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#920
by
Slothman
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:18
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Gentlemen, please: the OLIT has stairs. Even if whatever falling doodad prevents use of the elevator, do you really think there are no SpaceXers willing to risk thigh chafing to perform any tasks out of manlift reach in order to avoid a delay?
It's not the grunt's willingness to grind that matters, it's the willingness of the company to let this go uninvestigated until the conclusion of the flight test or their willingness to get this i vestigated and cleared out before continuing to use stage 0.
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#921
by
kevinof
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:25
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Gentlemen, please: the OLIT has stairs. Even if whatever falling doodad prevents use of the elevator, do you really think there are no SpaceXers willing to risk thigh chafing to perform any tasks out of manlift reach in order to avoid a delay?
It's not the grunt's willingness to grind that matters, it's the willingness of the company to let this go uninvestigated until the conclusion of the flight test or their willingness to get this i vestigated and cleared out before continuing to use stage 0.
You’ve obviously never worked in construction or health and safety. If there was no injuries then all SpaceX have to do is cease using that piece of equipment and carry out their own investigation, add remedial measures and fix. It shouldn’t prevent anything else from going ahead. That’s assuming nobody was injured and there is no further risk of injury.
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#922
by
jon.amos
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:26
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Pure speculation but those sparks look electrical to me. Could someone have lost control of or otherwise caused a running genset used for weldinng to fall? We know they are welding at height and local generator makes more sense than permanently installed power to support.
It does? On a tower that size with that many already-existing high-power devices (winches, hydraulics, and so on), it makes more sense to me to put outlets everywhere for this sort of thing (i.e. 480V three-phase 100A Hubbells or similar). Where I work, we have them all over the place, including on towers way smaller than this one.
I wouldn't want to leave power in places not routinely accessed. The power on the tower has got to be protected a bit more that a standard industrial outlet. And those outlets would need to be marine grade due to location. Most of those that i am familiar with are plastic, I don't know how they stand up in that acoustic environment. This was speculation so I am likely entirely wrong.
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#923
by
matthewkantar
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:38
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And there it is. Wonder if it was the elevator. Launch ain't happening this week. 
Best to cancel the whole program, butter fingers company obviously not going to hunt.
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#924
by
dnavas
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:44
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If there was no injuries
From your lips to God's ears, as they say.
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#925
by
sferrin
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:45
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And there it is. Wonder if it was the elevator. Launch ain't happening this week.
Best to cancel the whole program, butter fingers company obviously not going to hunt.
No but they will have to do a bunch of inspections to make sure nothing propellant, electrical, or hydraulic related was damaged. Kind of important, no?
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#926
by
Tywin
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:48
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That's just confusion over whether th 'trajectory' skims the top of the atmosphere or not. It is orbital velocity but the low point is in the atmosphere - as explained multiple times here and elsewhere.
Nope. The perigee of a "nearly orbital trajectory" is not in the atmosphere but below sea level.
The confusion was caused by SpaceX calling it an "Orbital Flight Test". But they have stopped doing so - it now is just the "Starship Flight Test" on the SpaceX website and on the mission patch.
You are right...
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#927
by
Tywin
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:52
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Doesn’t sound or look great:
Wonderful. Now OSHA will shut it down for three weeks for an "investigation".
Do you prefer a fatal accident or injury?
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#928
by
Tywin
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:53
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Discussion about suborbital/orbital or not first need to decide on the definition of orbital as there is not one that is obvious and universally used.
Some candidates:
Specific energy >= -μ/2R (lowest circular orbit above the surface).
Specific energy >= -μ/2r for some r>R.
Perigee above surface.
Perigee above some height h.
r and h could be 50 km, 80 km, 100 km or some spacecraft dependent value guaranteeing more than a full orbit is possible.
Then I can say that New Shepard is orbital?
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#929
by
Tywin
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:54
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And there it is. Wonder if it was the elevator. Launch ain't happening this week.
Safety FIRST!!!
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#930
by
FutureSpaceTourist
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:56
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twitter.com/id_aa_carmack/status/1647284789869969409
I still get nervous even for other people’s rocket launches. The knowledge that all your work could go up in a giant explosion is a special kind of frisson.
But for everyone that has ever drawn a spark of inspiration from visions of humanity expanding into space:This is the Way.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1647297173157978112I still have launch PTSD from early Falcon days. My limbic system twists my guts into a knot as we get closer to launch.
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#931
by
Slothman
on 15 Apr, 2023 17:57
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Gentlemen, please: the OLIT has stairs. Even if whatever falling doodad prevents use of the elevator, do you really think there are no SpaceXers willing to risk thigh chafing to perform any tasks out of manlift reach in order to avoid a delay?
It's not the grunt's willingness to grind that matters, it's the willingness of the company to let this go uninvestigated until the conclusion of the flight test or their willingness to get this i vestigated and cleared out before continuing to use stage 0.
You’ve obviously never worked in construction or health and safety. If there was no injuries then all SpaceX have to do is cease using that piece of equipment and carry out their own investigation, add remedial measures and fix. It shouldn’t prevent anything else from going ahead. That’s assuming nobody was injured and there is no further risk of injury.
That's what I'm saying. What they *have* to do doesn't necessarily match with what they want to do or should do considering all eyes on them.
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#932
by
Tywin
on 15 Apr, 2023 18:00
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Doesn’t sound or look great:
Wonderful. Now OSHA will shut it down for three weeks for an "investigation".
Please stop with your conspiracy theories.
Sorry if reality triggered you. No way anybody is just going to crack a beer and give a thumbs up for Monday after something like that.
ERGGGG?
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#933
by
Tywin
on 15 Apr, 2023 18:04
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Gentlemen, please: the OLIT has stairs. Even if whatever falling doodad prevents use of the elevator, do you really think there are no SpaceXers willing to risk thigh chafing to perform any tasks out of manlift reach in order to avoid a delay?
It's not the grunt's willingness to grind that matters, it's the willingness of the company to let this go uninvestigated until the conclusion of the flight test or their willingness to get this i vestigated and cleared out before continuing to use stage 0.
Exactly
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#934
by
sferrin
on 15 Apr, 2023 18:27
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Doesn’t sound or look great:
Wonderful. Now OSHA will shut it down for three weeks for an "investigation".
Do you prefer a fatal accident or injury?
How'd you get that from my statement?
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#935
by
Tywin
on 15 Apr, 2023 18:29
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Doesn’t sound or look great:
Wonderful. Now OSHA will shut it down for three weeks for an "investigation".
Do you prefer a fatal accident or injury?
How'd you get that from my statement?
Because, OSHA exists for a very clear reason...
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#936
by
Lee Jay
on 15 Apr, 2023 18:32
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Gentlemen, please: the OLIT has stairs. Even if whatever falling doodad prevents use of the elevator, do you really think there are no SpaceXers willing to risk thigh chafing to perform any tasks out of manlift reach in order to avoid a delay?
I work with wind energy. The tallest tower I've climbed is 80 meters (I've gone up 135m in a basket). It's a workout, for sure, but what you do is plan the trip up to be once up to get a job done, and never plan more than 2 trips up per day (ideally, not more than one a day). It's doable, but it's unpleasant. Where it becomes not doable is if you need heavy stuff to come up with you and your cargo lifting device is broken. Even that 80m tower I climbed had a winch-driven cargo basket.
If SpaceX personnel need to go up, they can go. If they need to take heavy stuff with them, the elevator is the way to go. If they don't have it or at least some sort of cargo lifting device, that could well be a show-stopper until they can fix what's broken or rig a temporary solution for lifting heavy stuff inside the tower.
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#937
by
pedz
on 15 Apr, 2023 18:38
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More questions about the "Starbase Launch Keep Out Zone": Is Highway 4 closed before or after the border patrol check point? The diagram has two "Check Point". One is next to Richardson Avenue. Is it possible for me to get at that point with my cameras? Is it possible to see the launch pad from that point?
That point is only 4 miles away rather than 6 miles which is the distance from Port Isabel. But, you would be shooting straight into the rising sun -- although that could look cool if done properly.
As I recall, there is still a lot of scrub at that point and you can't actually see the launch site except whatever pokes out above the scrub.
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#938
by
Jimmy_C
on 15 Apr, 2023 19:46
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Sheriffs are closing the road around the launch site for potential Ship 24 stacking.
https://twitter.com/VickiCocks15/status/1647306355395510272
Referring to the above: Because Starship is being stacked with presumably explosive ordnance installed for the FTS, I suspect they are planning to proceed with the launch in the near future in spite of whatever happened on the tower. However I could be wrong.
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#939
by
Slothman
on 15 Apr, 2023 19:46
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More questions about the "Starbase Launch Keep Out Zone": Is Highway 4 closed before or after the border patrol check point? The diagram has two "Check Point". One is next to Richardson Avenue. Is it possible for me to get at that point with my cameras? Is it possible to see the launch pad from that point?
That point is only 4 miles away rather than 6 miles which is the distance from Port Isabel. But, you would be shooting straight into the rising sun -- although that could look cool if done properly.
As I recall, there is still a lot of scrub at that point and you can't actually see the launch site except whatever pokes out above the scrub.
As far as I'm aware, general public has to stay out of the outer checkpoint (and will be escorted if found between outer and inner checkpoint) while spacex personnel is allowed between the checkpoints, but nobody past the inner checkpoint(Eichorn Blvd.?) Tim dodd's boca chica visiting guide had some mention of that
