SpaceX Dragon 2 Updates and Discussion - Thread 3

[soltasto]

Is that CCtCap or CCP?  Different sets of numbers.

Looking at this table from wikipedia, it looks like it's the total funding from CCDev1 all the way to CCtCap:

[NGC 4258]

Someone on r/spacex had an interesting question that I don't know the answer to.

What is this oval shaped thing beneath the SuperDraco engines?

[whitelancer64]

Someone on r/spacex had an interesting question that I don't know the answer to.

What is this oval shaped thing beneath the SuperDraco engines?

Probably access hatch covers. Looks like it in this picture anyway.

[Lars-J]

Someone on r/spacex had an interesting question that I don't know the answer to.

What is this oval shaped thing beneath the SuperDraco engines?

It could be regular Draco thrusters.

[Falcon H]

Someone on r/spacex had an interesting question that I don't know the answer to.

What is this oval shaped thing beneath the SuperDraco engines?

It could be regular Draco thrusters.

Is it normal for RCS thrusters to have a plug like that?

[Lars-J]

Someone on r/spacex had an interesting question that I don't know the answer to.

What is this oval shaped thing beneath the SuperDraco engines?

It could be regular Draco thrusters.

Is it normal for RCS thrusters to have a plug like that?

Dragon RCS thrusters usually have covers at launch, but they do look more flimsy than these ones. So I don't know, I'm just speculating. We'll know for sure when it lands if they have been blown open or not.

[Lar]

Dragon RCS thrusters usually have covers at launch, but they do look more flimsy than these ones. So I don't know, I'm just speculating. We'll know for sure when it lands if they have been blown open or not.

I can imagine a scenario in which we never see this on return... but I think it's fairly low probability

[falcon19]

Dragon RCS thrusters usually have covers at launch, but they do look more flimsy than these ones. So I don't know, I'm just speculating. We'll know for sure when it lands if they have been blown open or not.

I can imagine a scenario in which we never see this on return... but I think it's fairly low probability

They can't be the Dracos, because they always planned for a superdraco landing. Having Draco nozzles in the middle of the superdraco exhaust path seems very unlikely.

[jarmumd]

Someone on r/spacex had an interesting question that I don't know the answer to.

What is this oval shaped thing beneath the SuperDraco engines?

might be plugs to prevent salt water intrusion?

[Lars-J]

Dragon RCS thrusters usually have covers at launch, but they do look more flimsy than these ones. So I don't know, I'm just speculating. We'll know for sure when it lands if they have been blown open or not.

I can imagine a scenario in which we never see this on return... but I think it's fairly low probability

They can't be the Dracos, because they always planned for a superdraco landing. Having Draco nozzles in the middle of the superdraco exhaust path seems very unlikely.

Why? Draco nozzles are not gentle things. And it the exhaust, not the nozzle itself, that would be in the superdraco exhaust path.

But it is all speculation anyway, I could be very wrong.

[woods170]

Commercial crew funding to date:

Boeing: $4.82 billion
SpaceX: $3.14 billion

https://twitter.com/SciGuySpace/status/1101231265834061824

For those keeping track, that's a $540M (21%) increase for SpaceX and $620M (15%) for Boeing. Funding gap between the two is now just shy of $1.7B, up from $1.6B in 2014.

Not an increase. The quoted numbers are the totals over the entire CCP program: from CCDev1 to CCtCAP. As pointed out by soltasto in reply #601.


Overall: Boeing’s solution for CCP is 53% less cheap than is SpaceX’s, with entering the program a year earlier, not using its own rocket, yet flying later than SpaceX.

[NH22077]

Someone on r/spacex had an interesting question that I don't know the answer to.

What is this oval shaped thing beneath the SuperDraco engines?

NGC4258,
As stated already those look to be access covers. To what I don't know. But since no one pointed out the Dracos.
Here are 3 pictures with them circled. Notice the last image has the launch covers on the Dracos. Making them
almost invisible.

Ned

[M.E.T.]

Commercial crew funding to date:

Boeing: $4.82 billion
SpaceX: $3.14 billion

https://twitter.com/SciGuySpace/status/1101231265834061824

For those keeping track, that's a $540M (21%) increase for SpaceX and $620M (15%) for Boeing. Funding gap between the two is now just shy of $1.7B, up from $1.6B in 2014.

Is that just for the capsule development or does it include the rocket launch as well? And if the latter, does Boeing’s fee include the payment to their launch provider - ULA, or will that be on top of the ridiculous amount they are already receiving?

[gongora]

Commercial crew funding to date:

Boeing: $4.82 billion
SpaceX: $3.14 billion

https://twitter.com/SciGuySpace/status/1101231265834061824

For those keeping track, that's a $540M (21%) increase for SpaceX and $620M (15%) for Boeing. Funding gap between the two is now just shy of $1.7B, up from $1.6B in 2014.

Is that just for the capsule development or does it include the rocket launch as well? And if the latter, does Boeing’s fee include the payment to their launch provider - ULA, or will that be on top of the amount they are already receiving?

It is for development of the complete system including launcher integration from the beginning of the Commercial Crew Program through the present (multiple contract rounds) and includes the minimum number of contracted launches to the space station (capsules, launchers, support, etc.).  The ULA launchers are provided by Boeing as part of the contract.

[WmThomas]

Questions about possible uses of superdracos and hypergolic fuel in orbit:

Crew Dragon carries into orbit superdracos, dracos, and extra hypergolic fuel (needed for superdraco aborts). What uses could those assets have in once Crew Dragon is in orbit?

Fuel load: is the fuel load more or less equal to Dragon V1's fuel load plus fuel for aborts, or is there just enough fuel for aborts, which also serves for normal draco activity on orbit?

Station reboost: Could Crew Dragon provide ISS reboost with its extra fuel? Could the IDA take the strain? If it can, and superdracos are too powerful, could normal dracos provide milder acceleration while still using the excess fuel?

Emergencies and Landing Problems: Could SpaceX be thinking that the fuel reserve could serve all the way to landing in some off-nominal scenarios? Fast station escape using superdracos if needed? Entry burn decelerating Dragon in an off-nominal de-orbit trajectory scenario? Superdracos for land landings?

Thoughts and comments are welcome.

[Jcc]

Questions about possible uses of superdracos and hypergolic fuel in orbit:

Crew Dragon carries into orbit superdracos, dracos, and extra hypergolic fuel (needed for superdraco aborts). What uses could those assets have in once Crew Dragon is in orbit?

Fuel load: is the fuel load more or less equal to Dragon V1's fuel load plus fuel for aborts, or is there just enough fuel for aborts, which also serves for normal draco activity on orbit?

Station reboost: Could Crew Dragon provide ISS reboost with its extra fuel? Could the IDA take the strain? If it can, and superdracos are too powerful, could normal dracos provide milder acceleration while still using the excess fuel?

Emergencies and Landing Problems: Could SpaceX be thinking that the fuel reserve could serve all the way to landing in some off-nominal scenarios? Fast station escape using superdracos if needed? Entry burn decelerating Dragon in an off-nominal de-orbit trajectory scenario? Superdracos for land landings?

Thoughts and comments are welcome.

Boeing discussed reboost using Starliner  LAS engines attached to the same IDA, and AFAIK, those engines are aligned through the Starliner CM ( not the ISS CM). The Shuttle did reboost also.  Superdracos are aligned more off center, so would have to be fired in pairs, maybe pulsed, to achieve the thrust required for reboost. It would help reduce the excess fuel weight during reentry, if they did use some for reboost.

[WmThomas]

Questions about possible uses of superdracos and hypergolic fuel in orbit:


Station reboost: Could Crew Dragon provide ISS reboost with its extra fuel? Could the IDA take the strain? If it can, and superdracos are too powerful, could normal dracos provide milder acceleration while still using the excess fuel?

...

Thoughts and comments are welcome.

Boeing discussed reboost using Starliner  LAS engines attached to the same IDA, and AFAIK, those engines are aligned through the Starliner CM ( not the ISS CM). The Shuttle did reboost also.  Superdracos are aligned more off center, so would have to be fired in pairs, maybe pulsed, to achieve the thrust required for reboost. It would help reduce the excess fuel weight during reentry, if they did use some for reboost.

Thanks. That's how I thought superdracos could be used. It's good to know the IDA isn't the issue.

[bronconut]

I have a question about Dragon 2 landing. How will the parachutes deploy? Are they under the cap and it needs to be opened or ejected?

[woods170]

I have a question about Dragon 2 landing. How will the parachutes deploy? Are they under the cap and it needs to be opened or ejected?

The parachutes are not under the nose cap. The main chutes are stowed in a bay directly underneath the side-hatch. The drogue chutes are deployed from mortar bays that are located above the main hatch. Rip-out lines connect the drogues with the mains.

So, no need to open or eject the nose cap for parachute deployment.

[punder]

Someone on r/spacex had an interesting question that I don't know the answer to.

What is this oval shaped thing beneath the SuperDraco engines?

I'm on my tablet and don't know how to get a screenshot. But go to the very beginning of yesterday's SpaceX webcast. A few seconds in, see the close-up of the SuperDracos firing. Those may be the actual nozzle covers.



Edit, maybe not, go about one minute into Scott Manleys new video.