Author Topic: Starlink : Markets and Marketing  (Read 346161 times)

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1120 on: 06/18/2024 03:50 pm »
Here's a short note from Kazakhstan about Starlink being installed in 2,000 schools by the end of 2024.  The Minister of Digital Development, Innovations, and Aerospace Industry also noted that...
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“We anticipate that approximately 2,000 schools will have received a Starlink terminal by the end of the year. We are in discussions with Starlink to integrate the necessary infrastructure so that we can launch this technology to the masses," the minister noted.
I take that to mean that Starlink will be required to service Kazakhstan via local gateways before launching wide.  This seems to be a requirement in India as well.  In any event, the details on these requirements matter and I don't assume that we will have perfect visibility into them.

https://en.inform.kz/news/around-2000-schools-to-be-connected-to-starlink-internet-in-kazakhstan-by-late-2024-b991f5/
« Last Edit: 06/18/2024 03:51 pm by RedLineTrain »

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1121 on: 06/19/2024 04:41 pm »
Indonesian ISPs are giving full-throated criticism of Starlink.  One of the main sticking points is that SpaceX is not investing much in Indonesia.  This criticism is of course one-sided, as I'm sure that SpaceX would love to have and is planning to have many ground stations.

This article notes that Starlink is high priced compared to competitors.  My expectation is that Starlink is taking the ISPs' most profitable customers.

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The Indonesia Internet Service Provider Association called on the government last month to freeze Starlink's license to sell services to consumers, with Chairman Muhammad Arif Angga saying the suspension should last "until a clear regulation is implemented."

Arif said an overreliance on foreign internet service providers has "the potential to disrupt the sustainability and independence of the local ISP industry."

https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Telecommunication/Elon-Musk-s-Starlink-under-fire-from-Indonesian-telecom-sector
« Last Edit: 06/19/2024 04:42 pm by RedLineTrain »

Offline Rebel44

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1122 on: 06/19/2024 09:16 pm »
Indonesian ISPs are giving full-throated criticism of Starlink.  One of the main sticking points is that SpaceX is not investing much in Indonesia.  This criticism is of course one-sided, as I'm sure that SpaceX would love to have and is planning to have many ground stations.

This article notes that Starlink is high priced compared to competitors.  My expectation is that Starlink is taking the ISPs' most profitable customers.

Quote
The Indonesia Internet Service Provider Association called on the government last month to freeze Starlink's license to sell services to consumers, with Chairman Muhammad Arif Angga saying the suspension should last "until a clear regulation is implemented."

Arif said an overreliance on foreign internet service providers has "the potential to disrupt the sustainability and independence of the local ISP industry."

https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Telecommunication/Elon-Musk-s-Starlink-under-fire-from-Indonesian-telecom-sector

Most likely, while they are criticizing Starlink, those same ISPs will also use it whenever it will be cheaper than alternative solutions - after all this is business.

Online Reynold

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1123 on: 06/20/2024 02:29 am »

Quote
The Indonesia Internet Service Provider Association called on the government last month to freeze Starlink's license to sell services to consumers, with Chairman Muhammad Arif Angga saying the suspension should last "until a clear regulation is implemented."

Arif said an overreliance on foreign internet service providers has "the potential to disrupt the sustainability and independence of the local ISP industry."


They are probably completely correct that using the foreign internet service provider Starlink will disrupt the sustainability of the local ISP industry, which has undoubtedly relied on fat profit margins in a captive market for a long time. . . :)

I am frankly surprised they were able to get this approved with the local incumbents fighting it.  I suspect it will take even longer in india, given their combination of bureaucracy and corruption.

Online DanClemmensen

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1124 on: 06/20/2024 02:54 am »

Quote
The Indonesia Internet Service Provider Association called on the government last month to freeze Starlink's license to sell services to consumers, with Chairman Muhammad Arif Angga saying the suspension should last "until a clear regulation is implemented."

Arif said an overreliance on foreign internet service providers has "the potential to disrupt the sustainability and independence of the local ISP industry."


They are probably completely correct that using the foreign internet service provider Starlink will disrupt the sustainability of the local ISP industry, which has undoubtedly relied on fat profit margins in a captive market for a long time. . . :)

I am frankly surprised they were able to get this approved with the local incumbents fighting it.  I suspect it will take even longer in india, given their combination of bureaucracy and corruption.
This is a universal trait of incumbent monopolies. ISPs will fight Starlink with every tool available in each country. In the US, they managed to exclude Starlink for the subsidized rural internet funding.

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1125 on: 06/20/2024 04:23 pm »

Quote
The Indonesia Internet Service Provider Association called on the government last month to freeze Starlink's license to sell services to consumers, with Chairman Muhammad Arif Angga saying the suspension should last "until a clear regulation is implemented."

Arif said an overreliance on foreign internet service providers has "the potential to disrupt the sustainability and independence of the local ISP industry."


They are probably completely correct that using the foreign internet service provider Starlink will disrupt the sustainability of the local ISP industry, which has undoubtedly relied on fat profit margins in a captive market for a long time. . . :)

I am frankly surprised they were able to get this approved with the local incumbents fighting it.  I suspect it will take even longer in india, given their combination of bureaucracy and corruption.
This is a universal trait of incumbent monopolies. ISPs will fight Starlink with every tool available in each country. In the US, they managed to exclude Starlink for the subsidized rural internet funding.

Are we sure that the ISPs in Indonesia are monopolies?

Online DanClemmensen

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1126 on: 06/20/2024 04:31 pm »

Quote
The Indonesia Internet Service Provider Association called on the government last month to freeze Starlink's license to sell services to consumers, with Chairman Muhammad Arif Angga saying the suspension should last "until a clear regulation is implemented."

Arif said an overreliance on foreign internet service providers has "the potential to disrupt the sustainability and independence of the local ISP industry."


They are probably completely correct that using the foreign internet service provider Starlink will disrupt the sustainability of the local ISP industry, which has undoubtedly relied on fat profit margins in a captive market for a long time. . . :)

I am frankly surprised they were able to get this approved with the local incumbents fighting it.  I suspect it will take even longer in india, given their combination of bureaucracy and corruption.
This is a universal trait of incumbent monopolies. ISPs will fight Starlink with every tool available in each country. In the US, they managed to exclude Starlink for the subsidized rural internet funding.

Are we sure that the ISPs in Indonesia are monopolies?
In this case the objection was from "The Indonesia Internet Service Provider Association". Basically an oligopoly. Effectively no difference: an incumbent attempting to suppress competition that would disrupt an existing commercial environment.

Back when I was actively in the IP-over-GEO business, providers like Intelsat almost always worked with local distributors instead of creating competitor ISPs, precisely to avoid this problem.

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1127 on: 06/20/2024 04:39 pm »
Yes, but I think we need to be precise here.  I have heard that there are ~130 GEO satellites that have landing rights in Indonesia.  Given this, there might be aspects of the Indonesia ISP market that make it particularly sensitive to Starlink's technological disruption.

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1128 on: 06/21/2024 09:51 pm »
https://twitter.com/sawyermerritt/status/1804220425305526716

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BREAKING: U.S. telecom giant Comcast has signed a first of its kind deal with @SpaceX’s Starlink to provide satellite-based connectivity to business customers in regions with limited network access, they announced today.

Comcast has 2.5M business customers for broadband in U.S.

Online Robotbeat

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1129 on: 06/21/2024 10:58 pm »
Remind me from the big announcement thing. When Musk said starlink would give options for people stuck with Comcast. :)
Chris  Whoever loves correction loves knowledge, but he who hates reproof is stupid.

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Offline raptorx2

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1130 on: 06/21/2024 11:39 pm »
Starlink Mini.

Colombia

$196US equipment
$36/mo service

Offline spacenut

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1131 on: 06/22/2024 12:03 am »
Starlink mini is now going to be sold at Walmart.  This will probably increase sales.  Got to get more satellites up. 

Offline OceanCat

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1132 on: 06/26/2024 06:02 am »
Starlink introduces 50 GB residential plan in Kenya for 10 USD a month. Additional data 15 cents a gig. The unlimited residential plan costs 50 USD a month. The 50 GB plan is five times cheaper than the unlimited residential just like the invite-only 50 GB Mini roam plan in the US compared to the unlimited regional roam plan.

The gen2 hardware is sold for ~350 USD in Kenya. I bet they will start selling the Mini in Kenya soon.
« Last Edit: 06/26/2024 06:04 am by OceanCat »

Offline Mandella

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1133 on: 06/26/2024 04:42 pm »
Here's a cut and paste of the offer Starlink just sent me for their Mini, links and images edited out.

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Introducing Starlink Mini
You are invited for early access. Order by July 4th, 2024 .

Starlink Mini is a compact, portable kit that can easily fit in a backpack, designed to provide high-speed, low-latency internet on the go.

Starlink Mini includes a built-in WiFi router, lower power consumption, DC power input, and max download speeds over 100 Mbps*.
 
You are invited to purchase the Starlink Mini Kit for $599 and bundle the Mini Roam service with your existing Residential service plan for an additional $30/mo.
 
Our goal is to reduce the price of Starlink, especially for those around the world where connectivity has been unaffordable or completely unavailable. But in regions with high usage, where Starlink Mini places additional demand on the satellite network, we are offering a limited number of the Starlink Mini Kits to start for $599.

Our first 10,000 orders will be shipped ahead of July 4th. Remaining orders will take 2 to 4 weeks to ship. 
ORDER NOW

We are offering Starlink customers the option to bundle Starlink Mini with their Residential service.
The Mini Roam service is an additional $30/mo for 50GB of Mobile data that can be used anywhere in the United States ($1/GB for additional data).
You must continue your Residential service on your current Starlink to use Mini Roam service.
This invitation is only valid for one order on this account.
Customers cannot trade-in their current Starlink for Starlink Mini.


I won't be getting it, since I just don't roam that much. I'd consider it a good deal if I did though.

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1134 on: 06/26/2024 08:51 pm »
According to Napoleon Adok Gai, the head of South Sudan's telecommunications authority, the country today gave a provisional license to Starlink.

I am guessing that people, perhaps including the government and certainly aid agencies, were using the gray market roaming service.  Once SpaceX increased the price of that service rather substantially, that pushed the authorities to regularize usage.

South Sudan has very little infrastructure and most of the country is very remote.  The Starlink Mini + service is ideal for the country.

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Exciting news for South Sudan today🌍🛰️ We are pleased to announce the issuing of provisional license for
@Starlink service in our country.  This milestone will revolutionize connectivity, empower rural communities and drive down internet cost. We are committed to ensure affordable service and compliance. Let's welcome starlink to #SouthSudan #Connectivity #DigitalInclusion #Starlink #NCA_ssd

https://twitter.com/AdokGai/status/1806020201013449093
« Last Edit: 06/26/2024 08:53 pm by RedLineTrain »

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1135 on: 06/26/2024 09:05 pm »
More information.

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Today, the NCA met with Starlink's managing team Ryan D. Goodnight, Sr. Director, Global Licensing & Market Activation at SpaceX and Benjamin MacWilliams, Director, Starlink Global Licensing & Activation in South Sudan for a significant multistakeholders engagement, including the South Sudan Revenue Authority and the Customs division. This meeting addressed crucial issues related to licensing Starlink service in South Sudan as well as Starlink terminal smuggling, highlighting the country's growing need for connectivity.

After two-years of negotiations, we are thrilled to announce the signing of a Satellite Landing Rights License and a Provisional Service License for Starlink services in South Sudan. These agreements aim to provide affordable and accessible broadband connectivity, especially to remote areas, promoting rural connectivity. This week Starlink South Sudan is expected to publish details of its products and their associated prices as well as their distribution agent that will be responsible for the distribution of terminals.

There will be penalties for smuggling unlicensed terminals into the country.

The conclusion of licensing Starlink and collaboration among government agencies marks a significant step forward in our mission to bridge the digital divide and Connecting South Sudan. #ConnectingSSD

https://twitter.com/NCA_SSD/status/1806016264898224499

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1136 on: 06/28/2024 07:55 pm »
https://twitter.com/sawyermerritt/status/1806748040063062453

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NEWS: CEO of Carnival, the world's largest cruise company, says @SpaceX's Starlink has been a game-changer for them.

“We completed the rollout of Starlink this quarter, another revenue uplift opportunity and a real game-changer for our onboard connectivity experience; We’re spending more on bandwidth than we ever have, and it’s generating outsized returns because people love the service. It’s land like and it’s something people are willing to pay for."

Source: https://cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/2024/06/carnivals-weinstein-starlink-is-a-game-changer/

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1137 on: 06/28/2024 08:34 pm »
Starlink service was rolled out in Madagascar.

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Starlink’s high-speed, low-latency internet is now available in Madagascar! 🛰️🇲🇬❤️ → http://starlink.com/map?country=MG

https://twitter.com/Starlink/status/1806406583452332471

Offline seb21051

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1138 on: 06/29/2024 02:01 am »
Looking up on Google AI I see there are around 86 million Satellite Internet users in the world in 2024.

There were 77m in 2022 and its estimated the numbers will climb to 110m by 2029, so numbers are climbing at about 4.6m per year.

So, if Starlink has about 3m presently, adding around 125,000 per month or 1.5m per year, their percentage gain is about 32% or one third of the global increase.

So by the time Kuiper starts actively getting users at the start of 2025, Starlink should be up to around 3.7m, with about 7,000 sats in orbit.

Depending on Kuiper's pricing, and performance, we should see some interesting developments.

Just as with EVs, I suspect the price wars will start, and it should be interesting where they shake out.

One thing that puzzles me is who are the biggest players in this 86 million user marketplace.
Google reckons its Starlink, with just over 3m, Hughes, with about 1.2m and Viasat with around 700K. That totals out to about 5m. Who the heck has the other 81m users?

EchoStar, SES, Intelsat, Telesat, OneWeb, and EarthLink? Doesn't seem to compute.
« Last Edit: 06/29/2024 02:33 am by seb21051 »

Offline Rebel44

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Re: Starlink : Markets and Marketing
« Reply #1139 on: 06/29/2024 08:40 am »
Looking up on Google AI I see there are around 86 million Satellite Internet users in the world in 2024.

There were 77m in 2022 and its estimated the numbers will climb to 110m by 2029, so numbers are climbing at about 4.6m per year.

So, if Starlink has about 3m presently, adding around 125,000 per month or 1.5m per year, their percentage gain is about 32% or one third of the global increase.

So by the time Kuiper starts actively getting users at the start of 2025, Starlink should be up to around 3.7m, with about 7,000 sats in orbit.

Depending on Kuiper's pricing, and performance, we should see some interesting developments.

Just as with EVs, I suspect the price wars will start, and it should be interesting where they shake out.

One thing that puzzles me is who are the biggest players in this 86 million user marketplace.
Google reckons its Starlink, with just over 3m, Hughes, with about 1.2m and Viasat with around 700K. That totals out to about 5m. Who the heck has the other 81m users?

EchoStar, SES, Intelsat, Telesat, OneWeb, and EarthLink? Doesn't seem to compute.

86 million satellite internet users in the world in 2024 seems incorrect - is there any source for that number? IIRC HughesNet and Viasat had together only something like 2M satellite internet users and they were the biggest satellite internet players that I knew before Starlink.

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