Author Topic: Dragon 2 outside features questions.  (Read 18220 times)

Offline Eyetam

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Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« on: 03/04/2019 03:21 pm »
I have more questions about outside features on the capsule  ;)


So what are these features on the attached picture?

Green arrow:  What is it?

2 red arrows: Lidars?

2 blue arrows: What is it?


Thx!

Offline Jarnis

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #1 on: 03/04/2019 04:09 pm »
Green arrow: Educated guess: Star trackers?

Red arrows: Probably LIDARs

No clue on the blue arrows.

Offline GregTheGrumpy

Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #2 on: 03/04/2019 05:15 pm »
The Red arrows could also be the red & green approach lights.

Offline Zed_Noir

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #3 on: 03/04/2019 07:37 pm »
The Red arrows could also be the red & green approach lights.

Maybe a combination array of approach light and Lidar at the Red Arrow locations.

Think the Blue Arrow locations are RCS exhaust ports.
« Last Edit: 03/04/2019 07:40 pm by Zed_Noir »

Offline Lars-J

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #4 on: 03/04/2019 07:50 pm »
The Red arrows could also be the red & green approach lights.

No, the red/green lights are outside the nose cone area. Looks like the one of the lights is the raised spot between the two blue arrows in the original picture.

EDIT: Added a better picture by cosmonaut Kononenko - although it is upside down compared to the other photo.
« Last Edit: 03/04/2019 07:59 pm by Lars-J »

Offline groknull

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #5 on: 03/04/2019 07:50 pm »
The Red arrows could also be the red & green approach lights.

Maybe a combination array of approach light and Lidar at the Red Arrow locations.

Think the Blue Arrow locations are RCS exhaust ports.

Red arrows indicate the umbilical connection points.

International Docking System Standard - Interface Definition Document (Revision E):
https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/20170001546.pdf
Section 3.4 Resource Transfer Umbilicals (page 57)

Same document available here:
http://internationaldockingstandard.com/download/IDSS_IDD_Revision_E_TAGGED.pdf
« Last Edit: 03/04/2019 08:18 pm by groknull »

Offline Wolfram66

Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #6 on: 03/04/2019 08:08 pm »
I have more questions about outside features on the capsule  ;)


So what are these features on the attached picture?

Green arrow:  What is it?

2 red arrows: Lidars?

2 blue arrows: What is it?


Thx!


Blue RCS Ports

Offline Lars-J

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #7 on: 03/04/2019 08:17 pm »
No, those are the windows.  :) And the red arrows do not point to Draco RCS thusters. Usually RCS thrusters are mirrored on the other side, but these are not. I suspect they are something else.

I added an image to point on the drogues (and drogue mortar) covers.
« Last Edit: 03/04/2019 08:29 pm by Lars-J »

Offline Wolfram66

Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #8 on: 03/05/2019 01:43 am »
No, those are the windows.  :) And the red arrows do not point to Draco RCS thusters. Usually RCS thrusters are mirrored on the other side, but these are not. I suspect they are something else.

I added an image to point on the drogues (and drogue mortar) covers.

Thanks for the info Lars-J. I was just going off of this graphic
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=46136.0;attach=1547624;sess=0

Offline Eyetam

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #9 on: 03/05/2019 02:14 am »
So as indicated by groknull, the red arrows seems to correspond to the docking umbilicals to transfer power and data with the station.

The green arrow area is most likely where the visual sensors are located (LIDAR and thermal imagers).  The location is consistent with a viewpoint from the capsule seen during the approach (first attachment).

The "blue arrows" are the only features which we don't have strong clues yet in this thread.  Star trackers?  Umbilicals for the RCS system?


Offline RoboGoofers

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #10 on: 03/05/2019 07:41 pm »
actually i think the cameras are in the divot between the NDS and the green arrow feature.

What are the yellow/gold pads inside the nose cone?

Offline Lars-J

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #11 on: 03/05/2019 08:57 pm »
actually i think the cameras are in the divot between the NDS and the green arrow feature.

What are the yellow/gold pads inside the nose cone?

Probably just support/dampening clamps or spacers around the docking adapter during ascent/reentry, to keep the nose cone and docking adapter locked in place.
« Last Edit: 03/05/2019 08:58 pm by Lars-J »

Offline pospa

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #12 on: 03/07/2019 11:36 am »
Latest hi-res NASA photo rotated, cropped, arrowed and my humble guess what is what as follows:

- yellow: 2x electric & data umbilical connectors
- orange: 4x forward facing Draco thrusters
- red: 2x lidar sensors
- purple: 1x(2x) star tracker sensor(s)
- green: 1x forward facing context camera
- blue: 3x air ventilation ports (used post splashdown)

Any comments? Do you agree with any of my guesses?
« Last Edit: 03/07/2019 03:09 pm by pospa »

Offline woods170

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #13 on: 03/07/2019 11:58 am »
Latest hi-res NASA photo rotated, cropped, arrowed and my humble guess what is what is following:

- yellow: 2x electric & data umbilical connectors
- orange: 4x forward facing Draco thrusters
- red: 2x lidar sensors
- purple: 1x(2x) star tracker sensor(s)
- green: 1x forward facing context camera
- blue: 3x air ventilation ports (used post splashdown)

Any comments?

Why would you have Draco thrusters right next to the docking ring?

Use of Dracos in such close proximity of the docking ring will thermally affect the docking ring in a negative way. And mind you, that docking ring is what is used to latch the nose cone in place once it is closed.

Offline pospa

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #14 on: 03/07/2019 12:10 pm »
Latest hi-res NASA photo rotated, cropped, arrowed and my humble guess what is what is following:

- yellow: 2x electric & data umbilical connectors
- orange: 4x forward facing Draco thrusters
- red: 2x lidar sensors
- purple: 1x(2x) star tracker sensor(s)
- green: 1x forward facing context camera
- blue: 3x air ventilation ports (used post splashdown)

Any comments?

Why would you have Draco thrusters right next to the docking ring?

Use of Dracos in such close proximity of the docking ring will thermally affect the docking ring in a negative way. And mind you, that docking ring is what is used to latch the nose cone in place once it is closed.

I'm not saying facts, its only my guess. In case you know more - a real purpose/function of those 4 black openings, just tell us. In case they are not forward facing Dracos then where they are on CD?

Also, what should be those 4 flat golden plated "covers" inside the nose cone, that seems to fit to 4 black openings arround docking ring?
« Last Edit: 03/07/2019 12:29 pm by pospa »

Offline cuddihy

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #15 on: 03/07/2019 12:13 pm »

Why would you have Draco thrusters right next to the docking ring?

Use of Dracos in such close proximity of the docking ring will thermally affect the docking ring in a negative way. And mind you, that docking ring is what is used to latch the nose cone in place once it is closed.
Where else can you put thrusters that 1. rapidly impart "retreat" velocity, while 2. not impinging on the Station arrays &  radiators?

The 4 thrusters around the collar should only impinge on the stiff central parts of station, primarily in fact on Node 3 where the IDA is.
« Last Edit: 03/07/2019 12:14 pm by cuddihy »

Offline Jarnis

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #16 on: 03/07/2019 12:39 pm »
As far as I know, the four forward-facing Dracos are definitely a thing and actually the "main propulsion" of the capsule. Even the graphics in the DM-1 broadcast showed the capsule firing dracos on the nose to do ISS phasing.

They are used for orbit raising and I would also imagine they are used for the deorbit burn. No cosine losses and capsule "going in reverse" is not an issue whatsoever.

They might not use them near ISS at all. "RCS" Dracos on the sides can give the nudge to get the capsule to drift away when undocking and the main ones in the nose are used only when well clear.
« Last Edit: 03/07/2019 12:40 pm by Jarnis »

Online Johnnyhinbos

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #17 on: 03/07/2019 12:52 pm »
Latest hi-res NASA photo rotated, cropped, arrowed and my humble guess what is what is following:

- yellow: 2x electric & data umbilical connectors
- orange: 4x forward facing Draco thrusters
- red: 2x lidar sensors
- purple: 1x(2x) star tracker sensor(s)
- green: 1x forward facing context camera
- blue: 3x air ventilation ports (used post splashdown)

Any comments?

Why would you have Draco thrusters right next to the docking ring?

Use of Dracos in such close proximity of the docking ring will thermally affect the docking ring in a negative way. And mind you, that docking ring is what is used to latch the nose cone in place once it is closed.
I'm fairly certain Hans stated those are Dracos. Also if you look at other images of these four notional thrusters it looks like exhaust marks around them (though I have no idea what kind of residue the hypergolics leave - it could also be heating artifacts). Regardless, I do think these are thrusters.
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Offline woods170

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #18 on: 03/07/2019 01:24 pm »
Latest hi-res NASA photo rotated, cropped, arrowed and my humble guess what is what is following:

- yellow: 2x electric & data umbilical connectors
- orange: 4x forward facing Draco thrusters
- red: 2x lidar sensors
- purple: 1x(2x) star tracker sensor(s)
- green: 1x forward facing context camera
- blue: 3x air ventilation ports (used post splashdown)

Any comments?

Why would you have Draco thrusters right next to the docking ring?

Use of Dracos in such close proximity of the docking ring will thermally affect the docking ring in a negative way. And mind you, that docking ring is what is used to latch the nose cone in place once it is closed.
I'm fairly certain Hans stated those are Dracos. Also if you look at other images of these four notional thrusters it looks like exhaust marks around them (though I have no idea what kind of residue the hypergolics leave - it could also be heating artifacts). Regardless, I do think these are thrusters.

If they are thrusters it would explain why two of the three thrusters in each quad are tilted in such a way that they fire thru two axis, in stead of one: it would be back up for nose mounted thrusters not being available when the nose cap is closed.
« Last Edit: 03/07/2019 01:24 pm by woods170 »

Offline darkenfast

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Re: Dragon 2 outside features questions.
« Reply #19 on: 03/07/2019 01:28 pm »
 Just something I noticed.  The four black openings are centered around the docking hatch and its gear, which in turn is offset from the actual centerline of the spacecraft.

Edit: I was wrong (again!). I was optically-delusioned by the "slant" of the nose cover line.
« Last Edit: 03/10/2019 05:53 pm by darkenfast »
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