Author Topic: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion  (Read 123693 times)

Offline Lar

  • Fan boy at large
  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10068
  • Saw Gemini live on TV
  • A large LEGO storage facility ... in Michigan
  • Liked: 6894
  • Likes Given: 4681
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #460 on: 12/23/2017 09:07 PM »
Yes - that fairing is big and it must be expensive. I'm starting to understand why SpaceX wants to recover them.

They say $5 million.
Six. And probably off topic, try the Fairing Reuse thread.
"I think it would be great to be born on Earth and to die on Mars. Just hopefully not at the point of impact." -Elon Musk
"We're a little bit like the dog who caught the bus" - Musk after CRS-8 S1 successfully landed on ASDS OCISLY

Offline TripD

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 615
  • E. Clampus Launchus
  • Liked: 476
  • Likes Given: 347
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #461 on: 12/23/2017 11:53 PM »
So, it's a convertible.  Ahhh, to feel the vacuum of space blowing against your face.

Offline guckyfan

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6652
  • Germany
  • Liked: 1721
  • Likes Given: 1666
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #462 on: 12/24/2017 12:03 AM »
my guess...seats had to be replaced at minimum... air pockets in foam + space = lots of debris
jb

Open cell cell foam shold not be a problem.

Offline rubtest

  • Member
  • Posts: 63
  • Liked: 23
  • Likes Given: 15
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #463 on: 12/24/2017 02:24 AM »
If I am not correct this Tesla Roadstar will achieve almost unbreakable speed record  in its class.

Online IanThePineapple

Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #464 on: 12/24/2017 02:28 AM »
my guess...seats had to be replaced at minimum... air pockets in foam + space = lots of debris
jb

Open cell cell foam shold not be a problem.

Poking holes in parts that may hold air pretty well is all that's needed really.

Offline Nomadd

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3077
  • Boca Chica, Texas
  • Liked: 4756
  • Likes Given: 309
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #465 on: 12/24/2017 03:20 AM »
 Does SpaceX have access to a big enough vacuum chamber to make sure nothing in the roadster explodes?

Offline envy887

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3994
  • Liked: 2060
  • Likes Given: 1236
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #466 on: 12/24/2017 03:30 AM »
Only bad thing is that with no antenna, stabilization, etc, they won't be able to beam images back to earth of it once it gets too far away. Or am I missing something?

Remember: pictures or it didn't happen.

It doesn't look to be separating from the second stage, or transmitting on it's own. It will phone home as long as the second stage lives.
How can anyone tell if that launch mount separates or not?

Under the car, the clamps may release on command, and there may be a push-off spring.

At a very minimum.

Given that SpaceX knows a thing or two about payloads, a small solar panel and a beacon don't seem far fetched, and would not require stabilization.

Me, I'd also put a nice retro-reflector on it, because if it was my car, I'd want to know where it is.

And a LoJack.

They don't have a license to transmit from the payload. Maybe they would film it floating away from the upper stage, but they wouldn't get any video from the car after separation.

Online pb2000

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 195
  • Calgary, AB/Mesquite, NV
  • Liked: 148
  • Likes Given: 76
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #467 on: 12/24/2017 03:37 AM »
Does SpaceX have access to a big enough vacuum chamber to make sure nothing in the roadster explodes?
They did manage to find one big enough to do full scale fairing separation tests, so something tells me finding one for a comparatively tiny roadster won't be a problem. That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if they actually have a large enough vacuum chamber on site in Hawthorne.
« Last Edit: 12/24/2017 03:39 AM by pb2000 »
Launches attended: Worldview-4 (Atlas V 401), Iridium NEXT Flight 1 (Falcon 9 FT), PAZ+Starlink (Falcon 9 FT)

Online IanThePineapple

Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #468 on: 12/24/2017 04:02 AM »
Does SpaceX have access to a big enough vacuum chamber to make sure nothing in the roadster explodes?
They did manage to find one big enough to do full scale fairing separation tests, so something tells me finding one for a comparatively tiny roadster won't be a problem. That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if they actually have a large enough vacuum chamber on site in Hawthorne.

Maybe up in Washington at their sat facility, since they'd need it soon anyway.

Offline ppb

  • Member
  • Posts: 64
  • San Francisco Bay Area
  • Liked: 33
  • Likes Given: 101
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #469 on: 12/24/2017 04:30 AM »
Where is the rest of the ballast? That Roadster is only 3 Mg max.
Quam celerrime ad astra

Offline mikelepage

Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #470 on: 12/24/2017 05:18 AM »
Haven't seen this posted elsewhere, but if all goes well, this could be a useful exploratory experiment to find out about propellent boil-off times over a full-length transit to Mars? Has anyone actually sent a liquid-fuelled rocket to Mars before?

- They already have a camera in the second stage LOX tank.
- They can try pointing the second stage towards the sun after TMI to quantify how this slows down boil-off rates, which will improve the accuracy of their models for BFR.
- The angled tesla might even help to reflect some of the light away or radiate some excess heat.

Who knows, if it works well enough, they might even have some left by the time they reach Mars periapsis.  They could try relighting the stage to try and settle into a (very) high Martian orbit.  If it fails, they fly by Mars and no harm is done, but if it succeeds, then what a monument for the future people of Mars!

Offline Nomadd

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3077
  • Boca Chica, Texas
  • Liked: 4756
  • Likes Given: 309
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #471 on: 12/24/2017 05:40 AM »
Haven't seen this posted elsewhere, but if all goes well, this could be a useful exploratory experiment to find out about propellent boil-off times over a full-length transit to Mars? Has anyone actually sent a liquid-fuelled rocket to Mars before?

- They already have a camera in the second stage LOX tank.
- They can try pointing the second stage towards the sun after TMI to quantify how this slows down boil-off rates, which will improve the accuracy of their models for BFR.
- The angled tesla might even help to reflect some of the light away or radiate some excess heat.

Who knows, if it works well enough, they might even have some left by the time they reach Mars periapsis.  They could try relighting the stage to try and settle into a (very) high Martian orbit.  If it fails, they fly by Mars and no harm is done, but if it succeeds, then what a monument for the future people of Mars!
Extending the life of the stage from minutes to months is a little more complicated than that.

Offline biosehnsucht

  • Full Member
  • **
  • Posts: 265
  • Liked: 83
  • Likes Given: 120
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #472 on: 12/24/2017 07:39 AM »

They don't have a license to transmit from the payload. Maybe they would film it floating away from the upper stage, but they wouldn't get any video from the car after separation.

1) Do we know if they intend to separate the "payload" from S2 ? (and if not, could they just keep using S2's license until the stage dies)

2) Would they need a license for optical communication ? (they have those test sats going up soon in theory, perhaps they could do some more "testing" with optical gear on PAF and Roadster, then use S2's license to retransmit over RF)

Offline Johnnyhinbos

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1325
  • Boston, MA
  • Liked: 1465
  • Likes Given: 211
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #473 on: 12/24/2017 10:31 AM »
For the folks thinking the Tesla is permanently attached to the payload adaptor, no... Payload separation systems are a solved problem. I forget who SpaceX uses - I think Planetary Systems Corp - but I went down this rabbit hole many months ago.

The Tesla will separate, just like any other payload. Do you honestly think Elon would have it any other way? Put on your Elon Hat (he has one) and think Elonish...

http://www.planetarysystemscorp.com
John Hanzl. Author, action / adventure www.johnhanzl.com

Offline First Mate Rummey

  • Member
  • Posts: 45
  • Liked: 32
  • Likes Given: 17
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #474 on: 12/24/2017 11:33 AM »
It would make some more sense to me to maximize the publicity for Tesla to launch the new roadster than the old one which is no longer available to buy.

Offline Rocket Science

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8600
  • NASA Educator Astronaut Candidate Applicant 2002
  • Liked: 2650
  • Likes Given: 6783
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #475 on: 12/24/2017 12:04 PM »
It would make some more sense to me to maximize the publicity for Tesla to launch the new roadster than the old one which is no longer available to buy.
Yes, but this more about the Elon Musk brand; "the man, the myth, his rockets and his cars"...
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator, Vintage auto racer

Offline Barrie

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 439
  • Planets are a waste of space
  • Liked: 210
  • Likes Given: 2676
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #476 on: 12/24/2017 12:54 PM »
It would make some more sense to me to maximize the publicity for Tesla to launch the new roadster than the old one which is no longer available to buy.

EM has explained at length how the original Roadster was something of a lemon, so i think it will be spun as 'out with the old, in with the new'

Offline Johnnyhinbos

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1325
  • Boston, MA
  • Liked: 1465
  • Likes Given: 211
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #477 on: 12/24/2017 01:06 PM »
It would make some more sense to me to maximize the publicity for Tesla to launch the new roadster than the old one which is no longer available to buy.

EM has explained at length how the original Roadster was something of a lemon, so i think it will be spun as 'out with the old, in with the new'
Obviously, since there’s no sign of landing legs on that Roadster...
John Hanzl. Author, action / adventure www.johnhanzl.com

Offline nacnud

  • Extreme Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2214
  • Liked: 369
  • Likes Given: 177
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #478 on: 12/24/2017 01:10 PM »
It would make some more sense to me to maximize the publicity for Tesla to launch the new roadster than the old one which is no longer available to buy.

EM has explained at length how the original Roadster was something of a lemon, so i think it will be spun as 'out with the old, in with the new'
Obviously, since there’s no sign of landing legs on that Roadster...
It has landing wheels.....

Offline sghill

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1353
  • United States
  • Liked: 1505
  • Likes Given: 2147
Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #479 on: 12/24/2017 01:45 PM »
IMHO, The Tesla will separate, just like any other payload. Do you honestly think Elon would have it any other way? Put on your Elon Hat (he has one) and think Elonish...

http://www.planetarysystemscorp.com

Fixed that for you.

Aside from the added complexity of separating the roadster from the booster, they have no FCC communications license for the "payload". In which case, why bother?

If the roadster separates, there will be no images or video, just the mounting platform drifting away from the booster. If the roadster remains attached and the whole thing blasts into heliocentric orbit, we get photos, video, and David Bowie (presumably not heard by anyone) until the batteries run out on the second stage.

« Last Edit: 12/24/2017 02:11 PM by sghill »
Bring the thunder Elon!

Tags: