Amazon Kuiper places largest commercial launch order with ULA, Arianespace, Blue

[edzieba]

Amazon have signed Kuiper launch contracts with ULA, Blue Origin, and Arianespace. A lot of launch contracts.
38 Vulcan launches, 18 Ariane 6 launches, and 12 New Glenn launches (with an option for an additional 15).

[hplan]

Amazon have signed Kuiper launch contracts with ULA, Blue Origin, and Arianespace. A lot of launch contracts.
38 Vulcan launches, 18 Ariane 6 launches, and 12 New Glenn launches (with an option for an additional 15).

It's odd that Amazon reports having contracted for 38 Vulcan launches when Tory Bruno reports that Vulcan has 35 contracted launches in total so far.

[jdon759]

Amazon have signed Kuiper launch contracts with ULA, Blue Origin, and Arianespace. A lot of launch contracts.
38 Vulcan launches, 18 Ariane 6 launches, and 12 New Glenn launches (with an option for an additional 15).

It's odd that Amazon reports having contracted for 38 Vulcan launches when Tory Bruno reports that Vulcan has 35 contracted launches in total so far.

It's logical - and chronologically consistent - to assume that the latest 38 launch contract was finalised after Tory reported the 35 launch number.

[edzieba]

Amazon have signed Kuiper launch contracts with ULA, Blue Origin, and Arianespace. A lot of launch contracts.
38 Vulcan launches, 18 Ariane 6 launches, and 12 New Glenn launches (with an option for an additional 15).

It's odd that Amazon reports having contracted for 38 Vulcan launches when Tory Bruno reports that Vulcan has 35 contracted launches in total so far.

Not really. Vulcan had 35 launches contracted before this contract was signed, and 73 (35 + 38) after it was signed.

[DanClemmensen]

Amazon have signed Kuiper launch contracts with ULA, Blue Origin, and Arianespace. A lot of launch contracts.
38 Vulcan launches, 18 Ariane 6 launches, and 12 New Glenn launches (with an option for an additional 15).

The article discusses competing against F9 but fails to mention Starship, which is scheduled to fly before any of the three Amazon picked. Starship might not work, but this is also true of the other three.
Comparing payload masses is subject to lots of uncertaincy so this is probably bad, but better than nothing. Using the payload masses from Wikipedia and picking the most capable launcher in each family, we get:
      38 Vulcan         *   27.2  t =   1033.6
      18 Ariane 6       *  21.7  t  =     390.6
      12 New Glenn   *  45     t  =     540
    total:                                         1964.6

If Starship gets to 150 t, this would take 13 Starship launches to replace these 68 launches (with options for another 4 or 5 to replace the optional 15 New Glenn launches).



 

[DreamyPickle]

This is a major industry-shifting event.

For a very long time lack of demand was cited as the reason for not investing in reuse but after this contract and sanctions against Russia we are actually seeing a shortage of launch capability.

Worth noting there were no wins for neutron despite the fact that it should become available in this timeframe.

Many people say that all the small-launch providers are just a bubble but with historic demand in the medium-lift sector we're likely to see even more investment. There is an opportunity for additional providers who can jump from small to medium rockets.

[matthewkantar]

Booking 68 launches on three untested rockets with never before flown booster engines is…exciting.

[Cheapchips]

Spending $5-8bn (at a guess) on launches is also quite exciting.

[abaddon]

Booking 68 launches on three untested rockets with never before flown booster engines is…exciting.

Seems much safer than booking them on one or two untested rockets.  Amazon has billions to burn and a hard deadline to get their constellation up.  The launch order sizes are also weighted in terms of both timeline and riskiness, with ULA being the soonest/most conservative choice, Ariane 6 being further out but also conservative, and New Glenn being furthest out and riskier.

I don't really consider Neutron not winning anything meaningful, as they are at least as far out/risky as New Glenn and of course Amazon isn't going to pick them over Blue's launcher.

It's good news, SpaceX is in great shape and now these new launchers won't need to suck completely off the government tap to be successful.  Nice to see Bezos's Billions doing something worthwhile for a change.

[Athelstane]

I don't really consider Neutron not winning anything meaningful, as they are at least as far out/risky as New Glenn and of course Amazon isn't going to pick them over Blue's launcher.

Amazon will have more shells to build out after this one, after all...

[Welsh Dragon]

Booking 68 launches on three untested rockets with never before flown booster engines is…exciting.

Ariane 6 uses the Vulcain 2.1, which is as I understand it is pretty much a Vulcain 2 (as flying on Ariane 5) tweaked for easier/cheaper production. It's already been qualified on the stand (source). Never before flown is technically correct, but I wouldn't but it in anywhere the same category as the BE4.

EDIT: Ah I suppose you might mean the P120C, but that's also been qualified already. But yes, also not flown before

[RedLineTrain]

Using the Ariane 64 for a LEO launch seems very expensive and inefficient.

[VaBlue]

Spending $5-8bn (at a guess) on launches is also quite exciting.

LOL!!  Amazon has ~$90B in cash to spend.  And that doesn't include Bezos' personal wealth.  He/they (Amazon) don't give a rats ass about spending ~$10B on some rockets.  No more than Musk cares about spending ~$3B on a twitter conniption (he's already made ~$1.5B on that transaction - in three days!).

The amount of cash these two men hold (not mention what Amazon, Apple, FB, etc, has) is obscene...

[libra]

Spending $5-8bn (at a guess) on launches is also quite exciting.

LOL!!  Amazon has ~$90B in cash to spend.  And that doesn't include Bezos' personal wealth.  He/they (Amazon) don't give a rats ass about spending ~$10B on some rockets.  No more than Musk cares about spending ~$3B on a twitter conniption (he's already made ~$1.5B on that transaction - in three days!).

The amount of cash these two men hold (not mention what Amazon, Apple, FB, etc, has) is obscene...

At $300 billion each, these two men have a wealth matching the GNP of many countries on this planet - and not all of them the poorest.

I readily agree this is kind of obscene - reminds me of that memorable scene of Breaking Bad where a baffled Skyler drags Walter White into a storage area where she piled up all those meth dollars she was unable to launder through their car wash - later estimated to $80 million.
Walt has to pile the dollars into seven barrels and bury them in the desert, and we all know how bad the whole thing ends.
When his original plans, remember, was to make "only" 737000 dollars to pay for his cancer health bills and secure his family future after his death.

[Star One]

Amazon have signed Kuiper launch contracts with ULA, Blue Origin, and Arianespace. A lot of launch contracts.
38 Vulcan launches, 18 Ariane 6 launches, and 12 New Glenn launches (with an option for an additional 15).

The article discusses competing against F9 but fails to mention Starship, which is scheduled to fly before any of the three Amazon picked. Starship might not work, but this is also true of the other three.
Comparing payload masses is subject to lots of uncertaincy so this is probably bad, but better than nothing. Using the payload masses from Wikipedia and picking the most capable launcher in each family, we get:
      38 Vulcan         *   27.2  t =   1033.6
      18 Ariane 6       *  21.7  t  =     390.6
      12 New Glenn   *  45     t  =     540
    total:                                         1964.6

If Starship gets to 150 t, this would take 13 Starship launches to replace these 68 launches (with options for another 4 or 5 to replace the optional 15 New Glenn launches).

I think the forum should bring in a sweepstakes to pick how quickly someone will mention Starship in a thread as a solution to a particular launch contract or in fact anything else.

[RedLineTrain]

Musk and Bezos didn't get to where they are now through overpaying for services.

[Star One]

Spending $5-8bn (at a guess) on launches is also quite exciting.

LOL!!  Amazon has ~$90B in cash to spend.  And that doesn't include Bezos' personal wealth.  He/they (Amazon) don't give a rats ass about spending ~$10B on some rockets.  No more than Musk cares about spending ~$3B on a twitter conniption (he's already made ~$1.5B on that transaction - in three days!).

The amount of cash these two men hold (not mention what Amazon, Apple, FB, etc, has) is obscene...

This is why Starship and its alleged launch costs aren’t even a factor here, as it just doesn’t matter. Timeline is more important driving factor than any extra launch cost they might occur by not using Space X.

[DanClemmensen]

Amazon have signed Kuiper launch contracts with ULA, Blue Origin, and Arianespace. A lot of launch contracts.
38 Vulcan launches, 18 Ariane 6 launches, and 12 New Glenn launches (with an option for an additional 15).

The article discusses competing against F9 but fails to mention Starship, which is scheduled to fly before any of the three Amazon picked. Starship might not work, but this is also true of the other three.
Comparing payload masses is subject to lots of uncertaincy so this is probably bad, but better than nothing. Using the payload masses from Wikipedia and picking the most capable launcher in each family, we get:
      38 Vulcan         *   27.2  t =   1033.6
      18 Ariane 6       *  21.7  t  =     390.6
      12 New Glenn   *  45     t  =     540
    total:                                         1964.6

If Starship gets to 150 t, this would take 13 Starship launches to replace these 68 launches (with options for another 4 or 5 to replace the optional 15 New Glenn launches).

I think the forum should bring in a sweepstakes to pick how quickly someone will mention Starship in a thread as a solution to a particular launch contract or in fact anything else.

In this specifc case, do you think New Glenn will fly before Starship? If Starship flies first, it is highly relevant to this particular thread, as opposed to being a universal panacea.

[russianhalo117]

Amazon have signed Kuiper launch contracts with ULA, Blue Origin, and Arianespace. A lot of launch contracts.
38 Vulcan launches, 18 Ariane 6 launches, and 12 New Glenn launches (with an option for an additional 15).

It's odd that Amazon reports having contracted for 38 Vulcan launches when Tory Bruno reports that Vulcan has 35 contracted launches in total so far.

35 (other customers) +38 (AWS: Kuiper) =73 (total)

[Star One]

Amazon have signed Kuiper launch contracts with ULA, Blue Origin, and Arianespace. A lot of launch contracts.
38 Vulcan launches, 18 Ariane 6 launches, and 12 New Glenn launches (with an option for an additional 15).

The article discusses competing against F9 but fails to mention Starship, which is scheduled to fly before any of the three Amazon picked. Starship might not work, but this is also true of the other three.
Comparing payload masses is subject to lots of uncertaincy so this is probably bad, but better than nothing. Using the payload masses from Wikipedia and picking the most capable launcher in each family, we get:
      38 Vulcan         *   27.2  t =   1033.6
      18 Ariane 6       *  21.7  t  =     390.6
      12 New Glenn   *  45     t  =     540
    total:                                         1964.6

If Starship gets to 150 t, this would take 13 Starship launches to replace these 68 launches (with options for another 4 or 5 to replace the optional 15 New Glenn launches).

I think the forum should bring in a sweepstakes to pick how quickly someone will mention Starship in a thread as a solution to a particular launch contract or in fact anything else.

In this specifc case, do you think New Glenn will fly before Starship? If Starship flies first, it is highly relevant to this particular thread, as opposed to being a universal panacea.

I think in this case as I’ve already said cost is utterly irrelevant so Starship is a non-factor. Plus Bezos was never going to put any work the way of a direct competitor in mega constellations.