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#1880
by
SeeShells
on 27 Sep, 2017 12:38
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Of all the things this year I wanted to do, attending the NIAC meeting in Denver was at the very top of my list. Seeing and meeting all of you that were going to attend... it was going to be so much fun. I've been battling a health issue that's not life threatening but has stopped me from traveling.
I'm keeping up from the NIAC video, watching the excellent presentations and NASA has done a great job.
Hugs and my best to all and I'm so very sorry I missed you.
Shell
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#1881
by
dustinthewind
on 27 Sep, 2017 14:06
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Bouncing photons
http://www.sciencealert.com/light-continues-to-behave-really-weirdly-in-the-large-hadron-collider
One thing they had never been observed doing was bouncing off each other and changing direction like snooker balls. But new research from the ATLAS experiment at CERN describes the first direct evidence of this actually happening.
The phenomenon is called light-by-light scattering, described by the Euler-Heisenberg Lagrangian published in 1936 by Hans Heinrich Euler and Werner Heisenberg (of uncertainty principle fame), and calculated by Robert Karplus and Maurice Neuman in 1951.
could the above effect be related to the anomalous thrust ?
No, it's an elastic collision, so total kinetic energy is conserved.
This might suggest a non-linear photon-photon interaction or (maybe something else). Normally this happens at very large electric field strengths. It would need to be specified what field strengths this is occurring at. Haven't read the article yet.
Wishing you a quick recovery Shell.
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#1882
by
RonM
on 27 Sep, 2017 14:28
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Bouncing photons
http://www.sciencealert.com/light-continues-to-behave-really-weirdly-in-the-large-hadron-collider
One thing they had never been observed doing was bouncing off each other and changing direction like snooker balls. But new research from the ATLAS experiment at CERN describes the first direct evidence of this actually happening.
The phenomenon is called light-by-light scattering, described by the Euler-Heisenberg Lagrangian published in 1936 by Hans Heinrich Euler and Werner Heisenberg (of uncertainty principle fame), and calculated by Robert Karplus and Maurice Neuman in 1951.
could the above effect be related to the anomalous thrust ?
No, it's an elastic collision, so total kinetic energy is conserved.
Actually this suggests a non-linear photon-photon interaction and possibly light interacting with the electron-position background. Normally this happens at very large electric field strengths. It would need to be specified what field strengths this is occurring at. Haven't read the article yet.
Wishing you a quick recovery Shell.
It specifically states elastic collisions in the paper and the data is from the LHC. I seriously doubt EM drives are anywhere near the energy levels required for light-by-light scattering (GeV, but not noticed until TeV accelerator).
http://www.nature.com/nphys/journal/v13/n9/full/nphys4208.html
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#1883
by
Bob Woods
on 27 Sep, 2017 15:22
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#1884
by
HMXHMX
on 27 Sep, 2017 15:42
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CORRECTION:
Wednesday Dr. Fearn will be giving her presentation on the Mach Effect MEGA thruster at 11:10 Mountain Time. It's available live at https://livestream.com/viewnow/NIAC2017
And SSI.org will post her slides, Q&A handout and poster at approximately the same time.
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#1885
by
Monomorphic
on 27 Sep, 2017 17:45
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#1886
by
Tcarey
on 27 Sep, 2017 20:36
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Is there a board that goes into the MEGA drive? I would like a better understanding of the theory behind it.
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#1887
by
Monomorphic
on 27 Sep, 2017 21:17
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#1888
by
Mulletron
on 27 Sep, 2017 23:11
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Is there a board that goes into the MEGA drive? I would like a better understanding of the theory behind it.
Here you go: https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=31037.0
I think these two different classes of devices (electromechanical vs a resonator) are unified. This says a lot considering my attitude and thinking from back around thread 1 days, back during the battle with GIThruster.
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#1889
by
Mulletron
on 27 Sep, 2017 23:33
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I'd really like to try this (or something else that works better) so we can communicate better. Maybe 2300-0001 GMT for a video conference available daily with the main meeting on say Thursdays or something? I've tried this before without any traction. This definitely isn't the only way of doing this. Comments and recommendations are very welcome. I don't see the point of waiting for conferences (which are far between and you have to travel and take off work and spend money) when we can do this virtually at any time. It's so much easier to just speak like a normal person to other people and bounce around ideas in person.
Join the conversation on Hangouts:
https://hangouts.google.com/group/97SLYfJRS01syZDG2I'm looking to build an EMdrive/MEGA/MET Fireside Chat.
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#1890
by
Mulletron
on 27 Sep, 2017 23:53
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Who is paying the bills and maintaining the wiki? I remember someone graciously volunteering their time and effort to do this for us, and they deserve credit and support for their work.
http://emdrive.wiki/Main_Page
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#1891
by
saucyjack
on 28 Sep, 2017 00:33
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Who is paying the bills and maintaining the wiki? I remember someone graciously volunteering their time and effort to do this for us, and they deserve credit and support for their work.
http://emdrive.wiki/Main_Page
I originally set up and am donating the server to run the site - but lots of other people have been updating the content over time.
I just logged in and sadly see now there's been a fair amount of spam. I'll see what I can do to remove it.
-Rolf
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#1892
by
Mulletron
on 28 Sep, 2017 00:48
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Who is paying the bills and maintaining the wiki? I remember someone graciously volunteering their time and effort to do this for us, and they deserve credit and support for their work.
http://emdrive.wiki/Main_Page
I originally set up and am donating the server to run the site - but lots of other people have been updating the content over time.
I just logged in and sadly see now there's been a fair amount of spam. I'll see what I can do to remove it.
-Rolf
I remember now and I thank you for helping us by making the EMdrive wiki happen. I want to support you for your efforts and time and money spent on your project, and a job well done. I don't want to see our wiki go away, which you made for us. How can we assist you in the upkeep?
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#1893
by
TheTraveller
on 28 Sep, 2017 01:46
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#1894
by
ThatOtherGuy
on 28 Sep, 2017 09:38
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30W amplifier is working! Looks like ~35dB of gain as advertised. The yellow wire is the logic level enable pin which requires grounding to enable power to this amplifier. I will use this wire and the solid-state USB relay to toggle power on/off because the amplifier does draw 6.6A idle. I just need to clean up the wiring a bit and wrap it with shielding.
I'm getting very close to being finished and am looking forward to getting everything working with LabView. 
Nice stuff !
Just a question; do you have a schedule (you can share) about your next series of cavity tests ?
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#1895
by
ThatOtherGuy
on 28 Sep, 2017 09:39
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Of all the things this year I wanted to do, attending the NIAC meeting in Denver was at the very top of my list. Seeing and meeting all of you that were going to attend... it was going to be so much fun. I've been battling a health issue that's not life threatening but has stopped me from traveling.
I'm keeping up from the NIAC video, watching the excellent presentations and NASA has done a great job.
Hugs and my best to all and I'm so very sorry I missed you.
Shell
So sorry to read this, Shells, all my best and I hope you'll get well very soon
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#1896
by
ThatOtherGuy
on 28 Sep, 2017 09:43
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Bouncing photons
http://www.sciencealert.com/light-continues-to-behave-really-weirdly-in-the-large-hadron-collider
One thing they had never been observed doing was bouncing off each other and changing direction like snooker balls. But new research from the ATLAS experiment at CERN describes the first direct evidence of this actually happening.
The phenomenon is called light-by-light scattering, described by the Euler-Heisenberg Lagrangian published in 1936 by Hans Heinrich Euler and Werner Heisenberg (of uncertainty principle fame), and calculated by Robert Karplus and Maurice Neuman in 1951.
could the above effect be related to the anomalous thrust ?
No, it's an elastic collision, so total kinetic energy is conserved.
Actually this suggests a non-linear photon-photon interaction and possibly light interacting with the electron-position background. Normally this happens at very large electric field strengths. It would need to be specified what field strengths this is occurring at. Haven't read the article yet.
Wishing you a quick recovery Shell.
It specifically states elastic collisions in the paper and the data is from the LHC. I seriously doubt EM drives are anywhere near the energy levels required for light-by-light scattering (GeV, but not noticed until TeV accelerator).
http://www.nature.com/nphys/journal/v13/n9/full/nphys4208.html
Ok, I see that now; see, I was wondering about that "bouncing" because (forgive me for my ignorance, not my cup of coffee) I though to a similar effect happening inside the frustum; in that case, given the shape, there's much more probability of photon-photon collision and bouncing near the narrow plate than near the wide one, this would mean that the number of photons hitting the narrow end would be less (due to bouncing) than the number of photons hitting the wide end and this could cause thrust... but then, as you wrote, achieve such an effect we should have higher level of energy than the one used in EMdrive cavities, so, well... no cigar
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#1897
by
Monomorphic
on 28 Sep, 2017 13:38
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Just a question; do you have a schedule (you can share) about your next series of cavity tests ?
I need to mount the 30W amp to the torsional pendulum, clean up/shield the wiring, and add the solid-state relay with analogue input (which arrived today) for PTT/KEY and amp board temp sensor. Today I am also going to pick up another temperature sensor that will be mounted inside the draft enclosure. I noticed mechanical resonance at certain times that I think is related to specific temperatures. I want to map those out so I can avoid testing at those temperatures.
I'm in the final stretch and expect to be completed by the weekend. I could and may perform a couple of manual tests then but also want to get LabView working so all I have to do is change the batteries. Then ~three weeks of testing with results released Nov. 1.
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#1898
by
Qoelet
on 28 Sep, 2017 14:45
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...
Engtanglement isn't instantaneous, definitely. That's misintepretation. It's local. Only the orientation of meter to measure have opposite options which opposition between entangled particles is preserved by spacetime.
OK that gets us here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_test_experiments
To date, Bell tests have found that the hypothesis of local hidden variables is inconsistent with the way that physical systems behave.
That inconsistency would apply to Bohm's pilot wave theory as well
Maybe it is only tangential to the discussion here, but while you are certainly correct on the fact that entanglement is non local, the pilot wave theory is a
non-local hidden variables theory, while the Bell's theorem is about
local hidden variables theories: it does not disprove the pilot wave theory. Source (somewhat cheap, I know):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilot_wave#Principleshttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell%27s_theoremThis in one of the best theads I ever read: please keep it going, thank you.
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#1899
by
X_RaY
on 28 Sep, 2017 20:54
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