Author Topic: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion  (Read 21488 times)

Offline Lar

  • Fan boy at large
  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13469
  • Saw Gemini live on TV
  • A large LEGO storage facility ... in Michigan
  • Liked: 11869
  • Likes Given: 11116
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #20 on: 12/16/2021 08:02 pm »
The issue with a "no A-hole" rule is that it might need to be applied to Elon himself.

(I love him madly but recognise he has some serious flaws)
"I think it would be great to be born on Earth and to die on Mars. Just hopefully not at the point of impact." -Elon Musk
"We're a little bit like the dog who caught the bus" - Musk after CRS-8 S1 successfully landed on ASDS OCISLY

Offline eeergo

Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #21 on: 12/16/2021 08:20 pm »
Absolutely zero tolerance for nonsense. Stay on a narrow topic or this thread will be locked.

I agree there was some nonsense on this thread, including my response to it. Now only positive-spin comments remain though (except Lar's above, hat tip).

There are literally three pages of discussion, written within 2 days, in the already-moderated thread on Blue Origin's recent similar case, which I pointed out in relation to the attitude in this one: https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=53979.875 , including overt black-on-white statements about wanting the company to fail, and how the behavior set BO apart from SpaceX in obvious ways, going as far as upper management needing to go away. Not sure why pointing out the evident dissonance is either off-topic or "nonsense".
-DaviD-

Online Robotbeat

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 39364
  • Minnesota
  • Liked: 25393
  • Likes Given: 12165
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #22 on: 12/16/2021 08:37 pm »
That’s in part because the situations were, in fact, handled differently at SpaceX and Blue.

(Which isn’t to say there weren’t some over the top comments there.)
« Last Edit: 12/16/2021 08:38 pm by Robotbeat »
Chris  Whoever loves correction loves knowledge, but he who hates reproof is stupid.

To the maximum extent practicable, the Federal Government shall plan missions to accommodate the space transportation services capabilities of United States commercial providers. US law http://goo.gl/YZYNt0

Offline D_Dom

  • Global Moderator
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 659
  • Liked: 487
  • Likes Given: 152
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #23 on: 12/16/2021 08:59 pm »
Not sure why pointing out the evident dissonance is either off-topic or "nonsense".

Keep in mind that Chris locked the topic you mentioned after "banning" some members. My particular moderation style is less diplomatic, I tend to delete posts wholesale. Including future posts that quote from less than excellent material.

I like your use of "evident dissonance", trying to wrap my mind around where it lands on the signal to noise scale...
Space is not merely a matter of life or death, it is considerably more important than that!

Online Barley

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1075
  • Liked: 739
  • Likes Given: 409
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #24 on: 12/16/2021 09:49 pm »
but that making work suck for half the human population compromises the mission. ...

And it’s worth mentioning that a lot of these young, neurodivergent guys who work at SpaceX probably aren’t very skilled at social interaction or reading non-verbal queues.
It makes work suck for a good deal more than half the human population.  And it's not really the neurodivergent guys that cause the problem.  They are just skilled enough to follow the patterns set by presidents, governors, athletes, police officers and other role models.  The neurodivergents just can't be as sly about it.  But they can be taught not to hold business meetings in Hooters, something frat bro's never seem to learn.


Offline Pheogh

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 989
  • Liked: 155
  • Likes Given: 39
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #25 on: 12/16/2021 10:24 pm »
Having experienced a similar situation first hand. The part that troubles me about this the most is that when these kinds of harassment issues happen at any company. The calculus is that Creep 1 did an inexcusable and terrible thing. Creep 1 looks like this, acts like this, has these interests. Therefore anyone that looks like Creep 1, has the same interests as Creep 1, must therefore be someone who eventually will act and do the terrible things that Creep 1 does. Therefore with that assumption, the whole company must be Creeps.

Offline su27k

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6414
  • Liked: 9104
  • Likes Given: 885
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #26 on: 12/19/2021 12:19 pm »
SpaceX vs. the world

Quote from: SpaceNews Magazine
Perhaps Elon Musk decided his appearance before the National Academies needed an X factor. When it was time for the SpaceX founder and chief executive to speak at a virtual meeting of the Space Studies Board and Board on Physics and Astronomy on Nov. 17, he appeared on the screen with his youngest son, X (short for X AE A-XII), sitting on his lap. Musk said nothing about why his son was with him, immediately launching a video about SpaceX’s Starship.

<snip>

The lack of sharply critical questions, about Starship or SpaceX, suggests Musk won over the committees. SpaceX has legions of fans worldwide cheering every minor development. And yet, at times, it can seem like the whole world is taking on SpaceX as the company expands from launch vehicles to satellite broadband to lunar landers.

Offline Lar

  • Fan boy at large
  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13469
  • Saw Gemini live on TV
  • A large LEGO storage facility ... in Michigan
  • Liked: 11869
  • Likes Given: 11116
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #27 on: 12/19/2021 01:42 pm »
Having experienced a similar situation first hand. The part that troubles me about this the most is that when these kinds of harassment issues happen at any company. The calculus is that Creep 1 did an inexcusable and terrible thing. Creep 1 looks like this, acts like this, has these interests. Therefore anyone that looks like Creep 1, has the same interests as Creep 1, must therefore be someone who eventually will act and do the terrible things that Creep 1 does. Therefore with that assumption, the whole company must be Creeps.

Which is why I think a culture that "owns" issues and institutes remedial action after investigation justifies it is superior to a culture that papers over things or stonewalls.  With Ms. Shotwell on the job I have a fairly high confidence that this will get rooted out and ameliorated. Not solved for good, new situations will arise, of course.

And I think that ties into the "compare and contrast" with Blue...  Nothing is black or white but they seemed to be a bit farther in the direction of "paper over" and less "own and fix".  This isn't a thread for Blue bashing but drawing a comparision is valid.

We know Elon can be a prat, but fortunately there are adults at SpaceX he heeds.
"I think it would be great to be born on Earth and to die on Mars. Just hopefully not at the point of impact." -Elon Musk
"We're a little bit like the dog who caught the bus" - Musk after CRS-8 S1 successfully landed on ASDS OCISLY

Online M.E.T.

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2382
  • Liked: 3010
  • Likes Given: 522
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #28 on: 12/19/2021 01:55 pm »
Having experienced a similar situation first hand. The part that troubles me about this the most is that when these kinds of harassment issues happen at any company. The calculus is that Creep 1 did an inexcusable and terrible thing. Creep 1 looks like this, acts like this, has these interests. Therefore anyone that looks like Creep 1, has the same interests as Creep 1, must therefore be someone who eventually will act and do the terrible things that Creep 1 does. Therefore with that assumption, the whole company must be Creeps.

Which is why I think a culture that "owns" issues and institutes remedial action after investigation justifies it is superior to a culture that papers over things or stonewalls.  With Ms. Shotwell on the job I have a fairly high confidence that this will get rooted out and ameliorated. Not solved for good, new situations will arise, of course.

And I think that ties into the "compare and contrast" with Blue...  Nothing is black or white but they seemed to be a bit farther in the direction of "paper over" and less "own and fix".  This isn't a thread for Blue bashing but drawing a comparision is valid.

We know Elon can be a prat, but fortunately there are adults at SpaceX he heeds.

I dislike and disagree with the perfunctionary obligation to disparage Elon before one can praise SpaceX’s achievements. Almost like you have to prove your bona fides by joining the anti-Elon chorus in order to get your opinion taken seriously.

Elon has not accomplished all he has DESPITE his personality. He has achieved it BECAUSE of his personality.

And anyway, you cannot know what either Gwynne or Elon truly thinks or knows about this case. All we have seen is a one sided report from an activist organisation. 

Most likely Gwynne and Elon are of completely like mind about the issue.


Edit

And I would point people back to CEO satisfaction surveys from just a few months ago to get a sense of the culture at SpaceX. Around 90% approval rating, if I recall.
« Last Edit: 12/19/2021 02:05 pm by M.E.T. »

Offline Lar

  • Fan boy at large
  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13469
  • Saw Gemini live on TV
  • A large LEGO storage facility ... in Michigan
  • Liked: 11869
  • Likes Given: 11116
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #29 on: 12/19/2021 08:50 pm »
I don't point out that Elon can be a prat to genuflect in anyone's general direction, I point it out because he is. And I am not alleging that Elon IS or ISN'T of the same mind as Gwynne, I am just predicting her stance based on what she already said.
"I think it would be great to be born on Earth and to die on Mars. Just hopefully not at the point of impact." -Elon Musk
"We're a little bit like the dog who caught the bus" - Musk after CRS-8 S1 successfully landed on ASDS OCISLY

Offline Welsh Dragon

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 674
  • Liked: 1053
  • Likes Given: 116
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #30 on: 12/19/2021 10:25 pm »
Of course Elon is a prat. He's just a very competent prat in some areas, and hired well to help in others. And the cult of personality at SpaceX helps too.

Offline su27k

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6414
  • Liked: 9104
  • Likes Given: 885
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #31 on: 12/20/2021 03:39 am »
https://twitter.com/waynehale/status/1472700490903339014

Quote
Congratulations to SpaceX on the remarkable feat of launching two Falcons to orbit in a single day and recovering both boosters. It’s not easy but SpaceX is making it look that way. Another Falcon is ready to launch in the 21st if the weather cooperates. Remarkable organization!

Offline su27k

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6414
  • Liked: 9104
  • Likes Given: 885
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #32 on: 01/12/2022 02:31 am »
https://twitter.com/aiaa/status/1478101376702070799

Quote
Congratulations to William Gerstenmaier of @SpaceX,  recipient of the 2022 Durand Lectureship for Public Service!
https://virtualscitech.aiaa.org/page/awards

Offline su27k

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6414
  • Liked: 9104
  • Likes Given: 885
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #33 on: 03/10/2022 02:46 am »
https://twitter.com/Gillis_SarahE/status/1501345978841923584

Quote
Pretty jazzed up about getting to work with all of the seriously badass women at @SpaceX! #InternationalWomensDay

Offline su27k

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6414
  • Liked: 9104
  • Likes Given: 885
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #34 on: 05/17/2022 04:12 am »
https://twitter.com/SciGuySpace/status/1526189266627330048

Quote
SpaceX is now about 85 percent vertically integrated, sources say. This is not entirely by choice, but as supply chain problems have arisen the company has reevaluated work that had previously been out-sourced, and brought some of it in-house.

Offline zubenelgenubi

  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11970
  • Arc to Arcturus, then Spike to Spica
  • Sometimes it feels like Trantor in the time of Hari Seldon
  • Liked: 7986
  • Likes Given: 77945
Re: SpaceX Corporate / Culture Discussion
« Reply #35 on: 05/20/2022 07:18 am »
Moderator:
"Elon-gate" sexual harassment claim notice and subsequent discussion moved off the member-accessible forum, pending decision if it is appropriate on this forum.

Noting that the sourcing is questionable.
Support your local planetarium! (COVID-panic and forward: Now more than ever.) My current avatar is saying "i wants to go uppies!" Yes, there are God-given rights. Do you wish to gainsay the Declaration of Independence?

Tags:
 

Advertisement NovaTech
Advertisement Northrop Grumman
Advertisement
Advertisement Margaritaville Beach Resort South Padre Island
Advertisement Brady Kenniston
Advertisement NextSpaceflight
Advertisement Nathan Barker Photography
1