SpaceX Dragon 2 Updates and Discussion - Thread 3

[matthewkantar]

Russia should insist on an abort with people aboard, I mean they just did it, why shouldn't NASA?

[Lars-J]

Russia should insist on an abort with people aboard, I mean they just did it, why shouldn't NASA?

I sure hope that was not a serious comment. 

[ShSch]

Hmm, someone is not happy. I don’t know the accuracy of the source but Roscosmos tweeting it is I think significant:

twitter.com/roscosmos/status/1269685590326419458

Google translate:

Cosmonaut Pavel Vinogradov: “If this ship (Crew Dragon) will fly, you can send anyone on it. But this madame, as we say, runs slightly ahead of the engine. First of all, this ship must be tested, certified, and then start flying on it ”...

https://twitter.com/roscosmos/status/1269685594411630592

... "The cost of launching Crew Dragon is much more than the launch of our" Union ". And when it is said that everything in Dragon is cheap and reliable, to put it mildly, not so. It's just that they want it, it's their desire. But they are far from normal life, ”said the Russian astronaut
https://nsn.fm/aviation-and-space/kosmonavt-obyasnil-otsutstvie-interesa-rossiiskih-astronavtov-k-crew-dragon

Can anyone provide a better translation? A lot of meaning seems to have been lost.

I second that. The original translation is rather confusing to say the least.

The translation is actually quite adequate. The original post in Russian is equally confusing Just replace "Union" with "Soyuz". The meaning is well summarized by "the Fox and the Grapes" fable.

P.S. The name of this mister (borrowing from his own language) translates to sour Grape, by the way. No pun was intended. Honest

[r8ix]

]
Can anyone provide a better translation? A lot of meaning seems to have been lost.

I second that. The original translation is rather confusing to say the least.

The translation is actually quite adequate. The original post in Russian is equally confusing Just replace "Union" with "Soyuz". The meaning is well summarized by "the Fox and the Grapes" fable.

P.S. The name of this mister (borrowing from his own language) translates to sour Grape, by the way. No pun was intended. Honest

Да. Кроме «Союз», перевод точно.

[guckyfan]

Union as translation seems to indicate it is about Federacija. Which should be a lot cheaper because it is just cardboard. But has no heritage and can't get to and from orbit.

[ShSch]

Union as translation seems to indicate it is about Federacija.

No, it is not. The Russian original explicitly mentions «Союз» in its genitive case (der Wes-Fall in German) «Союза». «Федерация» translates to, well, Federation.

[FutureSpaceTourist]

https://twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1270241861005950977

Dmitry Rogozin gave an interview to Forbes, where he said, that:
- Crew Dragon launch is not a big achievement;
- NASA didn’t thank Roscosmos for taking American astronauts to ISS for 9 years, and that hurts;
- Roscosmos has a lot of plans!
https://www.forbes.ru/tehnologii/402477-eto-ih-voyna-ne-nasha-dmitriy-rogozin-otvetil-na-zapusk-crew-dragon-ilona-maska

In the interview he also talks again about the amount of money the American taxpayer paid for new crew vehicles, as well as the excellent safety record of Soyuz with crew. A record that new vehicles have a long way to go before matching (my paraphrase).

So my impression is that the one substantive point wrt to Dragon and commercial crew is lack of proven reliability because it’s new.

[Cremalera]

You're kidding, right? What in the world does "But this madame, as we say, runs slightly ahead of the engine." mean?

You will never understand Russia. Mr. Vinogradov here speaks about the words of Ms.Stephanie L. Schierholz, NASA spokeswoman.When she spoke about the possible flight of Russian cosmonauts on the Crew Dragon.But he says what they wanted to hear from him.He receives a salary for this.But all other normal people now understand that the only chance of Roscosmos is to participate in the Lunar Gateway project.But here I am afraid that Rogozin will once again write about the trampoline and this russian participation will be canceled.

[schaban]

"It's just that they want it, it's their desire. But they are far from normal life"?

I would translate this as

“wishful thinking on their part. Far from a real life”

[TrevorMonty]

https://twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1270241861005950977

Dmitry Rogozin gave an interview to Forbes, where he said, that:
- Crew Dragon launch is not a big achievement;
- NASA didn’t thank Roscosmos for taking American astronauts to ISS for 9 years, and that hurts;
- Roscosmos has a lot of plans!
https://www.forbes.ru/tehnologii/402477-eto-ih-voyna-ne-nasha-dmitriy-rogozin-otvetil-na-zapusk-crew-dragon-ilona-maska

In the interview he also talks again about the amount of money the American taxpayer paid for new crew vehicles, as well as the excellent safety record of Soyuz with crew. A record that new vehicles have a long way to go before matching (my paraphrase).

So my impression is that the one substantive point wrt to Dragon and commercial crew is lack of proven reliability because it’s new.

NASA may not of thanked Russia for Soyuz rides but by same token didn't thank NASA for subsidizing Russia space program. Between Soyuz seats and RD180 Russia space industry has done alright out of US taxpayer over last 2 decades. NB almost all Atlas launches are government launches.

SpaceX is not only responsible for taking these two sources of income from Russia but also in killing off Proton commercial satellite business. To be fair Proton's poor reliability record didn't help.

[the_other_Doug]

"It's just that they want it, it's their desire. But they are far from normal life"?

I would translate this as

“wishful thinking on their part. Far from a real life”

And I think the line "But this, Madame, is running slightly ahead of the engine" would more reasonably translate into the English idiom that making arrangements for cosmonauts to fly on US vehicles before all of the test flights are done and the vehicles are certified would be "putting the cart before the horse"...

[Rocket Science]

Dmitry Rogozin... "Mr. Sour Grapes...

[JAFO]

Apologies, I'm sure this has been answered before: Compared to previous capsules, how many Gs will Dragon 2 be pulling during reentry?

Thanks

[FutureSpaceTourist]

https://twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1276904839839199233

Roscosmos published an article in Russian Space magazine this week about #CrewDragon flight. You can find it here: roscosmos.ru/media/pdf/russ…, and here is a quick summary of their thoughts of this flight.

twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1276905759125749760

The article says: For the Americans, the first crewed flight of the Crew Dragon is a really great achievement, allowing them to get rid of "Russian dependence" (which BTW wasn't imposed on them by no one).

https://twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1276906773404954624

Now they will be able to fly to the ISS on their own and take partners there – Europeans, Japanese, Canadians, and possibly Russians. As part of the exchange, Roscosmos will send American astronauts to the ISS on Soyuz. It will be mutually gratuitous process.

twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1276907139680919556

Crew Dragon + Falcon 9 is a more reliable system than Space Shuttle.

https://twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1276910003568459776

At the same time, the placement of the integrated emergency escape system with toxic fuel directly behind the cabin wall is alarming. Some experts question the safety of the crew because of this, and last year's explosion proves their doubts.

twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1276910995873636352

Of course, the Crew Dragon cabin is noticeably more spacious than the Soyuz, but it's oversized, since there are just 4 seats instead of 7 planned.

https://twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1276912026447687682

And despite the spacious modern interior, large windows and comfortable reclining seats, Crew Dragon can not provide some elements of comfort like normal toilets, which is still hidden behind the curtain, as is was on Space Shuttles.

[FutureSpaceTourist]

[Prettz]

I've never heard the interior of any spacecraft be described as "oversized".

[Nomadd]

I've never heard the interior of any spacecraft be described as "oversized".

The whole critique sounded a little stretched and petty.

[Vettedrmr]

I've never heard the interior of any spacecraft be described as "oversized".

The whole critique sounded a little stretched and petty.

I wasn't really going to comment on anything from Roscosmos, but while were at it, what's the toilet like on Soyuz?

[the_other_Doug]

I've never heard the interior of any spacecraft be described as "oversized".

The whole critique sounded a little stretched and petty.

I wasn't really going to comment on anything from Roscosmos, but while were at it, what's the toilet like on Soyuz?

It's stuck on the wall in the Soyuz orbital module.  So, when someone needs to use it, he/she can ask the other crew to go sit in the descent module until they're done.  Or, when the ISS toilets both break down, ISS crew can go use a Soyuz toilet.  Either way, they can close the hatches in question for privacy.

Privacy can easily be provided by a curtain -- after all, the door to the ISS loo is very little more than a curtain.  I would think the bigger issue would be air flow and odor filters, especially when you're making a stink... 

[FutureSpaceTourist]

Practice makes perfect

https://twitter.com/spacexfleet/status/1284483941693566976

Crew Dragon recovery ship GO Navigator is heading offshore to conduct a sea trial.

There's a mockup Dragon capsule on the deck and a sizeable group of people standing on the helipad above. 📸 visitspacecoast.com

https://twitter.com/spacexfleet/status/1284522518800412672

Wow! Views of the ongoing Crew Dragon recovery sea trial from the Disney Wonder cruise ship.

twitter.com/openkevin/status/1284521488855511040

Always fun to be at the right place and time!