Author Topic: SpaceX Falcon 9 : Telstar 18 Vantage/Apstar-5C : Sept 10, 2018 - DISCUSSION  (Read 68356 times)

Online gongora

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DISCUSSION thread for Telstar 18 Vantage/Apstar-5C

NSF Threads for Telstar 18 Vantage/Apstar-5C : Discussion / Updates / Party
NSF Articles for Telstar 18 Vantage/Apstar-5C :
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/?s=TELSTAR

Successful launch September 10, 2018 at 00:45 EDT (04:45 UTC) on Falcon 9 (new booster 1049) from SLC-40 at Cape Canaveral.  Payload mass 7060kg.  ASDS landing was successful.

Other SpaceX resources on NASASpaceflight:
   SpaceX News Articles (Recent)  /   SpaceX News Articles from 2006 (Including numerous exclusive Elon interviews)
   SpaceX Dragon Articles  /  SpaceX Missions Section (with Launch Manifest and info on past and future missions)
   L2 SpaceX Section




Telesat Press Release
SSL Press Release
Telesat: Telstar 18 Vantage page

[SpaceNews Dec. 25, 2015] Telesat, APT Partner on Replacement of Joint Satellite
Quote
Satellite fleet operators Telesat of Canada and APT Satellite Co. Ltd. of Hong Kong have agreed to divide the cost of a new satellite to replace their jointly owned Telstar 18/Apstar-5 at 138 degrees east, with the successor, called Telstar 18 Vantage/Apstar-5C, to be built by Space Systems Loral and launched in early 2018.

The satellite will carry 63 C- and Ku-band transponders, including both regional Ku- and C-band beams and a high-throughput (HTS) Ku-band payload. It will be Ottawa-based Telesat’s third Ku-band HTS-equipped satellite...

In a Dec. 24 statement to the Hong Kong Stock Exchange, APT said it would be paying a London-based subsidiary of Telesat a total of $118.83 million for a 57.47 percent share of the satellite’s resources, which the company said is equivalent to 36.2 transponders. The satellite will be capable of generating 14 kilowatts of power to its payload at the end of its service life of more than 15 years.

Telstar 18 Vantage/Apstar-5C on Gunter's Space Page
« Last Edit: 09/10/2018 01:25 pm by input~2 »

Online gongora

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APSTAR-5C satellite entered into AIT phase
Quote
18/08/2017

As of Aug 2017, the construction of the APSTAR-5C satellite has made significant progress. System CDR was conducted successfully in September 2016, the result showed the performance of the satellite is in line with specifications. Currently the satellite has entered into the AIT (assembly, integration and test) phase, mating process of SM (service module) and CM (communication module) has been conducted successfully. Installation and testing for each subsystem is under way.

Current schedule shows that APSTAR-5C will be ready for shipment in the first half of 2018, then be launched by SpaceX’s Falcon-9, and replace the in-orbit APSTAR-5 satellite in the second half of 2018. Through APSTAR-5C, we will be able to maintain highly reliable services for our existing customers on APSTAR-5 satellite, assuring their businesses not be interrupted by the replacement. Meanwhile, APSTAR-5C satellite will carry more transponders, and expand to broader service areas, especially its high-throughput (HTS) capacities will satisfy growing market demand in Southeast Asia.

Online gongora

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FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE (From SSL)

June 21, 2018

Maxar’s SSL ships first of three advanced communications satellites scheduled to launch on the SpaceX Falcon 9 this summer

Commercially driven advances help SSL customers to connect people and transform lives around the world

Palo Alto, Calif. – SSL, a Maxar Technologies company (formerly MacDonald, Dettwiler and Associates Ltd.) (NYSE: MAXR, TSX: MAXR), today announced it shipped the first of three satellites that SSL will deliver to the SpaceX launch base at Cape Canaveral Air Force Station in Florida over the next month. Driven by commercial advances, the three satellites will bring communications capability to connect people and transform lives around the globe.

Telstar 19 VANTAGE, an advanced high throughput satellite (HTS) built for Telesat, one of the world’s leading satellite operators, marks the 50th SSL-built communications satellite to launch this decade. It arrived safely at the launch base this week for a launch scheduled next month.

Two more SSL communications satellites are scheduled to ship to SpaceX launch base over the next month including a second HTS for Telesat, Telstar 18 VANTAGE, and the Merah Putih satellite (previously known as Telkom-4), for Indonesia’s largest telecommunication and network provider, PT Telkom Indonesia (Persero) Tbk.

“SSL has a long legacy of leveraging its commercial mindset to provide satellite operators with spacecraft systems that address their requirements and enable global transformation,” said Dario Zamarian, group president, SSL. “The cadence this month of shipping out three satellites for launch demonstrates our ongoing market leadership and commitment to quality, reliability, and performance.”

Telstar 19 VANTAGE

Telstar 19 VANTAGE is one of a new generation of Telesat spacecraft designed to serve today’s bandwidth intensive applications. It will support a range of services, including advanced broadband connectivity for consumer, enterprise and mobility users across the Americas and Atlantic from its prime orbital location of 63 degrees West, the same location used today by Telesat’s Telstar 14R.

Like all Telesat VANTAGE satellites, Telstar 19 VANTAGE combines broad regional beams and powerful HTS spot beams enabling customers to maximize throughput and spectral efficiency while optimizing network performance. Its Ka-band HTS capacity will serve Telesat customers operating in Northern Canada, the Caribbean, the North Atlantic Ocean, and South America. Additional Ku-band HTS spot beams will serve growing South American markets in Brazil and the Andean region. Telstar 19 VANTAGE will also bring new Ku-band broadbeam capacity over the North Atlantic Ocean enhancing Telesat’s coverage of this important mobility market.

Telstar 18 VANTAGE

Telstar 18 VANTAGE, the third HTS in Telesat’s global fleet, will be located at 138 degrees East, an ideal position for connecting Asia to the Americas. It will replace and expand on the capabilities of Telesat’s Telstar 18 satellite through its extensive C-band coverage of Asia, its Ku-band HTS spot beams over Indonesia and Malaysia, and its six additional Ku-band regional beams. These high performance beams will enable Telstar 18 VANTAGE to meet growing demand for mobility, enterprise networks and telecom services across the Asia region. As previously announced, Telesat has partnered with APT Satellite of Hong Kong in the design and procurement of this spacecraft, which APT calls Apstar-5C. 

“Telesat has worked closely with SSL and the Maxar family of companies for many years and we are pleased to have collaborated with them on our newest Telstar VANTAGE high throughput satellites,” said Dan Goldberg, President and CEO of Telesat. “These state-of-the-art spacecraft are going to provide important competitive advantages for our customers across the Americas and Asia. It’s great news that Telstar 19 VANTAGE is now at the launch base and that Telstar 18 VANTAGE is nearly finished and in the queue to ship.”

Merah Putih

Merah Putih, a name which represents the red and white of the Indonesian flag, will be integrated into Telkom’s greater telecommunications network to provide service throughout the 17 thousand islands of the Indonesian archipelago, as well as India and other parts of South and Southeast Asia. Satellite forms the telecommunications backbone that connects Indonesia, along with other technologies, such as submarine cable.

Merah Putih, which was completed ahead of schedule, will replace Telkom-1, at 108 degrees East, where it will expand on Telkom’s coverage to serve new markets. Its all C-band payload will enhance both internet and telephone service for populations in remote regions and offload backhaul for cellular service.

“Satellite plays a vital role in our telecommunications infrastructure,” said Mr. Mr. Zulhelfi Abidin, Chief Technology Officer of Telkom. “SSL has been an excellent spacecraft supplier and has completed the satellite construction ahead of schedule. We look forward to traveling to Florida to see the satellite launch later this summer.”

Offline ChrisGebhardt

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HAWTHORNE, Calif. – July 14, 2018. Media accreditation is now open for SpaceX's Telstar 18 VANTAGE mission from Space Launch Complex 40 (SLC-40) at Cape Canaveral Air Force Station in Florida. The launch is targeted for no earlier than August.
 
A Falcon 9 rocket will deliver Telstar 18 VANTAGE to a geostationary transfer orbit (GTO).

Offline vaporcobra

HAWTHORNE, Calif. – July 14, 2018. Media accreditation is now open for SpaceX's Telstar 18 VANTAGE mission from Space Launch Complex 40 (SLC-40) at Cape Canaveral Air Force Station in Florida. The launch is targeted for no earlier than August.
 
A Falcon 9 rocket will deliver Telstar 18 VANTAGE to a geostationary transfer orbit (GTO).

Accreditation is due by August 13th, so second half of August is a good bare-minimum NET.

Offline ChrisGebhardt

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HAWTHORNE, Calif. – July 14, 2018. Media accreditation is now open for SpaceX's Telstar 18 VANTAGE mission from Space Launch Complex 40 (SLC-40) at Cape Canaveral Air Force Station in Florida. The launch is targeted for no earlier than August.
 
A Falcon 9 rocket will deliver Telstar 18 VANTAGE to a geostationary transfer orbit (GTO).

Accreditation is due by August 13th, so second half of August is a good bare-minimum NET.

To give a little more clarity, earliest would be NET 19 August based on passed accred deadlines for US citizens (6 days before launch) -- which also fits with 17 July as the deadline for Foreign Nationals (as those requests have to be in no later than 30 days before launch).
« Last Edit: 07/14/2018 08:20 pm by ChrisGebhardt »

Offline ChrisGebhardt

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Launch is on the Range for NET 17 August per L2 info and what is now live on site in the Parker Solar Probe update article.
« Last Edit: 07/17/2018 05:36 pm by ChrisGebhardt »

Offline Ragmar

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Any word on whether SSL has actually shipped the satellite to the Cape yet?

Online crandles57

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Do we know which booster yet?

B1047.2 ? same as Telstar 19V? 22 July 18 to 17/18 August, less than a month? Possible with block 5?

B1046.2 ? Flew May 11 but was going for months of tests.

B1048.2 ? flying from Vandenberg so more likely reuse also from Vandenberg with SAOCOM July 25th to Sept 5th

B1050 ? B1049 flying 2 Aug, so doesn't seem like B1050 would be ready?


Offline Jakusb

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Do we know which booster yet?

B1047.2 ? same as Telstar 19V? 22 July 18 to 17/18 August, less than a month? Possible with block 5?

B1046.2 ? Flew May 11 but was going for months of tests.

B1048.2 ? flying from Vandenberg so more likely reuse also from Vandenberg with SAOCOM July 25th to Sept 5th

B1050 ? B1049 flying 2 Aug, so doesn't seem like B1050 would be ready?

No, not known yet.
My money would be on 1050, with 1046-2 resurfacing at West coast for SOACOM-1A.
But this is a wild guess, based on currently available info and trends.

Offline ChrisGebhardt

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B1049 arrives at SLC-40

Offline abaddon

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It looks so clean!  It feels strange that the sight of a new booster arriving will pretty shortly be a rarity.

Offline douglas100

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That's strange. It's out at the pad next to the TEL. Maybe they're taking it in through the door on the pad side for some reason?
Douglas Clark

Online gongora

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That's strange. It's out at the pad next to the TEL. Maybe they're taking it in through the door on the pad side for some reason?

Isn't that normal at SLC-40?  It's set up different from LC-39A, there is a (seldom-used) payload processing space on the back of the hangar.

Offline douglas100

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Yes, I knew that processing space was at the back of the hangar but I thought it was isolated from the entrance on that side. Anyway, thanks for that.
Douglas Clark

Offline Jakusb

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B1049 arrives at SLC-40
Visual confirmation it actually is 1049?
And where did it come from? LC39A-HIF?
Same as one seen heading into Florida last week? Or certain it was here earlier?

Offline Alexphysics

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One of the engineers of this satellite told on reddit that this satellite's mass is about 3000lbs less than Telstar 19V, so that's a mass of ~5.7 metric tons, similar to Telkom 4.

Quote
About 3000 lbs less than T19V.

I could have had exact but really my only concern is temps and pressure, I trust the propulsion team to know their target weights.

Offline wannamoonbase

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B1049 arrives at SLC-40
Visual confirmation it actually is 1049?
And where did it come from? LC39A-HIF?
Same as one seen heading into Florida last week? Or certain it was here earlier?

Wasting no time in reloading the hangar.  Seems they could launch quicker than the payloads are ready.

Curious, the landing legs are not attached.  It's a new core and they don't ship across the country with the legs on, but I thought we might start seeing them on the boosters.
Starship, Vulcan and Ariane 6 have all reached orbit.  New Glenn, well we are waiting!

Offline ChrisGebhardt

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B1049 arrives at SLC-40
Visual confirmation it actually is 1049?
And where did it come from? LC39A-HIF?
Same as one seen heading into Florida last week? Or certain it was here earlier?

Yes, it's B1049.  It was clearly marked.  The camera I had with me (how knew this was gonna happen) wasn't strong enough to capture the small serial number where the grid fins will be, but other cameras were.  It's B1049.

And it was coming from the LC-39A HIF.
« Last Edit: 08/08/2018 12:39 pm by ChrisGebhardt »

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Quote
Prelaunch campaign @SpaceX #Telstar18v staticfiretest for launch NET Aug23 has begun!Evidenced by TE up at #pad40 noon today-minus booster. By 1245PM lowered,planes flew overhead/landed.I saw 1st stage arrive last week during #merahputih . @ken_kremer spaceupclose.com

https://twitter.com/ken_kremer/status/1030149501263245312

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Launch has slipped 2 days.

New launch day and window:

25 August at 23:33 EDT to 03:33 EDT on 26th.... which is 26 August from 0333-0733 UTC.

Offline shuttlefan

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Launch has slipped 2 days.

New launch day and window:

25 August at 23:33 EDT to 03:33 EDT on 26th.... which is 26 August from 0333-0733 UTC.

Static fire date?

Offline sayidreddy

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Payload Vehicle engineer for Telstar 18 on Reddit says there is a 5-10 day delay for the launch, may not be in August. Any confirmation for this?

https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comments/95cte4/telstar_18v_apstar_5c_launch_campaign_thread/e4kgxuw/?context=3
« Last Edit: 08/21/2018 02:36 pm by sayidreddy »

Offline Comga

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Payload Vehicle engineer for Telstar 18 on Reddit says there is a 5-10 day delay for the launch, may not be in August. Any confirmation for this?

https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comments/95cte4/telstar_18v_apstar_5c_launch_campaign_thread/e4kgxuw/?context=3

Quote
Hate to tease you but right now there is no officially released reason so I can't say. Even being on the customer side they won't tell me too much.
Sounds like it's on the rocket side.
:(
A 24 day gap is no way to hit a 30 launch per year pace, especially when it's followed by a 30 day gap.
SpaceX may be remedying Shotwell's forecasted slowdown in 2019 by having a bunch slip in from 2018.
edit: My list now has 35 launches in 2019.  We shall see.
« Last Edit: 08/21/2018 03:25 pm by Comga »
What kind of wastrels would dump a perfectly good booster in the ocean after just one use?

Offline marsbase

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A 24 day gap is no way to hit a 30 launch per year pace, especially when it's followed by a 30 day gap.
I don't think SpaceX can be criticized for being slow about launching rockets, since they launch more than anyone else in the world.  If they aren't launching,there is a good reason.  Public criticism of delays probably played a role in NASA launching the Challenger under adverse conditions. That's what I think of when someone says SpaceX should go faster.

Offline OccasionalTraveller

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We already know that there is a brand new Block 5 booster at the Cape for this mission - I believe this time it has actually been photographed in enough detail to identify it unambiguously as B1049.

We also know that subsequent boosters are in production flow, at least one later having been seen at McGregor. I feel the community is over-confident in identification, but I believe this sighting was made after seeing B1049 moving between sites at the Cape, and the booster on the test stand was clearly new. I find it hard to believe, given that the production line is somewhat flexible between first and second stages, that SpaceX would fail to complete an upper stage required for this mission, in preference to completing a booster for a later one (possibly not even for the following mission).

That leaves us with:

* Fairings
* Payload
* Possible retro-fitting of COPV 2.0
* Switching to pre-flown booster

Payload fairings have typically been the long-pole item. There seems to have been possible damage in transit before, necessitating flying a fairing back to Hawthorne then return to the Cape, using one of the Antonov planes.

The payload itself - has SSL actually confirmed shipping it to the Cape? When Telstar 19V shipped in June, Telstar 18V was described as 'nearly finished and in the queue to ship.' I can't see a press release regarding shipping 18V and it's not mentioned in any other Maxar/SSL release since then.

The first booster known to feature the new COPVs is B1051, but that is now delayed to November. SpaceX may want to bring them into service sooner so they can demonstrate them on earlier flights. However, replacing them on a built booster waiting to go into service, and delaying the launch thereby, doesn't seem like it would be acceptable to the customer. The customer doesn't benefit at all from this.

Finally, our assumption of using the new booster may be mistaken. It could be that this is really a re-flight of B1047, previously used for Telstar 19V, and that it's actually taking longer to refurbish than hoped. The customer might be prepared to wait for SpaceX to do so if they can get a $10m discount. This wouldn't explain why SpaceX have transported B1049 across the Cape from SLC-40 to 39A and back again, though!

For what it's worth, I think the payload is delayed, with a side bet on fairing issues.

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Offline Nehkara

I have a theory.

Telkom-4 (Merah Putih) was originally expected to launch on F9 core B1049.  Unexpectedly after having loaded that core into the SLC-40 hangar in preparations for flight they pulled it out and took it back to the LC-39A hangar and the sooty and flight proven B1046 was moved into the SLC-40 hangar and ended up being the rocket that performed the mission.

Now here we are and B1049 is scheduled to launch Telstar 18V and the mission was delayed from August 16th to 23rd to 25th and now into September.

I'm wondering if there is something wrong with that booster that's taking longer than expected to fix?

Online Steven Pietrobon

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I don't think SpaceX can be criticized for being slow about launching rockets, since they launch more than anyone else in the world.

That's a myth. China has launched 22 times this year compared to SpaceX with 15 launches.
Akin's Laws of Spacecraft Design #1:  Engineering is done with numbers.  Analysis without numbers is only an opinion.

Offline Alexphysics

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I have a theory.

Telkom-4 (Merah Putih) was originally expected to launch on F9 core B1049.  Unexpectedly after having loaded that core into the SLC-40 hangar in preparations for flight they pulled it out and took it back to the LC-39A hangar and the sooty and flight proven B1046 was moved into the SLC-40 hangar and ended up being the rocket that performed the mission.

Now here we are and B1049 is scheduled to launch Telstar 18V and the mission was delayed from August 16th to 23rd to 25th and now into September.

I'm wondering if there is something wrong with that booster that's taking longer than expected to fix?

Not to deny your theory but B1046.2 was put into SLC-40 right after Telstar 19V, so the part about B1049 being moved first for this flight doesn't match what I know.

Offline marsbase

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That's a myth. China has launched 22 times this year compared to SpaceX with 15 launches.
How can I track this?  Does China have a website that lists their manifest?

Offline envy887

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That's a myth. China has launched 22 times this year compared to SpaceX with 15 launches.
How can I track this?  Does China have a website that lists their manifest?

There is a summary of global launches over in the General Discussion section here, and also Ed Kyle tracks all orbital launches on his website: http://spacelaunchreport.com/log2018.html#stats

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Offline OnWithTheShow

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An An-124 flight landed at MCO yesterday... any ideas what it was for?

Online gongora

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An An-124 flight landed at MCO yesterday... any ideas what it was for?

Flights to Orlando have nothing to do with stuff at the Cape (and there have been a couple of those flights between Orlando and Paris recently).

Online gongora

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If you want to discuss the flight rates of China and SpaceX please create a separate thread, or maybe use the POLL: Number of SpaceX orbital flights in 2018 thread.

Offline intrepidpursuit

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An An-124 flight landed at MCO yesterday... any ideas what it was for?

Flights to Orlando have nothing to do with stuff at the Cape (and there have been a couple of those flights between Orlando and Paris recently).

The An-124s usually come to Orlando to refuel before or after dropping things at the cape. They don't seem to have the facilities for that beast on the skid strip or SSLF.

Offline russianhalo117

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An An-124 flight landed at MCO yesterday... any ideas what it was for?

Flights to Orlando have nothing to do with stuff at the Cape (and there have been a couple of those flights between Orlando and Paris recently).

The An-124s usually come to Orlando to refuel before or after dropping things at the cape. They don't seem to have the facilities for that beast on the skid strip or SSLF.
They cam refuel aircraft C-5 et cetera at KXMR and KTTS with no problems at all.

Offline intrepidpursuit

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An An-124 flight landed at MCO yesterday... any ideas what it was for?

Flights to Orlando have nothing to do with stuff at the Cape (and there have been a couple of those flights between Orlando and Paris recently).

The An-124s usually come to Orlando to refuel before or after dropping things at the cape. They don't seem to have the facilities for that beast on the skid strip or SSLF.
They cam refuel aircraft C-5 et cetera at KXMR and KTTS with no problems at all.

It made a refueling stop in Orlando when it dropped off Bangabandhu-1. It also used MCO as base of operations for Puerto Rico recovery ops. I don't find any other references though. Perhaps it can refuel on the skid strip but on at SSLF? Either way, the point was that Antonov landings at MCO can be applicable to space launches.

https://www.facebook.com/flyMCO/videos/antonov-an-124-glides-in-for-landing-at-mco/10155231012856625/

Online gongora

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The next SpaceX payload coming from France to the Cape should be in 2020.

Offline dorkmo

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disneyland paris is celebrating 25 years. Maybe theyre planning something big.

Online gongora

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Not sure if I'm reading this right.  So launch has adjusted a few minutes, which now puts it just after midnight EDT on Sunday, 9 September?  Or are we still at roughly 23:23 EDT on 8 September and this another one of the 45th's EDT/UTC mismatches?

The LHA time period is longer than the launch window.  The previous launch window we heard is still within this time period.

Offline Alexphysics

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And as a note to Chris G, the "rescheduled" thing on the map is normal, I've seen that on almost every hazard map. It's like the "expendable launches" thing that's on the other type of hazard map that appears even on SpaceX's launches with an obvious recovery like the one from the Falcon Heavy Demo launch.

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I figure no news is no news...
Is the static fire still on for tonight?
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I figure no news is no news...
Is the static fire still on for tonight?

Tomorrow

Offline penguin44

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Why was this pushed back anyway?

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Why was this pushed back anyway?

Possibly because static fire preps were behind schedule.
Liftoff for St. Jude's! Go Dragon, Go Falcon, Godspeed Inspiration4!

Offline pb2000

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Looks like Hawk was headed out to sea yesterday, can anyone confirm that OCISLY was in tow?
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Looks like Hawk was headed out to sea yesterday, can anyone confirm that OCISLY was in tow?

There was a tweet yesterday that I'm too lazy to go back and look for that showed the ASDS leaving.

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With Telstar 18V/APStar 5C weighing 7.06 tons, I'm guessing that when it's deployed into its subsynchronous transfer orbit, the apogee should be a bit higher than Telstar 19V's initial orbit.

Probably 18,000 kilometers even.
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Offline jpo234

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Tweet from Stephen Clark:
Quote
Telesat official says the Falcon 9 launch with the Telstar 18 VANTAGE telecom satellite is slipping — was to be Saturday night. No new target launch date has been confirmed.

This happens if you want to recover your precious Block 5 booster:

https://twitter.com/MyNews13Weather/status/1037630950786646016

Quote
Good morning, #CentralFL. No threat to FL, but here is the 5 a.m. update on Florence in the open Atlantic:
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Offline Comga

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Looks like Hawk was headed out to sea yesterday, can anyone confirm that OCISLY was in tow?

There was a tweet yesterday that I'm too lazy to go back and look for that showed the ASDS leaving.

The webcam-who-shall-not-be-named shows the berthing location vacant, but I have been unable to find any tweet or post of OSCLY heading out to sea.
What kind of wastrels would dump a perfectly good booster in the ocean after just one use?

Offline Comga

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Tweet from Stephen Clark:
Quote
Telesat official says the Falcon 9 launch with the Telstar 18 VANTAGE telecom satellite is slipping.  Was to be Saturday night. No new target launch date has been confirmed.

This happens if you want to recover your precious Block 5 booster:

https://twitter.com/MyNews13Weather/status/1037630950786646016

Quote
Good morning, #CentralFL. No threat to FL, but here is the 5 a.m. update on Florence in the open Atlantic

But, but, but...
If you look at the landing zone NE of Bermuda in this post it's far to the west of where the hurricane will be on Saturday.
Plenty of time to get back before it.
And OSCILY seems to be already out at sea.
There may be another explanation
What kind of wastrels would dump a perfectly good booster in the ocean after just one use?

Offline ChrisGebhardt

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Tweet from Stephen Clark:
Quote
Telesat official says the Falcon 9 launch with the Telstar 18 VANTAGE telecom satellite is slipping — was to be Saturday night. No new target launch date has been confirmed.

This happens if you want to recover your precious Block 5 booster:

https://twitter.com/MyNews13Weather/status/1037630950786646016

Quote
Good morning, #CentralFL. No threat to FL, but here is the 5 a.m. update on Florence in the open Atlantic:

I'm not at all sure this is an update. A Hurricane over 1,000 miles away is not the reason a launch will have been delayed from Saturday.

Offline scr00chy

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Looks like Hawk was headed out to sea yesterday, can anyone confirm that OCISLY was in tow?

There was a tweet yesterday that I'm too lazy to go back and look for that showed the ASDS leaving.

The webcam-who-shall-not-be-named shows the berthing location vacant, but I have been unable to find any tweet or post of OSCLY heading out to sea.

This is the tweet showing OCISLY leaving

Offline ChrisGebhardt

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Tweet from Stephen Clark:
Quote
Telesat official says the Falcon 9 launch with the Telstar 18 VANTAGE telecom satellite is slipping.  Was to be Saturday night. No new target launch date has been confirmed.

This happens if you want to recover your precious Block 5 booster:

https://twitter.com/MyNews13Weather/status/1037630950786646016

Quote
Good morning, #CentralFL. No threat to FL, but here is the 5 a.m. update on Florence in the open Atlantic

But, but, but...
If you look at the landing zone NE of Bermuda in this post it's far to the west of where the hurricane will be on Saturday.
Plenty of time to get back before it.
And OSCILY seems to be already out at sea.
There may be another explanation

There's 1,000% a different explanation.  A hurricane 1,000 miles away will not stop a launch and sea recovery on Saturday.  Heck, a year ago they launched, RTLS landed, and recovered two days before Hurricane Irma devastated Florida.
« Last Edit: 09/06/2018 07:24 pm by ChrisGebhardt »

Offline pb2000

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I don't think it's the hurricane, as they have 3 more days to watch the spaghetti plots untangle, but that aside, it takes ~9 days from launch to get a GTO booster secure in the barn, plenty of time for the hurricane to catch up and give new meaning to "re-flight of an orbital class booster".
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Offline TripleSeven

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Tweet from Stephen Clark:
Quote
Telesat official says the Falcon 9 launch with the Telstar 18 VANTAGE telecom satellite is slipping — was to be Saturday night. No new target launch date has been confirmed.

This happens if you want to recover your precious Block 5 booster:

https://twitter.com/MyNews13Weather/status/1037630950786646016

Quote
Good morning, #CentralFL. No threat to FL, but here is the 5 a.m. update on Florence in the open Atlantic:

Sea states would be important  upper level winds are next

Offline cd-slam

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The new launch date was announced as Sunday night. I think we can rule out hurricane as the explanation, since it will be closer to the landing site on Sunday than Saturday.

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Offline Ben the Space Brit

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Tweet from Jeff Foust:
Quote
Shotwell confirmed after the panel that the Falcon 9/Telstar 18 Vantage launch slipped a day to Sunday night (EDT), didn’t specify a reason.

The new launch date was announced as Sunday night. I think we can rule out hurricane as the explanation, since it will be closer to the landing site on Sunday than Saturday.

Maybe not the weather out in the Atlantic but the weather in Florida? The meteorological forecast was only 60% go for Saturday the last I heard. If the figure had dropped further and improved for the launch site on Sunday, I could see SpaceX deciding to go for Sunday. Yes, it might increase the chance of the loss of the booster but I suspect that this would be an acceptable loss compared to the possible contract penalties from delaying the launch too long.
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Offline envy887

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Tweet from Stephen Clark:
Quote
Telesat official says the Falcon 9 launch with the Telstar 18 VANTAGE telecom satellite is slipping — was to be Saturday night. No new target launch date has been confirmed.

This happens if you want to recover your precious Block 5 booster:

https://twitter.com/MyNews13Weather/status/1037630950786646016

Quote
Good morning, #CentralFL. No threat to FL, but here is the 5 a.m. update on Florence in the open Atlantic:

Sea states would be important  upper level winds are next

Both are important.

Offline Nehkara



Does anyone know the current location of OCISLY?

Is it anywhere near this brand new yellow X on the map?

Offline Alexphysics

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Does anyone know the current location of OCISLY?

Is it anywhere near this brand new yellow X on the map?

I think not, it seems that mark is around 70ºW and the droneships are usually more like 74ºW, it seems that it is only 4º but that means at least 500km away in that direction, not to mention the droneship is a little bit more to the south so that adds distance, so probably that yellow X could be somewhere around 600-800km from the droneship. This is just by looking at it, nothing precise, I'm sure someone could do it much better

Online gongora

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Does anyone know the current location of OCISLY?

Is it anywhere near this brand new yellow X on the map?

Raul's SpaceX Map is usually a good place to check for that sort of information.

Offline deruch

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[Image]

Does anyone know the current location of OCISLY?

Is it anywhere near this brand new yellow X on the map?

We don't know where it is now, but the planned recovery location--based on the FCC filing for this mission--was approximately in the area I marked below (BTW, I borrowed the marker directly from the underlying image, so it's no longer indicating the post storm remnants).  Whether that recovery zone is still the current one or if sea states or other long range storm effects have necessitated any changes we don't know. 

Also, please note (Nehkara, Alexphysics, and all others):  NSF site preference/guidelines is that all images be attached instead of directly linking to them.  It requires an extra step of first saving/downloading a copy of the original image so that you can then attach it as a file when you comment, but it is easily accomplished by just right-clicking on the original image and choosing "save image" or similar option.  Attaching, instead of linking, prevents the images from interfering with NSF's ability to have the site layout automatically adjust to fit variously sized screens.  This policy should not only be adhered to by those posting but also by those quoting comments that include a unknowingly linked image.  If you're unsure how to do this, you can look at how either @gongora or I have quoted Nehkara's comment and then edited the actual image link out of it (I just deleted the line of text which had the url/hyperlink and then included a placeholder marker).  Thank you.
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Offline Alexphysics

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[Image]

Does anyone know the current location of OCISLY?

Is it anywhere near this brand new yellow X on the map?

We don't know where it is now, but the planned recovery location--based on the FCC filing for this mission--was approximately in the area I marked below (BTW, I borrowed the marker directly from the underlying image, so it's no longer indicating the post storm remnants).  Whether that recovery zone is still the current one or if sea states or other long range storm effects have necessitated any changes we don't know. 

Also, please note (Nehkara, Alexphysics, and all others):  NSF site preference/guidelines is that all images be attached instead of directly linking to them.  It requires an extra step of first saving/downloading a copy of the original image so that you can then attach it as a file when you comment, but it is easily accomplished by just right-clicking on the original image and choosing "save image" or similar option.  Attaching, instead of linking, prevents the images from interfering with NSF's ability to have the site layout automatically adjust to fit variously sized screens.  This policy should not only be adhered to by those posting but also by those quoting comments that include a unknowingly linked image.  If you're unsure how to do this, you can look at how either @gongora or I have quoted Nehkara's comment and then edited the actual image link out of it (I just deleted the line of text which had the url/hyperlink and then included a placeholder marker).  Thank you.

I quoted their comment but I don't know how to remove that thing, that's why it remained in my quote. Anyways, sorry for the inconvenience.

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Look forward to seeing this:

Quote
For Sunday’s Falcon 9 launch, I’ll be accompanied by some folks from VICE! They’re making an HBO special about my coverage for this launch, looking at what goes into covering photographing rocket launches as a member of the media.

https://twitter.com/johnkrausphotos/status/1038444217046118401

Offline xm11

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Offline Comga

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https://www.space.com/41762-spacex-telstar-18v-satellite-launch-webcast.html

the launch delay to 10 September

The article says launch is still tonight.
It is late enough that it’s Sept. 10 UTC.
So this is not announcing an additional slip.
What kind of wastrels would dump a perfectly good booster in the ocean after just one use?

Offline JimO

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Sunrise in SE Nigeria on Sep 10 is 05:24 UTC so a 04:00 liftoff would provide perfect observing conditions for the GTO burn plume [and dual-plume thermal conditioning dump], from the ground [and from ships and planes in the area]. It's probably too late to alert any known skywatchers in that region, they're all asleep?
 

Offline xm11

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56 minute for launch

Offline CJ

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On case anyone is late to the party and scrambling around to find the webcast link (like I just did at T-6!) here it is.

T-5, hope the weather holds!




Offline Chris_Pi

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Per webcast, S2 oxygen's loaded already. How does this work out with the subcooling? Circulating new oxygen in to keep the stuff in the tank cold or something?

Offline StephenB

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Was it just me or did the rocket seem to have more acceleration, especially coming off of the pad?

Offline Lar

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Was it just me or did the rocket seem to have more acceleration, especially coming off of the pad?

Just you. It is common for people to post "it seemed faster"/"it seemed slower" after a launch. The mass is almost the same every time regardless of payload (which is a very small fraction of the GLOW) so the speed off the pad will be the same as well. To a very close approximation.

note: this is true for laucnhes using the same vehicle. There were changes as we progressed from 1.0 to FT to block 5...
« Last Edit: 09/10/2018 05:20 am by Lar »
"I think it would be great to be born on Earth and to die on Mars. Just hopefully not at the point of impact." -Elon Musk
"We're a little bit like the dog who caught the bus" - Musk after CRS-8 S1 successfully landed on ASDS OCISLY

Offline JeanDV

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It looks to me that S1 is leaning to the right.
Optical illusion or possible deformation of the legs?

Offline Joffan

Great launch and deployment. Congrats to SpaceX once again and to Telesat for a successful evening's rocketry.

I noticed no invitation to look at the careers page at the end of the webcast there...
Getting through max-Q for humanity becoming fully spacefaring

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It looks to me that S1 is leaning to the right.
Optical illusion or possible deformation of the legs?

Looks like a fish eye lens is bending the vehicle to the right.

Congratulations to SpaceX and Telesat for the successful launch!
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Offline HVM

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MECO seems to happened lot sooner than timeline show, also meco to stage separation (mainly to the change view to inside of the intersatge) feels lot longer. Of course there can't be any actual problem coz S1 is on the droneship...

Offline CorvusCorax

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MECO seems to happened lot sooner than timeline show, also meco to stage separation (mainly to the change view to inside of the intersatge) feels lot longer. Of course there can't be any actual problem coz S1 is on the droneship...

It was a bit confusing to me, too, but I think what happened was the screen switched to the internal camera view too soon. MECO hadn't yet happened, S1 engines were still running, yet all we saw was the S2 nozzle from both above and below. MECO was then announced by the commentator, and separation happened just the usual timespan after.

Online ZachS09

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First part of a series of photos taken from the Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Daytona Beach.

There was a barbed wire fence in front, but it's a good thing it did not block everything.
Liftoff for St. Jude's! Go Dragon, Go Falcon, Godspeed Inspiration4!

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Second part of the Telstar 18V launch photos taken from ERAU Daytona Beach.

There was a big cloud deck that obstructed the rest of the flight from T+90 seconds onward.
« Last Edit: 09/10/2018 06:00 am by ZachS09 »
Liftoff for St. Jude's! Go Dragon, Go Falcon, Godspeed Inspiration4!

Offline jbenton

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I liked how they used a graphic of Martian terraforming as a placeholder for their webcast long prior to the launch:



They've probably been doing that for awhile, but this is the first SpaceX launch I've watched live in some time.

Offline amarkit

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A first object has been cataloged:

2018-069B/43612 in 259 x 18060 km x 26.95°

Which works out to GTO-2267. Very similar to Telstar 19V (243 x 17863 km x 27.00º orbit, GTO-2277).

Offline Lar

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I liked how they used a graphic of Martian terraforming as a placeholder for their webcast long prior to the launch:

They've probably been doing that for awhile, but this is the first SpaceX launch I've watched live in some time.
yep, standard. And awesome.
« Last Edit: 09/10/2018 01:25 pm by Lar »
"I think it would be great to be born on Earth and to die on Mars. Just hopefully not at the point of impact." -Elon Musk
"We're a little bit like the dog who caught the bus" - Musk after CRS-8 S1 successfully landed on ASDS OCISLY

Offline wannamoonbase

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Congrats SpaceX on a clock work like launch.  I didn't think the weather was going to cooperate.

It's amazing that the F9 can deliver such a heavy payload, even with reduced delta V. 

I wonder if these big birds move over to the FH in a year or two.

Well done SpaceX, next up RTLS on the west coast :)
Starship, Vulcan and Ariane 6 have all reached orbit.  New Glenn, well we are waiting!

Offline blaze79

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Which works out to GTO-2267. Very similar to Telstar 19V (243 x 17863 km x 27.00º orbit, GTO-2277).

Can anybody explain why they used orbits with so large delta-v? Is it  advantageous for satellite company to built heavy satellite with large amount of fuel to make ~2200 m/s maneuvr?

Online e of pi

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Which works out to GTO-2267. Very similar to Telstar 19V (243 x 17863 km x 27.00º orbit, GTO-2277).

Can anybody explain why they used orbits with so large delta-v? Is it  advantageous for satellite company to built heavy satellite with large amount of fuel to make ~2200 m/s maneuvr?
Because Falcon 9 has a kerosene upper stage, it's performance changes pretty rapidly with the delta-v required. Customers really, really want to get the price from SpaceX they can get from letting SpaceX recover the core, so they need to let SpaceX have the margin for propellant to land on the barge. That means lower first-stage delta-v and higher second stage delta-v, which drops payload pretty quickly.

For instance, while F9 with ASDS landing can deliver about 7 metric tons to this GTO-2270 orbit, it can only deliver about 4 metric tons to GTO-1800. That's the difference between the satellite making it to GTO with a beginning-of-life mass of 3.05 metric tons or 3.35 metric tons. Thus, by loading the satellite with more propellant and having it act more as its own "third stage," you can more efficiently split the delta-v and get almost 10% more mass to geostationary orbit--and more importantly launch a bus of a commercially standard size while still allowing the core to be recovered.

Given how well this size fits on F9 with this mission mode, I'm not sure I'd see satellites of this size switching to Falcon Heavy. However, anything larger would need to, as there's not much further the technique can be pushed.

EDIT: Numbers adjusted per correction below by envy887.
« Last Edit: 09/10/2018 03:44 pm by e of pi »

Offline LouScheffer

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Which works out to GTO-2267. Very similar to Telstar 19V (243 x 17863 km x 27.00º orbit, GTO-2277).
Can anybody explain why they used orbits with so large delta-v? Is it  advantageous for satellite company to built heavy satellite with large amount of fuel to make ~2200 m/s maneuvr?

Sure.  It's more efficient since there is no need to push the dead mass of the second stage into a high orbit.

The Falcon 9 can push about 5500 kg to a typical GTO orbit with an apogee of 35,768 km.

The orbit here (18,000 km apogee) needs about 468 m/s to match this orbit.  From the rocket equation, and using a typical satellite motor ISP of 320, the mass ratio needed is exp(468/(320*9.8 )) = 1.161.   So if the initial mass is 7050 kg, then after the apogee raising burn the spacecraft mass is 7050/1.161, or about 6081 kg.  This mass advantage will be somewhat reduced by the need for larger tanks, but it's still a net win.

So overall, by using this strategy, the satellite manufacturer gets about 500 kg more to a GEO-apogee GTO than they would have gotten from the F9 directly.



Offline envy887

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Which works out to GTO-2267. Very similar to Telstar 19V (243 x 17863 km x 27.00º orbit, GTO-2277).

Can anybody explain why they used orbits with so large delta-v? Is it  advantageous for satellite company to built heavy satellite with large amount of fuel to make ~2200 m/s maneuvr?
Because Falcon 9 has a kerosene upper stage, it's performance changes pretty rapidly with the delta-v required. Customers really, really want to get the price from SpaceX they can get from letting SpaceX recover the core, so they need to let SpaceX have the margin for propellant to land on the barge. That means lower first-stage delta-v and higher second stage delta-v, which drops payload pretty quickly.

For instance, while F9 with ASDS landing can deliver about 7 metric tons to this GTO-2270 orbit, it can only deliver about 4 metric tons to GTO-1800. That's the difference between the satellite making it to GTO with a beginning-of-life mass of 2.25 metric tons or 3.35 metric tons. Thus, by loading the satellite with more propellant and having it act more as its own "third stage," you can more efficiently split the delta-v and get almost 50% more mass to geostationary orbit--and more importantly launch a bus of a commercially standard size while still allowing the core to be recovered.

Given how well this size fits on F9 with this mission mode, I'm not sure I'd see satellites of this size switching to Falcon Heavy. However, anything larger would need to, as there's not much further the technique can be pushed.

Block 5 can do much better than 4,000 kg to GEO-1800 with a landing. F9 Block 3 has delivered 5200 kg to a super synchronous GEO-1773 with ASDS landing, and Block 5 is substantially more powerful. It can do at least 5,500 kg to GEO-1800, and probably more, depending how hot they want to let the booster get on entry.

https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=40725.msg1735694#msg1735694

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Block 5 can do much better than 4,000 kg to GEO-1800 with a landing. F9 Block 3 has delivered 5200 kg to a super synchronous GEO-1773 with ASDS landing, and Block 5 is substantially more powerful. It can do at least 5,500 kg to GEO-1800, and probably more, depending how hot they want to let the booster get on entry.

https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=40725.msg1735694#msg1735694
It looks like I misread the NLS II tool outputs, and read the line for "F9 Full Thrust with ASDS landing, 2000 km perigee." Thanks for pointing out that error...I'm a little unsure why they even have that option in the table? The actual value should be about 5450 from the NLS-II tool, and I'll edit my earlier post.

Offline JimO

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A first object has been cataloged:

2018-069B/43612 in 259 x 18060 km x 26.95°

Then about 2267 m/s to get to GEO.  468 m/s at perigee to raise apogee to GEO , then 1799 m/s at apogee to circularize and remove inclination.

Any idea when the perigee burn will be made? Since it will use s/c thrusters I have no hope it would make a visible plume.

Did stage-2 do a small apogee slow-down burp to deorbit?

Offline input~2

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A first object has been cataloged:

2018-069B/43612 in 259 x 18060 km x 26.95°


and Object A has now been cataloged:

2018-069A/43611 in 259 x 18098 km x 26.93°

Offline input~2

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Did stage-2 do a small apogee slow-down burp to deorbit?

Apparently yes

Offline John Alan

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A first object has been cataloged:

2018-069B/43612 in 259 x 18060 km x 26.95°


and Object A has now been cataloged:

2018-069A/43611 in 259 x 18098 km x 26.93°
Did stage-2 do a small apogee slow-down burp to deorbit?

Apparently yes

It may have burped a little... but with two objects being cataloged... was not enough to deorbit...
And at 259km... S2 will be up there a few years...  :P
« Last Edit: 09/10/2018 08:15 pm by John Alan »

Offline Alexphysics

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A first object has been cataloged:

2018-069B/43612 in 259 x 18060 km x 26.95°

Then about 2267 m/s to get to GEO.  468 m/s at perigee to raise apogee to GEO , then 1799 m/s at apogee to circularize and remove inclination.

Any idea when the perigee burn will be made? Since it will use s/c thrusters I have no hope it would make a visible plume.

Did stage-2 do a small apogee slow-down burp to deorbit?

They don't have the capacity right now to deorbit second stages on GTO missions and this should be on the discussion thread.

Offline spacetraveler

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I wonder if these big birds move over to the FH in a year or two.
Why would they do that?

It seems obvious that Telstar decided to trade launcher performance for lower cost with these launches in electing to put up a heavy fuel mass in the sat to a subsynchronous GTO. Switching to FH would be going in the opposite direction.

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I wonder if these big birds move over to the FH in a year or two.
Why would they do that?

It seems obvious that Telstar decided to trade launcher performance for lower cost with these launches in electing to put up a heavy fuel mass in the sat to a subsynchronous GTO. Switching to FH would be going in the opposite direction.

SSL had $28 million reasons to put another ~500m/s on the bird and make it work on F9 ASDS single stick...  ;)
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I tried to look up the cost delta, thanks. Seeing the trade between hypergol, ion thrusters, cost and revenue would be interesting.

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I tried to look up the cost delta, thanks. Seeing the trade between hypergol, ion thrusters, cost and revenue would be interesting.
Was the bird built on a bus that allows swapping out hypergol vs ion thrusters? What about adding larger fuel tanks?
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A first object has been cataloged:

2018-069B/43612 in 259 x 18060 km x 26.95°

Then about 2267 m/s to get to GEO.  468 m/s at perigee to raise apogee to GEO , then 1799 m/s at apogee to circularize and remove inclination.

How much fuel does 2267 m/s require?
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Offline nacnud

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I don't know. The Everyday Astronaut mentioned in his coverage of the launch that having the sat be it's own third stage allowed it to be about 500kg heavier than if the Falcon 9 second stage did all the work. I don't know the source of those numbers.

Offline LouScheffer

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I don't know. The Everyday Astronaut mentioned in his coverage of the launch that having the sat be it's own third stage allowed it to be about 500kg heavier than if the Falcon 9 second stage did all the work. I don't know the source of those numbers.
The source is fairly straightforward orbital mechanics.  A post upthread goes through the numbers.

Offline LouScheffer

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A first object has been cataloged:

2018-069B/43612 in 259 x 18060 km x 26.95°

Then about 2267 m/s to get to GEO.  468 m/s at perigee to raise apogee to GEO , then 1799 m/s at apogee to circularize and remove inclination.

How much fuel does 2267 m/s require?
Assuming generic engines with an ISP of 320, it takes a factor of exp(2267/(320*9.8 )) = 2.06 in mass.  So if it starts at 7050 kg, it will end up at about 3422 kg at GEO.  So about 3628 kg of fuel.

However, this should all go in Discussion, not updates.  Maybe a mod can move it?

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Which works out to GTO-2267. Very similar to Telstar 19V (243 x 17863 km x 27.00º orbit, GTO-2277).

I get 2266.7 m/s without a plane change for the first burn. With a plane change I get 2263.1 m/s.

Enter initial perigee height (km): 259
Enter initial apogee height (km): 18060
Enter required inclination change (deg): 26.95
Enter final orbit height (km): -1

theta1 =  0.00 deg, dv1 =  468.1 m/s
theta2 = 26.95 deg, dv2 = 1798.6 m/s
dv = 2266.7 m/s

theta1 =  0.34 deg, dv1 =  471.8 m/s
theta2 = 26.61 deg, dv2 = 1791.3 m/s
dv = 2263.1 m/s
Akin's Laws of Spacecraft Design #1:  Engineering is done with numbers.  Analysis without numbers is only an opinion.

Offline Ben the Space Brit

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Was it me or was the booster quite far off of the centre mark on OISLY's pad this time?
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Was it me or was the booster quite far off of the centre mark on OISLY's pad this time?

Last view before landing. Landing confirmed!

Taking the image posted by Chris, it seems to me that it is of less than the diameter of the rocket.

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It's within the circle - a couple of years ago, we were celebrating when the cores didn't explode!

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Did stage-2 do a small apogee slow-down burp to deorbit?

They don't have the capacity right now to deorbit second stages on GTO missions and this should be on the discussion thread.

259-150km, from a 18060km orbit, I get as 18m/s or so, or a hundred kilos or so of nitrogen from cold gas, assuming 5000kg.

The main tanks likely also have well over a hundred kilos of helium and oxygen gas, as well as a notable residual volume of liquid which will be boiling off due to solar heating.
The initial helium pressurisation, if to 3 bar, would be enough naively for 20-40m/s.

Leading to the conclusion that if they can keep pointing, propulsive venting of the tank blowdown soon after satellite release may be enough to deorbit.
(They may choose not to do this for many reasons)


« Last Edit: 09/11/2018 12:56 pm by speedevil »

Offline blaze79

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So overall, by using this strategy, the satellite manufacturer gets about 500 kg more to a GEO-apogee GTO than they would have gotten from the F9 directly.
It does make sense. Was the Telstar 18V specially designed for F9 Block 5?

Offline CorvusCorax

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Did stage-2 do a small apogee slow-down burp to deorbit?

They don't have the capacity right now to deorbit second stages on GTO missions and this should be on the discussion thread.

259-150km, from a 18060km orbit, I get as 18m/s or so, or a hundred kilos or so of nitrogen from cold gas, assuming 5000kg.

The main tanks likely also have well over a hundred kilos of helium and oxygen gas, as well as a notable residual volume of liquid which will be boiling off due to solar heating.
The initial helium pressurisation, if to 3 bar, would be enough naively for 20-40m/s.

Leading to the conclusion that if they can keep pointing, propulsive venting of the tank blowdown soon after satellite release may be enough to deorbit.
(They may choose not to do this for many reasons)

This is under the assumption that they vent at apogee, for which the stage would have to coast first for 6 hours, THEN orient and vent. I don't know if it has enough battery power for that long coast unless they installed the long-coast package.

If they vent right after sat separation, lowering perigee is extremely inefficient since they are still close to said perigee.

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Quote
Getting close! #SpaceX booster 1049 entering port.

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039873782608027649

Quote
Booster 1049 is back @PortCanaveral after delivering #TelStar18 to orbit. @SpaceX @NASASpaceflight

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039878628849410048

Does any care to guess why the right side of the left gridfin, in the cropped photo, have a different leading edge pattern than previously seen? Could it be the result of a manufacturing defect?

Offline Joffan

Quote
Getting close! #SpaceX booster 1049 entering port.

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039873782608027649

Quote
Booster 1049 is back @PortCanaveral after delivering #TelStar18 to orbit. @SpaceX @NASASpaceflight

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039878628849410048

Does any care to guess why the right side of the left gridfin, in the cropped photo, have a different leading edge pattern than previously seen? Could it be the result of a manufacturing defect?


I think you're misinterpreting the shadow being cast on the gridfin.
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Offline groknull

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Quote
Getting close! #SpaceX booster 1049 entering port.

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039873782608027649

Quote
Booster 1049 is back @PortCanaveral after delivering #TelStar18 to orbit. @SpaceX @NASASpaceflight

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039878628849410048

Does any care to guess why the right side of the left gridfin, in the cropped photo, have a different leading edge pattern than previously seen? Could it be the result of a manufacturing defect?


I think you're misinterpreting the shadow being cast on the gridfin.

Shadow likely cast by the thruster pod between the two grid fins.
« Last Edit: 09/12/2018 11:46 pm by groknull »

Online deadman719

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Quote
Getting close! #SpaceX booster 1049 entering port.

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039873782608027649

Quote
Booster 1049 is back @PortCanaveral after delivering #TelStar18 to orbit. @SpaceX @NASASpaceflight

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039878628849410048

Does any care to guess why the right side of the left gridfin, in the cropped photo, have a different leading edge pattern than previously seen? Could it be the result of a manufacturing defect?


I think you're misinterpreting the shadow being cast on the gridfin.

Shadow likely cast by the thruster pod between the two grid fins.

I dont think it is a shadow because one can follow the panel shape under the area that appears to be missing material. This wouldn't be possible if it was a shadow cast on the grid fin. 

Offline ZachF

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Quote
Getting close! #SpaceX booster 1049 entering port.

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039873782608027649

Quote
Booster 1049 is back @PortCanaveral after delivering #TelStar18 to orbit. @SpaceX @NASASpaceflight

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039878628849410048

Does any care to guess why the right side of the left gridfin, in the cropped photo, have a different leading edge pattern than previously seen? Could it be the result of a manufacturing defect?


I think you're misinterpreting the shadow being cast on the gridfin.

Shadow likely cast by the thruster pod between the two grid fins.

I dont think it is a shadow because one can follow the panel shape under the area that appears to be missing material. This wouldn't be possible if it was a shadow cast on the grid fin.

It is 100.000% a shadow.

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Offline Joffan

Does any care to guess why the right side of the left gridfin, in the cropped photo, have a different leading edge pattern than previously seen? Could it be the result of a manufacturing defect?


I think you're misinterpreting the shadow being cast on the gridfin.

Shadow likely cast by the thruster pod between the two grid fins.

I dont think it is a shadow because one can follow the panel shape under the area that appears to be missing material. This wouldn't be possible if it was a shadow cast on the grid fin. 


Without spending a lot of time on it, here's contrast/brightness modified version where the true edge of the gridfin is more visible.
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Offline Pete

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Does any care to guess why the right side of the left gridfin, in the cropped photo, have a different leading edge pattern than previously seen? Could it be the result of a manufacturing defect?

Only defect is in the eye of the beholder.

Look again, it is right there, same as it has always been.

Offline meekGee

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Quote
Getting close! #SpaceX booster 1049 entering port.

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039873782608027649

Quote
Booster 1049 is back @PortCanaveral after delivering #TelStar18 to orbit. @SpaceX @NASASpaceflight

https://twitter.com/cygnusx112/status/1039878628849410048

Does any care to guess why the right side of the left gridfin, in the cropped photo, have a different leading edge pattern than previously seen? Could it be the result of a manufacturing defect?


I think you're misinterpreting the shadow being cast on the gridfin.

Shadow likely cast by the thruster pod between the two grid fins.

I dont think it is a shadow because one can follow the panel shape under the area that appears to be missing material. This wouldn't be possible if it was a shadow cast on the grid fin.

You can see the "missing" scallop, it's just gray and similar to the body.  All the places where you see body features within the fin area are where the scallop pattern naturally recedes.

Also, draw a line parallel the shadow direction from the gas thruster to the fin... Voila.
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Online deadman719

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Does any care to guess why the right side of the left gridfin, in the cropped photo, have a different leading edge pattern than previously seen? Could it be the result of a manufacturing defect?

Only defect is in the eye of the beholder.

Look again, it is right there, same as it has always been.

Yep...my eyes failed me. Grid fin 1, me...0.

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If SpaceX says they’re gonna transport Block 5 boosters from Port Canaveral to its hangar with the legs folded up, how come they’ve been removing the legs after temporarily folding up one of the legs?

I ask that because in the Telstar 18V Update Thread, what I mentioned above was what happened.
« Last Edit: 09/16/2018 05:41 am by ZachS09 »
Liftoff for St. Jude's! Go Dragon, Go Falcon, Godspeed Inspiration4!

Offline Lar

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It's not a given that they have everything figured out yet, so they are not at the final set of process steps.... They got farther this mission than the last in that they raised more than one. Incremental progress...
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This sat is in GEO now.
Inclination: 0.07  Apogee: 35794  Perigee: 35779

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