SpaceX F9/Crew Dragon : Polaris Dawn : KSC LC-39A : NET Late August 2024

[Mongo62]

[hektor]

Isn't this mission essentially replacing the cancelled Space Adventures' free-flyer mission, which was originally planned for Mid 2022 and aimed to "break the world altitude record for private citizen spaceflight and see planet Earth the way no one has since the Gemini program".

Sounds like Inspiration4 to me...

[billh]

And the "Most Dismissive Award" for Clueless Media goes to the New York Times for the clickbait headline, "SpaceX Tourists Will Make Attempt at Spacewalk During Flight".

The characterization of Jared Isaacman and crew as tourists is less accurate here than for any previous commercial spaceflight. My own take is that Isaacman is so onboard with the future of spaceflight he has virtually partnered with SpaceX to help advance their capabilities. It's like a private commercial Gemini program. He is, in effect, subsidizing test missions for SpaceX. Of course he gets to go to space - and I'm sure that's a major motivation for him - but he is really doing it right. Raising funds for an Earth-bound cause, paying for other people to fly with him who couldn't afford it, and ensuring that each flight he takes benefits human spaceflight in ways beyond just the money SpaceX gets for the mission. I watched all the Inspiration 4 coverage and the documentaries. He is a very impressive young man. (I can call him that because I'm old!)

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/14/science/spacex-spacewalk-tourists.html

[envy887]

And the "Most Dismissive Award" for Clueless Media goes to the New York Times for the clickbait headline, "SpaceX Tourists Will Make Attempt at Spacewalk During Flight".

The characterization of Jared Isaacman and crew as tourists is less accurate here than for any previous commercial spaceflight. My own take is that Isaacman is so onboard with the future of spaceflight he has virtually partnered with SpaceX to help advance their capabilities. It's like a private commercial Gemini program. He is, in effect, subsidizing test missions for SpaceX. Of course he gets to go to space - and I'm sure that's a major motivation for him - but he is really doing it right. Raising funds for an Earth-bound cause, paying for other people to fly with him who couldn't afford it, and ensuring that each flight he takes benefits human spaceflight in ways beyond just the money SpaceX gets for the mission. I watched all the Inspiration 4 coverage and the documentaries. He is a very impressive young man. (I can call him that because I'm old!)

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/14/science/spacex-spacewalk-tourists.html

I agree. The "tourist" label does not apply here at all.

Gillis and Menon, as SpaceX personnel, are space industry professionals who are intensively involved in SpaceX's crew missions and certainly going to be in a professional capacity on this flight, working to improve future SpaceX missions.

Isaacman and Poteet are aviation professionals who are both well qualified to do flight testing, and are also flying in a professional capacity considering their roles in flight instruction development, with Inspiration4, and future Polaris missions.

[DigitalMan]

Just listen to the NSF and Everyday Astronaut interviews. Polaris is about buying down risk towards Moon/Mars missions, science and raising money for St. Judes global health program.

It is really astounding how clueless the New York Times is about Polaris.

I thought it was very interesting to hear about the implant Kidd is going to receive, I mean, doesn't that deserve at least a little reporting?

[kdhilliard]

And the "Most Dismissive Award" for Clueless Media goes to the New York Times for the clickbait headline, "SpaceX Tourists Will Make Attempt at Spacewalk During Flight".  ...
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/14/science/spacex-spacewalk-tourists.html

I agree. The "tourist" label does not apply here at all.  ...

What bothered me more than the "tourist" label was something it contained at the end from Sandy Magnus (retired NASA astronaut, former AIAA Executive Director, current member of Virgin Galactic's Space Advisory Board):

While the Federal Aviation Administration manages launch site safety, no agency on Earth oversees the safety of private endeavors such as SpaceX’s spacewalking plans. In 2004, Congress passed a moratorium on spaceflight regulations that has been extended most recently to 2023. That halt on safety rules, intended by lawmakers to allow the nascent space industry to innovate, requires space tourists to sign “informed consent” forms to affirm their awareness of the risks.

“We want the commercial industry to be successful,” Dr. Magnus said. “But we still have this gap in the U.S. oversight role, and where are we going to resolve that? How far along are we going to get before that gets fixed?”

I was surprised that she was advocating for additional governmental regulation.  Is that Virgin Galactic's official position as well?

In any case, it was strange to see it brought up in the context of Polaris Dawn.  I could understand such advocacy for regulation of suborbital adventure tourism amusement rides which are advertised as safe and routine, particularly as their participants' consent is unlikely to be anywhere nearly as fully informed as that from the crew of a mission like Polaris Dawn, which, as billh described, is more of a privately subsidized test and development flight.  When we do have our first fatality from a suborbital amusement ride, I hope the backlash of regulation doesn't sweep up the more extraordinary, boundary-pushing missions as well.

[tbellman]

So what are the key known details on the SpaceX EVA suit, and why exactly do some consider it to be inadequate for an EVA mission?

Would SpaceX really risk anyone's lives by using an inadequate suit, just to save on cost or just to look stylish?

I have not seen anyone claiming that it would not be safe, for the intended purpose.  It's just that it seems that the intended purpose is somewhat limited: allowing people to step outside of Dragon for a short while (probably somewhere between 15 and 60 minutes) to enjoy the view and the experience of floating alone in space.  What is doubted is the suit's utility beyond that purpose.  For example:

• It looks like this suit will not have a life-support pack of its own, but just a longer umbilical to provide the astronaut with oxygen, cooling, communication, et.c.  Perfectly fine for a half hour experience just outside of Dragon, but useless if you need to go more than a few meters from the egress hatch.

• If it's just an upgraded IVA suit, it will probably become like an inflated balloon, or a car tyre, making it hard and very tiresome to move your arms and legs, and even your fingers.  Again, perfectly fine for its intended purpose, but you would not want to work for several hours in it.

• It might have limited protection against micrometeorites, limiting how long it is safe to stay outside.  Not a problem for this mission, but limiting for other uses.

But actual details about the suit are scant at this time, so we really don't know what capabilities it will have.

There is a separate thread SpaceX EVA suit where this has been discussed.

[CuddlyRocket]

I should have said record for youngest American in orbit.

That's held by Hayley Arceneaux. Valentina Tereshkova holds the record for youngest woman in orbit. (You probably know this, but worth saying.)

[Oersted]

And the "Most Dismissive Award" for Clueless Media goes to the New York Times for the clickbait headline, "SpaceX Tourists Will Make Attempt at Spacewalk During Flight".

The characterization of Jared Isaacman and crew as tourists is less accurate here than for any previous commercial spaceflight. My own take is that Isaacman is so onboard with the future of spaceflight he has virtually partnered with SpaceX to help advance their capabilities. It's like a private commercial Gemini program. He is, in effect, subsidizing test missions for SpaceX. Of course he gets to go to space - and I'm sure that's a major motivation for him - but he is really doing it right. Raising funds for an Earth-bound cause, paying for other people to fly with him who couldn't afford it, and ensuring that each flight he takes benefits human spaceflight in ways beyond just the money SpaceX gets for the mission. I watched all the Inspiration 4 coverage and the documentaries. He is a very impressive young man. (I can call him that because I'm old!)

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/14/science/spacex-spacewalk-tourists.html

MSM in the US have decided to be mostly dismissive and snarky towards spaceflight and similar frontier-expanding exploration endeavours. Their primary take will be how bad the flight is for the environment and their interest in the participants will be mostly about skin colour and sexual orientation. I already envision MSM slamming the crew for not being diverse enough.

It is very disheartening to see what things have come to. So destructive.

[Robotbeat]

It’s amusing how people take “this mission is a stunt, nothing is real” as axiomatic instead of taking seriously claims by Jared and SpaceX that this is part of SpaceX’s ongoing efforts to prove out EVA suit capability ultimately with the goal of having an EVA suit suitable for Mars.

[kirghizstan]

What is the record for shortest time between space flights by an individual?

[ugordan]

It’s amusing how people take “this mission is a stunt, nothing is real” as axiomatic instead of taking seriously claims by Jared and SpaceX that this is part of SpaceX’s ongoing efforts to prove out EVA suit capability ultimately with the goal of having an EVA suit suitable for Mars.

People's takes you say?

[Star One]

And the "Most Dismissive Award" for Clueless Media goes to the New York Times for the clickbait headline, "SpaceX Tourists Will Make Attempt at Spacewalk During Flight".

The characterization of Jared Isaacman and crew as tourists is less accurate here than for any previous commercial spaceflight. My own take is that Isaacman is so onboard with the future of spaceflight he has virtually partnered with SpaceX to help advance their capabilities. It's like a private commercial Gemini program. He is, in effect, subsidizing test missions for SpaceX. Of course he gets to go to space - and I'm sure that's a major motivation for him - but he is really doing it right. Raising funds for an Earth-bound cause, paying for other people to fly with him who couldn't afford it, and ensuring that each flight he takes benefits human spaceflight in ways beyond just the money SpaceX gets for the mission. I watched all the Inspiration 4 coverage and the documentaries. He is a very impressive young man. (I can call him that because I'm old!)

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/14/science/spacex-spacewalk-tourists.html

MSM in the US have decided to be mostly dismissive and snarky towards spaceflight and similar frontier-expanding exploration endeavours. Their primary take will be how bad the flight is for the environment and their interest in the participants will be mostly about skin colour and sexual orientation. I already envision MSM slamming the crew for not being diverse enough.

It is very disheartening to see what things have come to. So destructive.

If you want to start complaining about what you see as the issues with the press in what appears to be a political sense take it to the space policy section and don’t start dragging this thread off course with such posts.

[Sam Ho]

What is the record for shortest time between space flights by an individual?

The entire 7-member crew of STS-83 flew again on STS-94 three months later.  If you use the USAF definition, Joe Engle flew X-15-3 to space six weeks apart.

[su27k]

What bothered me more than the "tourist" label was something it contained at the end from Sandy Magnus (retired NASA astronaut, former AIAA Executive Director, current member of Virgin Galactic's Space Advisory Board):

While the Federal Aviation Administration manages launch site safety, no agency on Earth oversees the safety of private endeavors such as SpaceX’s spacewalking plans. In 2004, Congress passed a moratorium on spaceflight regulations that has been extended most recently to 2023. That halt on safety rules, intended by lawmakers to allow the nascent space industry to innovate, requires space tourists to sign “informed consent” forms to affirm their awareness of the risks.

“We want the commercial industry to be successful,” Dr. Magnus said. “But we still have this gap in the U.S. oversight role, and where are we going to resolve that? How far along are we going to get before that gets fixed?”

She's a member of ASAP, I think that's why she's pro-regulation.

[FutureSpaceTourist]

[ThePonjaX]

• If it's just an upgraded IVA suit, it will probably become like an inflated balloon, or a car tyre, making it hard and very tiresome to move your arms and legs, and even your fingers.  Again, perfectly fine for its intended purpose, but you would not want to work for several hours in it.

On the Everyday Astronaut with Isaccman they say all the 4 members are going to use the suit with improved mobility and more capability on fingers movement so seems are not going to be inflated balloons.

[FutureSpaceTourist]

https://twitter.com/polarisprogram/status/1493955480053497867

The Polaris Dawn crew spent some time in Starbase ahead of their announcement and saw Starship on the orbital launch pad

[sanman]

I'm curious -- does anyone know how this set of upcoming missions was conceived? Were they purely Isaacman's idea, or were they conceived from discussions between himself and SpaceX, or what?

[Conexion Espacial]

https://twitter.com/PolarisProgram/status/1493971511849459712