of the space communities. So here goes a very quick update on Pythom safety procedures, which we will follow up with a Zoom conference next week, April 21st, open to the public, where we will introduce Pythom and host a Q&A.

Andrew's concern was about the orange/red cloud and our proximity to it. Seems he may have mixed it up with the red cloud created by Blue Origin's lunar lander propellant MMH/NTO, an extremely toxic combination. Pythom's "green" propellant combination of furfuryl alcohol and WFNA (nitric acid) is much kinder to people and the environment and a major reason for our choice of it.

That said, like any toxic smoke the by-products of Pythom propellants should be avoided, and in this case three of Pythom's key staff (founders) ran to avoid the cloud. It should be mentioned that the day was still calm, the cloud was very well defined and included a great deal of sand particles (no concrete is laid down to simulate the landing conditions on Moon or Mars).

With regards to our safety procedures (nobody has actually asked us yet what they are) we follow an 8-page checklist from FAA's launch requirements derived since our time at the DARPA launch challenge. This includes large water barrels placed out strategically, including a 325 gallons (1500 liters) water truck with a high-pressure hose and various fire extinguishers. All this for a total of 3 gallons (14 liters) of burned propellants.

Not shown in the video but described in the written debrief attached on the website is that the majority of the staff had left the area to take cover 500 meters away behind a hill. The above-mentioned three key people were hiding in a pit behind 10 feet of solid gravel.

The two of us, Pythom founders and authors of this entry, have done four unguided expeditions to Everest, three unguided and unsupported full-length expeditions to the South- and North Poles, and sailed across the Atlantic from Europe to South America. During our expeditions, we lost many friends to the elements, and Pythom's bird logo, a chough, is to remind us of those brave women and men. This is the only bird that flies high up on Everest, all of the way to the summit. Old mountaineers say they are the souls of dead climbers.

We didn't survive all our expeditions by luck only, but by rigorous risk preparedness. We extend this thinking to Pythom and after hundreds of high-pressure water tests, hot firings, and hydrostatic tests - most with pressure levels twice that of other small launchers, active or under development - we have yet to encounter one single injury in our team.

We build faster and cheaper than any startup in Europe and the US (that we know of). Only some of the Chinese startups are on the same level.

Our message to the aerospace community is simply this. Should we only allow billionaires and formal aerospace engineers to lead our way into space? Or should we encourage all space enthusiasts cheering on the sidelines that they too can actually start building themselves, step by step, even if they are not part of traditional space? Let's think about that for a moment and remember the background of Elon Musk and Peter Beck, by far the two leading stars in new space and none of them traditional aerospace engineers.

Virgin had several accidents, including fatalities. ABL blew up their second stage last month, Astra have been blowing up more rockets than we can count. What puts them and Pythom apart is neither that we are safer or more unsafe. The difference is we are more transparent. We hope the community can come to appreciate it and that we can continue to show things the way they really are in rocketering; exciting and sometimes a little bit dangerous.

Ad Astra, Esto Fortis

We hope to meet many of you on Zoom on Thursday April 21, 11am PST. There will be a short presentation about Pythom and then Q&A. Link will be posted on www.pythom.space on April 20. See you there.

It seems a bit conspiratorial to throw shade at the other aerospace companies under the guise of being transparent, implying Virgin Galactic, ABL, and Astra have been opaque surrounding safety of those operations.

Implying that the red cloud is safe because it's a green propellant is laughable. From Nitric Acid's safety data sheet:

Quote
Most important symptoms and effects, both acute and delayed:

Headache, shortness of breath, irritation/burns, all routes of exposure. May cause severe burns, blindness and/or permanent damage. May cause burns, deep penetrating ulcerations of the skin, delayed tissue destruction, redness, pain. May cause gastrointestinal irritation with nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea.

They say it's fine because they ran it looks worse than it is. Obviously, they shouldn't even be in a position that they should have to run to avoid the conditions mentioned above. Also, that's nominal operation. If they blew up their stage, no amount of running will help.

Quote from: Pythom
three key people were hiding in a pit behind 10 feet of solid gravel.

There's no pit. A haphazard pile of dirt is not solid. It's a mound at best. Ironically, being in a pit would have inhibited their ability to flee to safety.

Online CameronD

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #14 on: 04/11/2022 11:17 pm »
Personally, I think this picture shows their approach the best.  I believe the American term night be "redneck"??
« Last Edit: 04/11/2022 11:19 pm by CameronD »
With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine - however, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are
going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead.

Offline Nomadd

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #15 on: 04/12/2022 02:13 am »
 Big deal. My dad could do better than that on the barbeque grill.
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Offline Asteroza

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #16 on: 04/12/2022 02:13 am »
Personally, I think this picture shows their approach the best.  I believe the American term night be "redneck"??

Eh, seems more metal than redneck, though I think the modern all encompassing term in YOLO...

It certainly doesn't reek of space bros...

Offline FishInferno

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #17 on: 04/12/2022 03:10 am »
This "Zoom conference" on the 21st should be a fun circus to witness, especially if Berger and the other space reporters show up and tear them to pieces.

That being said, I don't expect them to go through with it.
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Offline John Santos

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #18 on: 04/12/2022 06:35 am »
Their "Pythom Hot Test Jan 12, 2021" video on Vimeo (which starts with a title card that says "PYTHOM Asterex 4.0 Rocket Engine Test Jan 12, 2020") is worthy of attention.  Is it just me, or is the countdown at 2:45... off nominal?

10... 9... 8... 7... 6... 5... 3 ??? ... 4 :o ... 2... 1...

I suppose I shouldn't be too harsh on someone just for getting some dates and numbers and stuff wrong.  I mean, it's not like it's rocket science.



Consulting the Book of Armaments 10:9 "One shall be the number of the counting and the number of the counting shall be one.  Thou shalt not count unto two unless thou thence proceedeth unto one.  Three is right out."


Offline meekGee

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Re: Pythom Space (But should be Monty Python)
« Reply #19 on: 04/12/2022 08:28 am »
Their "Pythom Hot Test Jan 12, 2021" video on Vimeo (which starts with a title card that says "PYTHOM Asterex 4.0 Rocket Engine Test Jan 12, 2020") is worthy of attention.  Is it just me, or is the countdown at 2:45... off nominal?

10... 9... 8... 7... 6... 5... 3 ??? ... 4 :o ... 2... 1...

I suppose I shouldn't be too harsh on someone just for getting some dates and numbers and stuff wrong.  I mean, it's not like it's rocket science.



Consulting the Book of Armaments 10:9 "One shall be the number of the counting and the number of the counting shall be one.  Thou shalt not count unto two unless thou thence proceedeth unto one.  Three is right out."
Bingo!
ABCD - Always Be Counting Down

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