Author Topic: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion  (Read 126659 times)

Online IanThePineapple

Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #440 on: 12/23/2017 02:46 AM »
Only bad thing is that with no antenna, stabilization, etc, they won't be able to beam images back to earth of it once it gets too far away. Or am I missing something?

Remember: pictures or it didn't happen.

It doesn't look to be separating from the second stage, or transmitting on it's own. It will phone home as long as the second stage lives.
I don't know....A 75kwh battery pack, jigger the suspension so the wheels can face odd angles and use them for reaction wheels....

My goodness... That's genius  ;D

Offline Lars-J

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Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #441 on: 12/23/2017 04:58 AM »
The idea of Tesla Roadster in Space is delightfully whimsical, but I can't help thinking of the wasted opportunity. There are hundreds of student experimental payloads desperate for a launch opportunity; why not offer them a ride?

To do what? How would those payloads be able to communicate out of LEO? Theyíd just be student experimental dead mass instead of Elonís dead mass.

Not to mention the Lunar X Prize entrants.  Pretty much all of them are dependent on cheap rideshares on other launchers, since they are all operating on shoestring budgets. This could have been a golden opportunity to get them all to their destination in one fell swoop!

How many lunar X entrants are ready to fly? Exactly zero, I believe. Besides, a lunar trajectory places restrictions on the launch window, something you DONíT want for an experimental launch.

Geez, people seem to think that ready to fly payloads are just sitting around waiting to go, since people are suggesting bigelow modules and whatever else... Címon, think about it!
« Last Edit: 12/23/2017 04:59 AM by Lars-J »

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #442 on: 12/23/2017 06:51 AM »
Higher resolution images now released by SpaceX

Offline zhangmdev

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #443 on: 12/23/2017 09:52 AM »
Awesome view of inner side of the fairing. A lot more bottles and tubing than expected.

Offline mike721

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #444 on: 12/23/2017 12:29 PM »
WOW!
They really ARE going to launch Elon's car!
That's awesome!

These pictures give me a better idea of just how big that fairing really is, I guess I never really appreciated the size until now... it looks like they could have launched the new Tesla Semi Truck if he had wanted to..or maybe they are saving that for the first flight of the BFR...

Offline aero

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #445 on: 12/23/2017 02:24 PM »
Yes - that fairing is big and it must be expensive. I'm starting to understand why SpaceX wants to recover them.
Retired, working interesting problems

Offline wannamoonbase

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #446 on: 12/23/2017 02:32 PM »
Elon tweeted:

"Falcon Heavy launching from same @NASA pad as the Saturn V Apollo 11 moon rocket. It was 50% higher thrust with five F-1 engines at 7.5M lb-F. I love that rocket so much."

Maybe, as a homage to the Saturn V, he could put this LEGO set in the trunk... - Space aliens will be building a LEGO Saturn V millions of years into the future and grasp the true genius of mankind!


Also a Commodore Vic-20 which was Elon Musk's first computer.

I have 2 Vic 20ís, he can have 1 of mine.

I like that he loves the Saturn V, itís such an amazing accomplishment.  But after 50 years Iím ready for a larger one.
SpaceX, just a few things planned for 2018: FH, Starlink Prototypes, Block 5, Dragon 2, Increased launch rate.

Offline wannamoonbase

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #447 on: 12/23/2017 02:33 PM »
Yes - that fairing is big and it must be expensive. I'm starting to understand why SpaceX wants to recover them.

They say $5 million.
SpaceX, just a few things planned for 2018: FH, Starlink Prototypes, Block 5, Dragon 2, Increased launch rate.

Offline aero

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #448 on: 12/23/2017 02:39 PM »
Yes - that fairing is big and it must be expensive. I'm starting to understand why SpaceX wants to recover them.

They say $5 million.

Hmm  -  $5 million is a chunk of change but it doesn't seem like that would be the sole driver for the recovery efforts. Does it take a lot of time to build a fairing? Maybe construction time is a driver for the recovery efforts. What else might the driver be?
Retired, working interesting problems

Offline nacnud

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #449 on: 12/23/2017 02:42 PM »
The reasoning goes something like; there is $5M falling through the sky, you just have to catch it. Oh and it's going to happen 30 times next year. 

Offline Johnnyhinbos

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #450 on: 12/23/2017 02:51 PM »
Exactly. Elon has said this in the past. If someone pushes a palette out of a plane with $5,000,000 in cash stacked on it, wouldnít you want to catch it? And to extend that to what nacnud said, what if it held $150,000,000? Seems justifiable to me... And thatís just over one year. Extend that out for years. Donít you think itís worth the development cost up front?

I guess if you are just about every other rocket company out there, the short sighted answer would be, ďAll that effort just to recover $5,000,000 in hardware? Ha, thatís rich! ď
John Hanzl. Author, action / adventure www.johnhanzl.com

Offline sevenperforce

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #451 on: 12/23/2017 02:52 PM »
Hmm  -  $5 million is a chunk of change but it doesn't seem like that would be the sole driver for the recovery efforts. Does it take a lot of time to build a fairing? Maybe construction time is a driver for the recovery efforts. What else might the driver be?
Construction time is another bottleneck, yes.

But mostly cost.

Offline deruch

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #452 on: 12/23/2017 02:55 PM »
Yes - that fairing is big and it must be expensive. I'm starting to understand why SpaceX wants to recover them.

They say $5 million.

Hmm  -  $5 million is a chunk of change but it doesn't seem like that would be the sole driver for the recovery efforts. Does it take a lot of time to build a fairing? Maybe construction time is a driver for the recovery efforts. What else might the driver be?

1)  As Elon has said, "Imagine there was a pallet of 6 million dollars falling out of the sky.  Wouldn't you try to go recover it?"  Yes, you would. 

2)  Fairing production takes up a lot of factory floor space and is slow.  With the rate of launches that SpaceX is ramping up to, if they can't recover and reuse them, they will soon need to institute a second line making fairings.  That is both a large capital investment for the tooling/ovens and a big space investment.  So long as they are launching fewer than the number where they would have to start a second line, it's probably not a big money saver to recover (though every little bit helps).  But as soon as they start butting up to that limit, it becomes a big money saver.
Shouldn't reality posts be in "Advanced concepts"?  --Nomadd

Offline cscott

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #453 on: 12/23/2017 03:13 PM »
Yes - that fairing is big and it must be expensive. I'm starting to understand why SpaceX wants to recover them.

They say $5 million.

Hmm  -  $5 million is a chunk of change but it doesn't seem like that would be the sole driver for the recovery efforts. Does it take a lot of time to build a fairing? Maybe construction time is a driver for the recovery efforts. What else might the driver be?
It is also difficult and time consuming to manufacture, involving long bake times in giant composite curing ovens as big as a fairing half.  They cost a lot of money to build and the curing takes a long time.  So in order to speed up production of the fairings (and thus flight rate), you either have to spend $$$ building a bunch of new ovens (in a bunch of new buildings)... or start recovering fairing halves.

EDIT: yeah, what @deruch said. ;)
« Last Edit: 12/23/2017 03:14 PM by cscott »

Offline nacnud

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #454 on: 12/23/2017 03:19 PM »
Interestingly they only have to recover one half of the fairing to effectively double the launches they can support... OK it's a truism but that gets them the ability to launch 60 times a year. :o (just considering fairings)
« Last Edit: 12/23/2017 04:01 PM by nacnud »

Online meekGee

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #455 on: 12/23/2017 03:39 PM »
Only bad thing is that with no antenna, stabilization, etc, they won't be able to beam images back to earth of it once it gets too far away. Or am I missing something?

Remember: pictures or it didn't happen.

It doesn't look to be separating from the second stage, or transmitting on it's own. It will phone home as long as the second stage lives.
How can anyone tell if that launch mount separates or not?

Under the car, the clamps may release on command, and there may be a push-off spring.

At a very minimum.

Given that SpaceX knows a thing or two about payloads, a small solar panel and a beacon don't seem far fetched, and would not require stabilization.

Me, I'd also put a nice retro-reflector on it, because if it was my car, I'd want to know where it is.

And a LoJack.
ABCD - Always Be Counting Down

Offline Herb Schaltegger

Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #456 on: 12/23/2017 04:15 PM »
Interestingly they only have to recover one half of the fairing to effectively double the launches they can support... OK it's a truism but that gets them the ability to launch 60 times a year. :o (just considering fairings)

Not quite - the fairings are unique halves. And that also assumes return, inspection and refurbishment are trouble-free and no real re-work or repair is required. I think it'll be awhile until they're at that point. But bravo to SpaceX for trying and pushing the technology.

Now, all this talk of fairing recovery isn't really on-point for this thread. The Mods are going to get angry. :)
« Last Edit: 12/23/2017 04:16 PM by Herb Schaltegger »
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Offline Rocket Science

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #457 on: 12/23/2017 04:28 PM »
Elon tweeted:

"Falcon Heavy launching from same @NASA pad as the Saturn V Apollo 11 moon rocket. It was 50% higher thrust with five F-1 engines at 7.5M lb-F. I love that rocket so much."

Maybe, as a homage to the Saturn V, he could put this LEGO set in the trunk... - Space aliens will be building a LEGO Saturn V millions of years into the future and grasp the true genius of mankind!


Also a Commodore Vic-20 which was Elon Musk's first computer.

I have 2 Vic 20ís, he can have 1 of mine.

I like that he loves the Saturn V, itís such an amazing accomplishment.  But after 50 years Iím ready for a larger one.
Still have mine MIB... ;)
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator, Vintage auto racer

Offline zhangmdev

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #458 on: 12/23/2017 04:30 PM »
Back to the payload. Any visible modification to the car? Anything removed or added? I just see a car, albeit an unusual one.

Offline jabe

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Re: Falcon Heavy Demo Mission Payload Discussion
« Reply #459 on: 12/23/2017 04:37 PM »
my guess...seats had to be replaced at minimum... air pockets in foam + space = lots of debris
jb

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