Author Topic: SpaceX Starship : First Flight : Starbase, TX : 20 April 2023 - DISCUSSION  (Read 532590 times)

Offline JayWee

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I've tried to fiddle with Google Earth to get similar view as in the SuperHeavy catch profile and it looks like it's going to stage around 150km downrange. Isn't that very very early? A partial fuel load?
From the picture, I personally estimate a stagging downrange to be around 60 km and a maximum RTLS downrange less than 150 km. This is quite a bit more than for the Falcon 9, which usually has a RTLS stagging downrange around 40 km and a maximum RTLS downrange around 80 km (according to my own simulations and according to https://flightclub.io/ simulations).
Duh, thanks. For some reason I was thinking of the ASDS barge location when thinking about it. So it's not that different after all.

Offline SPKirsch

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Cross-post:
SpaceX filed an extension for the Starship first launch (the previous permit expires Sept. 1).
1230-EX-ST-2022

New operation end date: March 1, 2023
« Last Edit: 07/20/2022 05:46 pm by SPKirsch »

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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https://twitter.com/infographictony/status/1559175094907604994

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“We are so close” here’s my (unofficial) infographic detailing what to expect from the 1st flight of @SpaceX’s fully stacked #starship. Stay up-to-date with changes I may need to make as we approach the imminent launch. Thanks to @LunarCaveman for helping me fine tune the details

Offline darkenfast

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Nice work, Tony! Spotted a minor typo: Paragraph labelled "Boostback burn" has the Booster peaking at over 20km. Should that be 200?
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Offline kdhilliard

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Nice work, Tony! Spotted a minor typo: Paragraph labelled "Boostback burn" has the Booster peaking at over 20km. Should that be 200?
20km is certainly too low, but 200km seems too high, at least compared to what we've seen with Falcon 9 boosters.
Have we ever seen any numbers on the subject from SpaceX?
We do have a 3D booster trajectory on pg. 3 of this FCC exhibit.  Perhaps it would be possible to recreate the Google Earth angle and magnification and extract something from that plot.

Offline OneSpeed

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Nice work, Tony! Spotted a minor typo: Paragraph labelled "Boostback burn" has the Booster peaking at over 20km. Should that be 200?
20km is certainly too low, but 200km seems too high, at least compared to what we've seen with Falcon 9 boosters.
Have we ever seen any numbers on the subject from SpaceX?
We do have a 3D booster trajectory on pg. 3 of this FCC exhibit.  Perhaps it would be possible to recreate the Google Earth angle and magnification and extract something from that plot.

It is possible.

A separate nit, the second engine start (SES) appears only to light the vacuum Raptors, which have no gimbal. This is unlikely from a control authority perspective, as well as increasing gravity losses.
« Last Edit: 08/16/2022 05:07 am by OneSpeed »

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Latest on flight timing and likely booster, from Elon yesterday:

twitter.com/yasin_shafiei/status/1572562946387218438

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Hi Elon. Can you please give us some updates about orbital flight date? I can’t wait to see this launch 😀

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1572563987258290177

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Late next month maybe, but November seems highly likely. We will have two boosters & ships ready for orbital flight by then, with full stack production at roughly one every two months.

twitter.com/bnordhaug/status/1572564338577379328

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So booster 7 will be first to fly? (hopefully)

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1572564908381999105

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That’s the plan. We’re taking a little  risk there, as engine isolation was done as retrofit, so not as good as on Booster 9.

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Crosspost, NASA’s latest view:

https://twitter.com/sciguyspace/status/1587100031999676416

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Right now the schedule would lead to "an early December" launch of Starship and Super Heavy. NASA's Mark Kirasich said he does not believe SpaceX will attempt to recover the Super Heavy first stage on that test flight.

Offline alugobi

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I think December is pretty ambitious.

Online ZachS09

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I think December is pretty ambitious.

Maybe launch it on the two-year anniversary of SN8?
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Offline Oersted

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Or on the anniversary of their first landed booster.... - I am pretty sure SpaceX thinks of December as a particularly good month for groundbreaking launches.

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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twitter.com/sciguyspace/status/1600906851943579649

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Based on a couple of conversations, I think SpaceX has a reasonable chance of making Starship's orbital launch during the first quarter of 2023. No guarantees, and there still is a lot of work to do. But they're making progress.

https://twitter.com/sciguyspace/status/1600907257365106690

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One thing I would note: SpaceX has moved on the from the "cowboy" phase of development in South Texas, when there was a higher tolerance of risk and failure during Starship prototype testing. With the expensive launch tower, they taking more time to increase chances of success.

Offline aero

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Well that and the simple fact that the upcoming orbital flight had better be a success. They are taking the extra time to assure themselves of probable success. The last little bits take time anyway.
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Offline DanClemmensen

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Well that and the simple fact that the upcoming orbital flight had better be a success. They are taking the extra time to assure themselves of probable success. The last little bits take time anyway.
I don't see that. I think they need a high probability of a non-destructive launch. A post-launch failure that does not damage the launch site would not be a big problem. It's still a problem, of course, because they only have 5 launches per year.

Offline alugobi

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If they can clear the pad on that first launch, and get it out over the water, then I think they'll declare victory.  Everything else will be gravy after that.

Online ZachS09

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If they can clear the pad on that first launch, and get it out over the water, then I think they'll declare victory.  Everything else will be gravy after that.

But this an orbital test flight, not a pad clearance test flight. I can’t see orbit insertion being a bonus because that’s the primary mission goal.

However, I agree that the landing phases of both Super Heavy and Starship are bonuses.
Liftoff for St. Jude's! Go Dragon, Go Falcon, Godspeed Inspiration4!

Offline Vahe231991

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From Ars Technica:
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Starship orbital launch will slip into 2023. SpaceX has not said anything official, but based on a couple of conversations, I think SpaceX has a reasonable chance of making Starship's orbital launch during the first quarter of 2023. There are no guarantees, and there still is a lot of work to do. But the company is making progress. I can say for certain that an orbital launch attempt this year is off the table.

Protect the tower, please ... Another thing I would note is that SpaceX has moved on from the "cowboy" phase of rocketry development in South Texas, when there was a higher tolerance of risk and failure during Starship prototype testing in 2021. This means the company is moving more slowly and deliberately. With the expensive launch tower, in particular, it is taking more time to increase its chances of success with the first launch of the Super Heavy booster and its Starship upper stage.

Online zubenelgenubi

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Cross-post:
latest NET date for Starship appears to be January 20.
2044-EX-ST-2022
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Online FutureSpaceTourist

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https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1611931024514060289

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We have a real shot at late February.  March launch attempt appears highly likely.

Offline Vahe231991

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Cross-post:
latest NET date for Starship appears to be January 20.
2044-EX-ST-2022
January 20 is merely the start date of the requested period of operation, which according to the cited document ends July 20.

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