The Fall 2019 seat would come from Soyuz MS-15 and would be taken from the spaceflight participant who currently occupies the third seat on that mission.
I see in the news this:https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2019/02/nasa-soyuz-seats-uninterrupted-access-iss/From the outside, it seems that NASA would rather buy launches from the Russians. If SpaceX and Boeing had to go through the same safety validation process that Soyuz went through, how long ago could they have been launching?
https://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportunity&mode=form&tab=core&id=623824de4ca36a33ca5242b2acee79e5QuoteNASA is considering contracting with the State Space Corporation "Roscosmos" for these services on a sole source basis for two (2) Soyuz seats and associated services to the International Space Station (ISS) on the Russian Soyuz spacecraft vehicle. This transportation would be for one crewmember in the Fall of 2019 and one crewmember in the Spring of 2020.
NASA is considering contracting with the State Space Corporation "Roscosmos" for these services on a sole source basis for two (2) Soyuz seats and associated services to the International Space Station (ISS) on the Russian Soyuz spacecraft vehicle. This transportation would be for one crewmember in the Fall of 2019 and one crewmember in the Spring of 2020.
Quote from: Olaf on 02/15/2019 05:51 pmhttps://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportunity&mode=form&tab=core&id=623824de4ca36a33ca5242b2acee79e5QuoteNASA is considering contracting with the State Space Corporation "Roscosmos" for these services on a sole source basis for two (2) Soyuz seats and associated services to the International Space Station (ISS) on the Russian Soyuz spacecraft vehicle. This transportation would be for one crewmember in the Fall of 2019 and one crewmember in the Spring of 2020.I wonder if NASA & Roscosmos could barder for UAE seat & put them put on a commercial crew vehicle?
What is confusing, is that Soyuz MS-14 (№743) is to be launched without crew. I guess the contracts will be amended in the future, and could explain the absence of №746.
Point of interest, if Starliner CFT arrives at the ISS before Dragon DM2 (almost a certainty at this point) and Starliner remains docked, for full mission duration but DM2 stays for just a few days, then who gets to take home the flag? First one back or first one there?
Quote from: Tomness on 02/15/2019 08:53 pmQuote from: Olaf on 02/15/2019 05:51 pmhttps://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportunity&mode=form&tab=core&id=623824de4ca36a33ca5242b2acee79e5QuoteNASA is considering contracting with the State Space Corporation "Roscosmos" for these services on a sole source basis for two (2) Soyuz seats and associated services to the International Space Station (ISS) on the Russian Soyuz spacecraft vehicle. This transportation would be for one crewmember in the Fall of 2019 and one crewmember in the Spring of 2020.I wonder if NASA & Roscosmos could barder for UAE seat & put them put on a commercial crew vehicle?NASA has zero - absolutely none - interesting in having people pay them for seats for spaceflights to the ISS. And since NASA is paying SpaceX and Boeing for the seats on Dragon and Starliner, a spaceflight participant is not going to happen.EDIT (to add): Roscosmos spaceflight participants are always "if no other need for that seat arises" scenarios. The paying UAE citizen will be bumped to a later flight if/when this purchase agreement goes through.
>SpaceX may fly both DM1 and DM2 this year, but unlikely a crewed mission, >
A roundup of manned spaceflight,The most powerful and richest nation on earth after landing people on the moon and launching the most sophisticated and largest spacecraft (shuttle), cannot on launch people into low earth orbit on a capsule.Russia having put the first human into orbit more than half a century ago is still using 1960's design.China, the second largest economy on earth has flown crew a handful of times in more than a decade. Using a copy of the old Soviet design.The EU (ESA), doesn't have any manned spacecraft.It is dismal.
Quote from: daedalus1 on 02/17/2019 06:30 amA roundup of manned spaceflight,The most powerful and richest nation on earth after landing people on the moon and launching the most sophisticated and largest spacecraft (shuttle), cannot on launch people into low earth orbit on a capsule.Russia having put the first human into orbit more than half a century ago is still using 1960's design.China, the second largest economy on earth has flown crew a handful of times in more than a decade. Using a copy of the old Soviet design.The EU (ESA), doesn't have any manned spacecraft.It is dismal.Emphasis mine.That's by ESA's own choice.
Quote from: Roy_H on 02/16/2019 01:42 am>SpaceX may fly both DM1 and DM2 this year, but unlikely a crewed mission, >DM-2 is by definition a crewed mission, or are you talking about a PCM (Post Certification Mission)?
Quote from: woods170 on 02/17/2019 06:31 pmQuote from: daedalus1 on 02/17/2019 06:30 amA roundup of manned spaceflight,The most powerful and richest nation on earth after landing people on the moon and launching the most sophisticated and largest spacecraft (shuttle), cannot on launch people into low earth orbit on a capsule.Russia having put the first human into orbit more than half a century ago is still using 1960's design.China, the second largest economy on earth has flown crew a handful of times in more than a decade. Using a copy of the old Soviet design.The EU (ESA), doesn't have any manned spacecraft.It is dismal.Emphasis mine.That's by ESA's own choice.How is that different than the others? Were China and Russia forced into their current situations? ALL countries situation regarding manned spaceflight is by their own choices and priorities.
Quote from: Lars-J on 02/17/2019 07:28 pmQuote from: woods170 on 02/17/2019 06:31 pmQuote from: daedalus1 on 02/17/2019 06:30 amA roundup of manned spaceflight,The most powerful and richest nation on earth after landing people on the moon and launching the most sophisticated and largest spacecraft (shuttle), cannot on launch people into low earth orbit on a capsule.Russia having put the first human into orbit more than half a century ago is still using 1960's design.China, the second largest economy on earth has flown crew a handful of times in more than a decade. Using a copy of the old Soviet design.The EU (ESA), doesn't have any manned spacecraft.It is dismal.Emphasis mine.That's by ESA's own choice.How is that different than the others? Were China and Russia forced into their current situations? ALL countries situation regarding manned spaceflight is by their own choices and priorities.My emphasis must be reflected upon within the frame of the original post. Particularly the "It's dismal" part of the original post.
Quote from: woods170 on 02/18/2019 06:17 amQuote from: Lars-J on 02/17/2019 07:28 pmQuote from: woods170 on 02/17/2019 06:31 pmQuote from: daedalus1 on 02/17/2019 06:30 amA roundup of manned spaceflight,The most powerful and richest nation on earth after landing people on the moon and launching the most sophisticated and largest spacecraft (shuttle), cannot on launch people into low earth orbit on a capsule.Russia having put the first human into orbit more than half a century ago is still using 1960's design.China, the second largest economy on earth has flown crew a handful of times in more than a decade. Using a copy of the old Soviet design.The EU (ESA), doesn't have any manned spacecraft.It is dismal.Emphasis mine.That's by ESA's own choice.How is that different than the others? Were China and Russia forced into their current situations? ALL countries situation regarding manned spaceflight is by their own choices and priorities.My emphasis must be reflected upon within the frame of the original post. Particularly the "It's dismal" part of the original post.The dismal comment was there obviously to reflect the current state of human spaceflight regardless of the individual reasons.
Quote from: daedalus1 on 02/18/2019 06:22 amQuote from: woods170 on 02/18/2019 06:17 amQuote from: Lars-J on 02/17/2019 07:28 pmQuote from: woods170 on 02/17/2019 06:31 pmQuote from: daedalus1 on 02/17/2019 06:30 amA roundup of manned spaceflight,The most powerful and richest nation on earth after landing people on the moon and launching the most sophisticated and largest spacecraft (shuttle), cannot on launch people into low earth orbit on a capsule.Russia having put the first human into orbit more than half a century ago is still using 1960's design.China, the second largest economy on earth has flown crew a handful of times in more than a decade. Using a copy of the old Soviet design.The EU (ESA), doesn't have any manned spacecraft.It is dismal.Emphasis mine.That's by ESA's own choice.How is that different than the others? Were China and Russia forced into their current situations? ALL countries situation regarding manned spaceflight is by their own choices and priorities.My emphasis must be reflected upon within the frame of the original post. Particularly the "It's dismal" part of the original post.The dismal comment was there obviously to reflect the current state of human spaceflight regardless of the individual reasons.If that is so than there was no reason to list the individual manned spaceflight programs (or lack thereof).
NASA has zero - absolutely none - interesting in having people pay them for seats for spaceflights to the ISS. And since NASA is paying SpaceX and Boeing for the seats on Dragon and Starliner, a spaceflight participant is not going to happen.
Boeing Co’s (BA.N) proposal to develop a so-called space taxi for NASA astronauts includes a seat for paying tourists to fly to the International Space Station, the company’s program manager said on Wednesday, a first for a U.S. space program. The $4.2 billion, five-year contract allows Boeing to sell rides to tourists, Boeing Commercial Crew Program Manager John Mulholland told Reuters, adding that the price would be competitive with what the Russian space agency now charges to fly tourists to the orbital outpost. “Part of our proposal into NASA would be flying a Space Adventures spaceflight participant up to the ISS,” Mulholland said, referring to a Virginia-based space tourism company that brokers travel aboard Russian Soyuz capsules.
Roscosmos decided to to provide NASA with 2 seats on Soyuz-MS ships: one on #SoyuzMS17 (October 2020) and one on SoyuzMS18 (April 2021), said Rogozin just a few hours ago. Given today's Starliner problems, NASA may need more than 2 seats... ria.ru/20191220/15626…
The report isn't wrong, just... stale. Much of the "significant work" remaining has already been completed.
It is interesting to see what progress has been made since that timeframe, obviously there is still plenty of work to be done before operational flights (and even before the crewed demo flights).
Quote from: abaddon on 01/29/2020 09:30 pmThe report isn't wrong, just... stale. Much of the "significant work" remaining has already been completed.Reports are always snapshots in time, and NEVER up to date on the day you are reading them. Let's set realistic expectations here.QuoteIt is interesting to see what progress has been made since that timeframe, obviously there is still plenty of work to be done before operational flights (and even before the crewed demo flights).Which is why it's good to have a stake in the ground from when they did the study. Now we can see if what everyone THOUGHT would happen actually did.And unfortunately as of today it seems more likely that we'll need to buy more Soyuz seats in order to back up the Boeing Starliner - unless SpaceX can get approved and prove to NASA that they can be the backup to Boeing. I know which future I'd want...
Quote from: Coastal Ron on 02/07/2020 11:42 pmQuote from: abaddon on 01/29/2020 09:30 pmThe report isn't wrong, just... stale. Much of the "significant work" remaining has already been completed.Reports are always snapshots in time, and NEVER up to date on the day you are reading them. Let's set realistic expectations here.Quote from: abaddon on 01/29/2020 09:30 pmIt is interesting to see what progress has been made since that timeframe, obviously there is still plenty of work to be done before operational flights (and even before the crewed demo flights).Which is why it's good to have a stake in the ground from when they did the study. Now we can see if what everyone THOUGHT would happen actually did.And unfortunately as of today it seems more likely that we'll need to buy more Soyuz seats in order to back up the Boeing Starliner - unless SpaceX can get approved and prove to NASA that they can be the backup to Boeing. I know which future I'd want... Shocker for you: SpaceX already was under increased NASA oversight due to CRS-7, AMOS kaboom and DM-1 pre-IFA kaboom. Boeing is being put under even more intrusive NASA oversight as we speak. Courtesy of their OFT screw-ups.And guess what: because both CCP contractors are to be treated equally, the increased oversight regime is ALSO going to be applied to SpaceX. Yeah, you read that correctly.I wouldn't be surprised one d*mn bit if THAT is going to delay DM-2 as well.Therefore I fully expect that NASA will scramble to buy additional seats on Soyuz.
Quote from: abaddon on 01/29/2020 09:30 pmThe report isn't wrong, just... stale. Much of the "significant work" remaining has already been completed.Reports are always snapshots in time, and NEVER up to date on the day you are reading them. Let's set realistic expectations here.Quote from: abaddon on 01/29/2020 09:30 pmIt is interesting to see what progress has been made since that timeframe, obviously there is still plenty of work to be done before operational flights (and even before the crewed demo flights).Which is why it's good to have a stake in the ground from when they did the study. Now we can see if what everyone THOUGHT would happen actually did.And unfortunately as of today it seems more likely that we'll need to buy more Soyuz seats in order to back up the Boeing Starliner - unless SpaceX can get approved and prove to NASA that they can be the backup to Boeing. I know which future I'd want...
With the working date of May 7 for DM-2, and plans to run the ISS with a single US astronaut, are Soyuz seats really necessary?
The new contract between @NASA and @Roscosmos to buy additional seats in #Soyuz spaceships can be signed in April, when NASA delegation will come to Baikonur for the Soyuz MS-16 launch. The number of seats in contract has not been announced yet. https://ria.ru/20200213/1564676346.html…
The source says, that the new contract between @Roscosmos and @NASA includes buying of two seats in #SoyuzMS17 and #SoyuzMS18 and NASA will pay $170 million for it. The contract can be signed in April.
As @nasa and @spacex prepare to restart US human orbital launch, nasa inks deal with @roscosmos for Soyuz seat this fall. Will cost +$90M, inc training, etc. US also will comp Roscosmos by flying Russian cargo aboard US supply runs
$90M plus bonuses? We got Dennis Tito on ISS via Soyuz for around $16M for a week round trip including board (it was inflated in PR to $20M) so if time/money added in, I still feel the costs have been going the wrong way...lol. Time for this to change.
The deal signed today is for NASA to pay Roscosmos $90,252,905.69. That covers the cost of training and preparation for flight, launch, flight operations, landing, crew rescue (the ability to evacuate the crew if an emergency arises on ISS), and limited cargo delivery. Since putting a U.S. astronaut on the flight means a Russian crew member will have to step aside, NASA also agreed to transport 800 kilograms of Russian cargo to ISS over the next 2.5 years on U.S. commercial cargo flights.
As a means to mitigate the aforementioned risks, NASA is issuing this synopsis in order to provide notice of the Agency's requirements and to determine whether any other potential sources have the current capability to provide these crew transportation services in the required timeframes.Interested organizations may submit their capabilities and qualifications to provide the crew transportation services. Such capabilities/qualifications will be evaluated solely for the purpose of determining whether or not to conduct this procurement on a competitive basis. The determination of whether or not to acquire these services without competition is solely within the discretion of the Government.Submissions must be provided in writing to the identified point of contacts not later than 8:00 a.m. local time on December 12, 2019. Oral communications are not acceptable in response to this notice. The Government does not intend to acquire the described services as a commercial item using FAR Part 12.
Is there a Dislike button?Far from subsidization, this purchase took away a Russian seat that was expected to be used to help outfit the MLM.
Quote from: Sesquipedalian on 05/23/2020 06:30 pmIs there a Dislike button?Far from subsidization, this purchase took away a Russian seat that was expected to be used to help outfit the MLM.Really? MLM won't lanch until six months after the contracted crew flight in fall 2020. As such this purchase is NOT impacting MLM outfitting.
Quote from: woods170 on 05/23/2020 08:03 pmQuote from: Sesquipedalian on 05/23/2020 06:30 pmIs there a Dislike button?Far from subsidization, this purchase took away a Russian seat that was expected to be used to help outfit the MLM.Really? MLM won't lanch until six months after the contracted crew flight in fall 2020. As such this purchase is NOT impacting MLM outfitting. How long has the MLM been a year from launching now?
Quote from: Nomadd on 05/28/2020 02:42 amQuote from: woods170 on 05/23/2020 08:03 pmQuote from: Sesquipedalian on 05/23/2020 06:30 pmIs there a Dislike button?Far from subsidization, this purchase took away a Russian seat that was expected to be used to help outfit the MLM.Really? MLM won't lanch until six months after the contracted crew flight in fall 2020. As such this purchase is NOT impacting MLM outfitting. How long has the MLM been a year from launching now?Since 1998.
Quote from: russianhalo117 on 05/28/2020 03:25 amQuote from: Nomadd on 05/28/2020 02:42 amQuote from: woods170 on 05/23/2020 08:03 pmQuote from: Sesquipedalian on 05/23/2020 06:30 pmIs there a Dislike button?Far from subsidization, this purchase took away a Russian seat that was expected to be used to help outfit the MLM.Really? MLM won't lanch until six months after the contracted crew flight in fall 2020. As such this purchase is NOT impacting MLM outfitting. How long has the MLM been a year from launching now?Since 1998.Not quite that particular year but the general message of your post is correct.Fact remains that Sesquipedalian is incorrect in reply #45. This additionally bought Soyuz seat will by no means impact the outfitting of MLM. The astronaut taking this seat will be launched to the ISS in fall 2020. He/she will return to Earth 6 months later, in late spring 2021. MLM is not scheduled for launch until well AFTER said astronaut has already returned to Earth.Therefore, had this seat not been sold to NASA, but had instead been taken up by a Russian cosmonaut, than that cosmonaut would already be back on Earth by the time MLM finally reaches the station. And said cosmonaut is not in a very good position to help outfit MLM when he/she is not actually present on ISS.
There are several EVAs scheduled in order for a Progress to jettison Pirs, and lay the groundwork for Nauka's arrival, before its launch - so yes, it's definitely impacting MLM preparations, even if there are workarounds.
Quote from: woods170 on 05/28/2020 08:47 amQuote from: russianhalo117 on 05/28/2020 03:25 amQuote from: Nomadd on 05/28/2020 02:42 amQuote from: woods170 on 05/23/2020 08:03 pmQuote from: Sesquipedalian on 05/23/2020 06:30 pmIs there a Dislike button?Far from subsidization, this purchase took away a Russian seat that was expected to be used to help outfit the MLM.Really? MLM won't lanch until six months after the contracted crew flight in fall 2020. As such this purchase is NOT impacting MLM outfitting. How long has the MLM been a year from launching now?Since 1998.Not quite that particular year but the general message of your post is correct.Fact remains that Sesquipedalian is incorrect in reply #45. This additionally bought Soyuz seat will by no means impact the outfitting of MLM. The astronaut taking this seat will be launched to the ISS in fall 2020. He/she will return to Earth 6 months later, in late spring 2021. MLM is not scheduled for launch until well AFTER said astronaut has already returned to Earth.Therefore, had this seat not been sold to NASA, but had instead been taken up by a Russian cosmonaut, than that cosmonaut would already be back on Earth by the time MLM finally reaches the station. And said cosmonaut is not in a very good position to help outfit MLM when he/she is not actually present on ISS.There are several EVAs scheduled in order for a Progress to jettison Pirs, and lay the groundwork for Nauka's arrival, before its launch - so yes, it's definitely impacting MLM preparations, even if there are workarounds.
Fact remains that Sesquipedalian is incorrect in reply #45. This additionally bought Soyuz seat will by no means impact the outfitting of MLM. The astronaut taking this seat will be launched to the ISS in fall 2020. He/she will return to Earth 6 months later, in late spring 2021. MLM is not scheduled for launch until well AFTER said astronaut has already returned to Earth.
Why is the additional seat required? DM-2 this weekend, Starliner by end of the year?
Quote from: Khadgars on 05/28/2020 03:59 pmWhy is the additional seat required? DM-2 this weekend, Starliner by end of the year?Starliner's first crewed launch is not expected until next year at the earliest, and could potentially be further delayed if any additional issues are uncovered by OFT 2. If DM-2 against all hope experiences an issue that results in delay of USCV-1, then there is the potential for a US residence gap. A Soyuz seat provides insurance against that event.
Quote from: edzieba on 05/28/2020 05:35 pmQuote from: Khadgars on 05/28/2020 03:59 pmWhy is the additional seat required? DM-2 this weekend, Starliner by end of the year?Starliner's first crewed launch is not expected until next year at the earliest, and could potentially be further delayed if any additional issues are uncovered by OFT 2. If DM-2 against all hope experiences an issue that results in delay of USCV-1, then there is the potential for a US residence gap. A Soyuz seat provides insurance against that event. Even if DM-2 is perfect, they'd still like a little redundancy. They've dodged a huge bullet for nine years, depending on one capsule.
Quote from: eeergo on 05/28/2020 01:35 pmQuote from: woods170 on 05/28/2020 08:47 amFact remains that Sesquipedalian is incorrect in reply #45. This additionally bought Soyuz seat will by no means impact the outfitting of MLM. The astronaut taking this seat will be launched to the ISS in fall 2020. He/she will return to Earth 6 months later, in late spring 2021. MLM is not scheduled for launch until well AFTER said astronaut has already returned to Earth.Therefore, had this seat not been sold to NASA, but had instead been taken up by a Russian cosmonaut, than that cosmonaut would already be back on Earth by the time MLM finally reaches the station. And said cosmonaut is not in a very good position to help outfit MLM when he/she is not actually present on ISS.There are several EVAs scheduled in order for a Progress to jettison Pirs, and lay the groundwork for Nauka's arrival, before its launch - so yes, it's definitely impacting MLM preparations, even if there are workarounds.You assume, incorrectly IMO, that those EVAs were to be co-performed by that now not-flying cosmonaut.
Quote from: woods170 on 05/28/2020 08:47 amFact remains that Sesquipedalian is incorrect in reply #45. This additionally bought Soyuz seat will by no means impact the outfitting of MLM. The astronaut taking this seat will be launched to the ISS in fall 2020. He/she will return to Earth 6 months later, in late spring 2021. MLM is not scheduled for launch until well AFTER said astronaut has already returned to Earth.Therefore, had this seat not been sold to NASA, but had instead been taken up by a Russian cosmonaut, than that cosmonaut would already be back on Earth by the time MLM finally reaches the station. And said cosmonaut is not in a very good position to help outfit MLM when he/she is not actually present on ISS.There are several EVAs scheduled in order for a Progress to jettison Pirs, and lay the groundwork for Nauka's arrival, before its launch - so yes, it's definitely impacting MLM preparations, even if there are workarounds.
Fact remains that Sesquipedalian is incorrect in reply #45. This additionally bought Soyuz seat will by no means impact the outfitting of MLM. The astronaut taking this seat will be launched to the ISS in fall 2020. He/she will return to Earth 6 months later, in late spring 2021. MLM is not scheduled for launch until well AFTER said astronaut has already returned to Earth.Therefore, had this seat not been sold to NASA, but had instead been taken up by a Russian cosmonaut, than that cosmonaut would already be back on Earth by the time MLM finally reaches the station. And said cosmonaut is not in a very good position to help outfit MLM when he/she is not actually present on ISS.
Likely. But let's not forget that NASA depended on the most reliable capsule out there. Reliability-wise there is nothing that comes even close to Soyuz.
The annual report of Roscosmos states that NASA will not buy a seat in #SoyuzMS18, scheduled for April 2021. The negotiations regarding the seat in Soyuz-MS17 with launch date in October 2020 are underway, the terms of the contract are being discussed.
https://twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1303406716751618050
