Author Topic: SpaceX FH - Europa Clipper - KSC LC-39A - 14 October 2024 (16:06 UTC)  (Read 122840 times)

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Discussion Thread for Europa Clipper mission launch.

NSF Threads for Europa Clipper : Launch discussion / Space science (not launch)

https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-awards-launch-services-contract-for-the-europa-clipper-mission

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Jul 23, 2021
RELEASE 21-098

NASA Awards Launch Services Contract for the Europa Clipper Mission

NASA has selected Space Exploration Technologies Corp. (SpaceX) of Hawthorne, California, to provide launch services for Earth’s first mission to conduct detailed investigations of Jupiter's moon Europa.

The Europa Clipper mission will launch in October 2024 on a Falcon Heavy rocket from Launch Complex 39A at NASA’s Kennedy Space Center in Florida. The total contract award amount for launch services is approximately $178 million.

Europa Clipper will conduct a detailed survey of Europa and use a sophisticated suite of science instruments to investigate whether the icy moon has conditions suitable for life. Key mission objectives are to produce high-resolution images of Europa's surface, determine its composition, look for signs of recent or ongoing geological activity, measure the thickness of the moon’s icy shell, search for subsurface lakes, and determine the depth and salinity of Europa's ocean.

NASA’s Launch Services Program at Kennedy will manage the Europa Clipper launch service. NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Southern California leads the development of the Europa Clipper mission in partnership with the Johns Hopkins Applied Physics Laboratory in Laurel, Maryland, for NASA’s Science Mission Directorate in Washington. The Planetary Missions Program Office at NASA’s Marshall Space Flight Center in Huntsville, Alabama, executes program management of the Europa Clipper mission.

For more information about the Europa Clipper mission, visit:

https://europa.nasa.gov/

-end-

Monica Witt

Other SpaceX resources on NASASpaceflight:
   SpaceX News Articles (Recent)  /   SpaceX News Articles from 2006 (Including numerous exclusive Elon interviews)
   SpaceX Dragon Articles  /  SpaceX Missions Section (with Launch Manifest and info on past and future missions)
   L2 SpaceX Section
« Last Edit: 10/12/2024 03:33 am by Galactic Penguin SST »

Offline OnWithTheShow

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #1 on: 07/23/2021 08:24 pm »
Anyone know the expected mode for this launch? Center expended or fully expendable?

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #2 on: 07/23/2021 08:31 pm »
https://twitter.com/spacex/status/1418667693016711170

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NASA has selected Falcon Heavy to fly Europa Clipper! Launching in October 2024, this interplanetary mission will study whether Jupiter's icy moon Europa could have conditions suitable for life. go.nasa.gov/3iGmYKV

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #3 on: 07/23/2021 08:32 pm »
https://twitter.com/sciguyspace/status/1418666356619218946

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This is an absolute bargain. According to the White House OMB, launching on the Space Launch System rocket would have cost "over $2 billion." So SpaceX just saved the federal government $2 billion.

Edit to add:

https://twitter.com/brickmack/status/1418673761977442307

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OIG says the marginal cost of a block 1 SLS is 886 million. That doesn't include the billion a year in operating costs for the facilities it uses, or ongoing development work
« Last Edit: 07/23/2021 08:48 pm by FutureSpaceTourist »

Offline MATTBLAK

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #4 on: 07/23/2021 08:34 pm »
EDIT: I would like to congratulate NASA for doing the right thing. I would also like to thank those a year and more ago who told me (and others) we didn't know what we were talking about when we said this would go to Falcon Heavy. Forgive me: I rarely indulge in 'I-told-you-so's'... ;)
« Last Edit: 07/23/2021 11:44 pm by MATTBLAK »
"Those who can't, Blog".   'Space Cadets' of the World - Let us UNITE!! (crickets chirping)

Offline tbellman

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #5 on: 07/23/2021 09:05 pm »
https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-awards-launch-services-contract-for-the-europa-clipper-mission

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The total contract award amount for launch services is approximately $178 million.

Worth noting: in many (most?) cases, NASA announces the total launch cost, including internal NASA costs, but here they actually tells us the contract price.

Anyone know the expected mode for this launch? Center expended or fully expendable?

It should be a fully expended Falcon Heavy.  And that has been quoted as having a list price of $150M, so NASA is paying $28M above list, but that probably covers some mission-specific services.

Offline Bob Niland

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #6 on: 07/23/2021 09:27 pm »
tbellman: It should be a fully expended Falcon Heavy.

Is it to be an all-new FH, or to some degree flight-proven? (and that may not be known yet)
Working for SX could be exhilarating, as long as the job description doesn't include Master PERT Chart.

Offline TrevorMonty

Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #7 on: 07/23/2021 09:32 pm »
Costs aside SLS will be fully committed with Artemis, I doubt there would be vehicle to spare. That is assuming SLS maiden flights are nominal.

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Offline leovinus

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Offline DreamyPickle

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #9 on: 07/24/2021 09:44 am »
This is the first NASA flagship-class to be launched with SpaceX and also an amazing bargain.

Now that the contract is signed do we have definite information regarding trajectory and the presence of a kick stage?

Offline soltasto

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #10 on: 07/24/2021 09:59 am »
Now that the contract is signed do we have definite information regarding trajectory and the presence of a kick stage?

The RFP asked for a Mars-Earth gravity assist trajectory with 6065 kg to a 41.69 km2/s2 C3 requirement. Falcon Heavy expendable doesn't need a kick stage  for that.

Offline hopalong

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #11 on: 07/24/2021 01:08 pm »
Now that the contract is signed do we have definite information regarding trajectory and the presence of a kick stage?

The RFP asked for a Mars-Earth gravity assist trajectory with 6065 kg to a 41.69 km2/s2 C3 requirement. Falcon Heavy expendable doesn't need a kick stage  for that.

The NASA Launch Services Program website shows that the FH can launch 6400Kg to 41.7 km2/s2 fully expended.

So no kick stage required and I would expect that the figures given in the LSP website have a bit of sandbagging.

Also the FH expendable is the only launcher listed with the required performance, the Vulcan VC6 is >1,000kg short.

Offline Jim

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #12 on: 07/24/2021 01:58 pm »

So no kick stage required and I would expect that the figures given in the LSP website have a bit of sandbagging.


No sandbagging.  Those are contractual numbers.

Offline Jim

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #13 on: 07/24/2021 02:05 pm »
https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-awards-launch-services-contract-for-the-europa-clipper-mission

Quote
The total contract award amount for launch services is approximately $178 million.

Worth noting: in many (most?) cases, NASA announces the total launch cost, including internal NASA costs, but here they actually tells us the contract price.


Could be an error.

Offline envy887

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #14 on: 07/24/2021 03:21 pm »
This is the first NASA flagship-class to be launched with SpaceX and also an amazing bargain.

Now that the contract is signed do we have definite information regarding trajectory and the presence of a kick stage?

This is the second such mission. SpaceX is launching PACE on a Falcon 9 in late 2023.

Offline ugordan

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #15 on: 07/24/2021 03:50 pm »
This is the first NASA flagship-class to be launched with SpaceX and also an amazing bargain.

Now that the contract is signed do we have definite information regarding trajectory and the presence of a kick stage?

This is the second such mission. SpaceX is launching PACE on a Falcon 9 in late 2023.

True, but you also have to admit that this one has quite a bigger pucker factor attached to it. Clipper is over 4x more expensive, it's assigned to a vehicle that at the point of selection has only had 3 flights vs PACE's 27-ish Block 5s. 1 of those 3 FH flights wasn't a Block 5 and neither were flown in expendable mode this mission calls for.
« Last Edit: 07/24/2021 03:51 pm by ugordan »

Offline soltasto

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #16 on: 07/24/2021 08:15 pm »

So no kick stage required and I would expect that the figures given in the LSP website have a bit of sandbagging.


No sandbagging.  Those are contractual numbers.

If anyone feels confused about the difference in the numbers provided by the LSP and those provided on the SpaceX website, the numbers on the LSP website (and the numbers the LSP uses to select a LV) include, quoting the website, "3-sigma guidance reserves" and also the fact that "Payload mass greater than 10,000 kg (22,046 lbm) may require mission-unique adapter/accommodations, resulting in cost and/or performance impacts" while the numbers on the SpaceX website likely don't account for such things and are more "best case" numbers.

Maybe Jim can confirm.

Offline wannamoonbase

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #17 on: 07/24/2021 08:22 pm »
Congratulations SpaceX, flying a premium mission on what is visually the most exciting vehicle flying is a big win.

FH doesn’t fly often but it’s building a nice backlog.
Starship, Vulcan and Ariane 6 have all reached orbit.  New Glenn, well we are waiting!

Offline rpapo

Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #18 on: 07/24/2021 10:42 pm »
This is the first NASA flagship-class to be launched with SpaceX and also an amazing bargain.

Now that the contract is signed do we have definite information regarding trajectory and the presence of a kick stage?

This is the second such mission. SpaceX is launching PACE on a Falcon 9 in late 2023.

True, but you also have to admit that this one has quite a bigger pucker factor attached to it. Clipper is over 4x more expensive, it's assigned to a vehicle that at the point of selection has only had 3 flights vs PACE's 27-ish Block 5s. 1 of those 3 FH flights wasn't a Block 5 and neither were flown in expendable mode this mission calls for.
By the time this flight goes up, I believe there will have been at least 2-3 more FH launches already.
Following the space program since before Apollo 8.

Offline LouScheffer

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Re: SpaceX FH / Europa Clipper - LC-39A - Oct 2024
« Reply #19 on: 07/24/2021 11:44 pm »
So no kick stage required and I would expect that the figures given in the LSP website have a bit of sandbagging.
No sandbagging.  Those are contractual numbers.
Whether you call it sandbagging or something else, it's clear the numbers on LSP are less than the rocket can do, in at least some cases.  Consider JUNO, for example.  Juno massed 3625 kg, and Atlas 551 provided a C3 of 31.1 km^2/sec^2 .  But LSP gives 3270 kg as the max Atlas payload to this C3.  So Atlas, in practice, delivered 10.8% more than what the LSP shows.
« Last Edit: 07/25/2021 12:18 am by LouScheffer »

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