-
#3040 by Rodal on 22 Feb, 2016 02:42
-
...if a reflection failure resulted in the photon PASSING through the mirror to infinity, would I be right or have I made another error.
Thank you, you are a most gracious gentleman, a scholar and a good judge of whiskey
. If the photon gets transmitted and ejected out of the spacecraft into space you have some sort of photon rocket, with the spacecraft acquiring a momentum increase equal in magnitude and opposite in direction to the momentum of the ejected photon.
-
#3041 by JohnFornaro on 22 Feb, 2016 13:56
-
From:
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2015/04/evaluating-nasas-futuristic-em-drive/
"A note of caution is that Dr. Whites simulations do not assume that the Quantum Vacuum is indestructible and immutable. The mainstream physics community assumes the Quantum Vacuum is indestructible and immutable because of the experimental observation that a fundamental particle like an electron (or a positron) has the same properties (e.g. mass, charge or spin), regardless of when or where the particle was created, whether now or in the early universe, through astrophysical processes or in a laboratory.
"Another reason is that the Quantum Vacuum is assumed to be the lowest possible (time-averaged) energy that a quantum physical system may have, and therefore it should not be possible to extract momentum or energy from the Quantum Vacuum."
Rodal asked:
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=36313.msg1355580#msg1355580
"Can you point out people in academia that also think that it may be possible that the Quantum Vacuum is not immutable and indestructible...?"
To which Paul March replied:
"Sonny White formulated a compressible quantum vacuum conjecture that requires us to live in a portion of the universe that is immersed in a false vacuum that apparently has a ground or zero-energy level much smaller than science first assumed."
Paul then provided several papers.
If the Quantum Vacuum is not immutable and indestructible, then it may be the case, as I have long intuited, that there is a zero-energy level much smaller than science has assumed so far. As I like to put it, it may be turtles all the way down.
https://www.google.com/search?q=turtles+all+the+way+down
I read the 2015 Bush paper from MIT:
http://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev-fluid-010814-014506?journalCode=fluid
This thinking suggests, to me, that standing "waves" can take place at many scales; that the movement of the walkers can be controlled; that electromagnetic waves are the force involved; and finally that one might be able to push against the quantum foam, what might be called "swimming".
Maybe what's needed is the idea of a quantum foam propellor?
Also, my intuition is that Figure 7 in the Bush paper begins to resemble Conway's game of Life, with the artifacts being named along the lines of Conway's artifacts, and that this may be a good analog for theoretical analysis in figuring out different ensembles of double quantization for walkers in a central force field.
I know that aether is a four letter word around here, but:
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=36313.msg1356158#msg1356158
"See this 2012 article from Hajdukovic from CERN, who envisions the Quantum Vacuum as a fluid..."
Fine. Call it a fluid. -
#3042 by rfmwguy on 22 Feb, 2016 14:27
-
Propeller talk has been around for a while, http://tinyurl.com/zr38q5u
Found it going back to T1...very interesting discussions... -
#3043 by Monomorphic on 22 Feb, 2016 14:30
-
For a build to run on batteries, this is another microwave source I am looking at. It is a little pricey at ~$300 though. http://www.power-hunt.com/12-volt-microwave-DC.php
Can anyone comment on how they think it works? It claims to get 660 watts microwave RF from a direct DC power connection with 55 amps available. It claims to have eliminated the need for an inverter: "Inverter wastes up to 40% or 1000 Watts of battery power during electric conversion. This wasted power is converted to heat that affects internal electronics. If used inside vehicle during warm weather, inverters require additional air conditioning to cool the vehicle. PowerHunts 100% efficiency wastes no power and produces no unwanted heat." -
#3044 by Rodal on 22 Feb, 2016 14:47
-
SAFETY !
Some time ago Notsosureofit asked: where is that data on the complex dielectric properties of materials?
Here I list some interesting data for human tissues at the same frequency being used by DoItYourself experimenters like rfmwguy, SeeShells, TheTraveller and others (2.45 GHz):
Dielectric Permittivity and Loss Factor of Biotissues at 2450MHz and Room Temperature Tissue
ε' ε" tan δ
Eye 30 8 0.27
Brain 32 15.5 0.48
Fat 5 0.99 0.20
Muscle 46 13.5 0.29
Kidneys 44.5 14.9 0.33
Skin 43 14 0.33
Blood 65 19.5 0.30
CONCLUSION: All these biological tissues have huge values of tan δ, which means large values of thermal damage is quite possible to people exposed to these microwave fields. Contrary to common belief, the greatest danger is not to the eyes, that have tan δ =0.27 or to the skin, which has tan δ = 0.33, but the greatest possible damage seems to be to the brain since it has the largest value of tan δ, which is tan δ = 0.48. If you add to this information the well known fact that the brain has a large amount of water, and that the dipole of water is the main way that home microwaves at 2.45 GHz cook food, the possible damage to the brains of DoItYourself experimenters, that are experimenting with magnetrons powered from hundreds of watts to up to 1 kilowatt, should be self-evident.
Not only is the value of tan δ huge, but also the values of the real part of the relative electrical permittivity are very large (exceeding 30) compared to the relative permittivity of air (1). This means that it is possible, given the correct coupling -for example through evanescent fields- for angles greater than the angle of total internal reflectance the incident microwaves once going inside the tissue will remain trapped in the tissue and not be able to escape, as the tissue will effectively become a dielectric waveguide.
(*)
REFERENCES:
*R. Pethig, Dielectric properties of biological materials: Biophysical and medical applications,
IEEE Trans. Electric. Insul. EI-19:453474 (1984).
http://engineering.dartmouth.edu/~d25559k/ENGG168_files/Papers/Pethig_1984.pdf
* A. Kraszewski, M. A. Stuchly, S. S. Stuchly, and A. M. Smith,In vivo and in vitro dielectric properties of animal tissues at radio frequencies,
BioElectromagnetics 3:421432 (1982).
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/bem.2250030405/abstract
___________
(*) In previous threads I had posted information on experiments conducted on live monkeys that were exposed to microwave fields at microwave (GHz) frequency and 10^2 watts (which lead to permanent damage to the monkey's brains, and even in some cases to their death). -
#3045 by Monomorphic on 22 Feb, 2016 15:09
-
Quote
Wow, looks like they may have just been released! If you choose to go this way, it will take experiments to another level. Specifically, the ability to analyze whether pulsing is required. These chips are 250W CW rated, so there's a lot that can be learned here! Also check to see if the ctr freq is adjustable +/- a few mhz.
Just got the quote back. The MHT1003NR3 runs $106.25 each. The quote I had was for 4, but I'm going to ask her if I can order just one at first. I doubt it adds much to the price. Is anyone else interested in purchasing one? Let me know. -
#3046 by rfmwguy on 22 Feb, 2016 15:39
-
Yes, I might, but the wavebox thing might be a better buy, however Wavebox went out of biz and Power-Hunt took over. I am still trying to confirm what solid state technology they have. Not sure it is 2.45 GHz...very little out there right now. Also, you might ask NXP for a free sample.QuoteWow, looks like they may have just been released! If you choose to go this way, it will take experiments to another level. Specifically, the ability to analyze whether pulsing is required. These chips are 250W CW rated, so there's a lot that can be learned here! Also check to see if the ctr freq is adjustable +/- a few mhz.
Just got the quote back. The MHT1003NR3 runs $106.25 each. The quote I had was for 4, but I'm going to ask her if I can order just one at first. I doubt it adds much to the price. Is anyone else interested in purchasing one? Let me know. -
#3047 by rfmwguy on 22 Feb, 2016 15:43
-
SAFETY !
Worth repeating. Proximity is a key factor here, as you might suspect from the cellphone alarmists have been repeating for years. The emdrive, however, is many factors higher EM. Anyone building needs to have a microwave leakage detector/meter nearby at a minimum...perform no tests without one.
CONCLUSION: All these biological tissues have huge values of tan δ, which means large values of thermal damage is quite possible to people exposed to these microwave fields. Contrary to common belief, the greatest danger is not to the eyes, that have tan δ =0.27 or to the skin, which has tan δ = 0.33, but the greatest possible damage seems to be to the brain since it has the largest value of tan δ, which is tan δ = 0.48. If you add to this information the well known fact that the brain has a large amount of water, and that the dipole of water is the main way that home microwaves at 2.45 GHz cook food, the possible damage to the brains of DoItYourself experimenters, that are experimenting with magnetrons powered from hundreds of watts to up to 1 kilowatt, should be self-evident.
Not only is the value of tan δ huge, but also the values of the real part of the electrical permittivity are very large (exceeding 30) compared to the permittivity of air (1). This means that it is possible, given the correct coupling -for example through evanescent fields- for angles greater than the angle of total internal reflectance the incident microwaves once going inside the tissue will remain trapped in the tissue and not be able to escape, as the tissue will effectively become a dielectric waveguide.
(*)
REFERENCES:
*R. Pethig, Dielectric properties of biological materials: Biophysical and medical applications,
IEEE Trans. Electric. Insul. EI-19:453474 (1984).
http://engineering.dartmouth.edu/~d25559k/ENGG168_files/Papers/Pethig_1984.pdf
* A. Kraszewski, M. A. Stuchly, S. S. Stuchly, and A. M. Smith,In vivo and in vitro dielectric properties of animal tissues at radio frequencies,
BioElectromagnetics 3:421432 (1982).
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/bem.2250030405/abstract
___________
(*) In previous threads I had posted information on experiments conducted on live monkeys that were exposed to microwave fields at microwave (GHz) frequency and 10^2 watts (which lead to permanent damage to the monkey's brains, and even in some cases to their death). -
#3048 by JohnFornaro on 22 Feb, 2016 15:47
-
Some time ago, I had been granted an informal pass on using the word "aether" by none other than the good doctor Rodal.
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=29276.msg1300020#msg1300020
"But you, Fornaro, are allowed to called it the aether."Propeller talk has been around for a while, http://tinyurl.com/zr38q5u
Found it going back to T1...very interesting discussions...
Rfmwguy: Yes, that older discussion is what I was alluding to. My term "aether propeller" is somewhat more romantic, to me, than the term "QV propeller", but it is now sounding more like a real possibility. I do understand the useful principle that math trumps intuition, but it is intuition which sometimes guides.
A bit of refresher here:
[Apparently the 'quote' function no longer works on these older threads.]
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=29276.msg1299939#msg1299939
Rodal:
<<Based on my work on non-stationary randomness both in physics and in finance, what I understand you are stating, Mull, does not follow. I understand that you are stating that the quantum vacuum which you have previously described as a random walk capable of being biased in a particular direction (by using a polymer with helical anisotropy for example) to transfer directional momentum to a macroscopic copper EM Drive such that it can be used for space propulsion yet you simultaneously state that the momentum transfer from the quantum vacuum to the EM drive would not produce any turbulent amplification of the quantum vacuum fluctuations.
I submit that the opposite is more likely: that (in the very unlikely event that) if there were any transfer of momentum from the quantum vacuum to a spacecraft through a EM Drive, such momentum transfer would not be flat in the power spectral density but that there should be a measurable power decay in the power spectral density of the measured "thrust". >>
Note that in this snippet, the statement is made that it is an "unlikely event" that there is a momentum transfer between the QV and the spacecraft. I understand that people's opinions on this are evolving as other research is done.
Am I correct in saying that there is now a strong case to be made for momentum transfer between the QV and a spacecraft designed for that purpose? -
#3049 by Rodal on 22 Feb, 2016 16:01
-
...
It bears repeating that cell phones are not at all comparable to the danger involved with microwave magnetrons:
Worth repeating. Proximity is a key factor here, as you might suspect from the cellphone alarmists have been repeating for years. The emdrive, however, is many factors higher EM. Anyone building needs to have a microwave leakage detector/meter nearby at a minimum...perform no tests without one.
It bears giving the actual numbers involved:
Phones emit on the order of a few hundred milliwatts to a few watts maximum, while ovens use power levels in the neighborhood of 700-1000 watts. We are talking a difference of several orders of magnitude here: thousands of times greater power involved in the DoItYourself experiments.
Again. it took only 100 or so watts to permanently damage the brains of monkeys, so the fact that a cell phone with a few hundred milliwatts microwave emission does not result in damage is no cause for anybody feeling that they can get away doing the same thing they do with a cell phone as when dealing with magnetrons powered by hundreds of watts. -
#3050 by rfmwguy on 22 Feb, 2016 16:05
-
Some time ago, I had been granted an informal pass on using the word "aether" by none other than the good doctor Rodal.
My weak attempts at theory at one time involved something similar, only it was an impeller or corkscrew thought experiment, EM vortex type thinking. Didn't get anywhere with it, but interesting to read some of the Aether discussions again.
(snip)
Am I correct in saying that there is now a strong case to be made for momentum transfer between the QV and a spacecraft designed for that purpose? -
#3051 by SteveD on 22 Feb, 2016 18:06
-
SAFETY !
Here I list some interesting data for human tissues at the same frequency being used by DoItYourself experimenters like rfmwguy, SeeShells, TheTraveller and others (2.45 GHz):
Dielectric Permittivity and Loss Factor of Biotissues at 2450MHz and Room Temperature Tissue
ε' ε" tan δ
Eye 30 8 0.27
Brain 32 15.5 0.48
Fat 5 0.99 0.20
Muscle 46 13.5 0.29
Kidneys 44.5 14.9 0.33
Skin 43 14 0.33
Blood 65 19.5 0.30
(*) In previous threads I had posted information on experiments conducted on live monkeys that were exposed to microwave fields at microwave (GHz) frequency and 10^2 watts (which lead to permanent damage to the monkey's brains, and even in some cases to their death).
Are any of the other common microwave frequencies safer? -
#3052 by CW on 22 Feb, 2016 18:17
-
I would like to bring up another aspect of EM fields: The concept of electromagnetic mass. It stems from the consideration, that a charged body is harder to accelerate than an uncharged body (basically: induction-caused).
Applying this concept to the periodically changing EM-fields in the EM-drive cavity.. I wonder, if it is possible to consider any arbitrary volume of space within the cavity as a pseudo charged body (which can obviously not be a point charge), that dynamically changes its integral absolute charge and field direction, and whether the in this way fragmented EM-drive inner volume of space could be viewed /modeled as a matrix of dynamically changing charged pseudo bodies, that interact and thus create the repeatedly observed non-vanishing remaining force of EM-drive like constructs?
Is it possible to replace the colorful field renders from the raw data with a pseudo particle view, that shows the inner frustum volume as a diced matrix of assigned particles? It could be interesting to calculate and visualize, if such a possibly dynamically induced pseudo field of charged particles (akin to a 'crystal lattice'?) behaved like a crystal structure with more time-averaged EM stress on one end of the frustum, than on the other end. -
#3053 by X_RaY on 22 Feb, 2016 18:29
-
At microwave power levels of a few hundred watt? Not really.SAFETY !
Here I list some interesting data for human tissues at the same frequency being used by DoItYourself experimenters like rfmwguy, SeeShells, TheTraveller and others (2.45 GHz):
Dielectric Permittivity and Loss Factor of Biotissues at 2450MHz and Room Temperature Tissue
ε' ε" tan δ
Eye 30 8 0.27
Brain 32 15.5 0.48
Fat 5 0.99 0.20
Muscle 46 13.5 0.29
Kidneys 44.5 14.9 0.33
Skin 43 14 0.33
Blood 65 19.5 0.30
(*) In previous threads I had posted information on experiments conducted on live monkeys that were exposed to microwave fields at microwave (GHz) frequency and 10^2 watts (which lead to permanent damage to the monkey's brains, and even in some cases to their death).
Are any of the other common microwave frequencies safer?
Higher frequencies (like the ISM band between 24-24.25GHz ) are related to lower skin penetration depth but the energy spectral density would be higher and therefore the damage at the surface of human skin would be greater too.
Lower frequencies leads to greater penetration depth and can damage inner structures like the brain. The Tan Delta changes over frequency but not that much that several hundred watt are save (in the MW regime 300MHz-300GHz).
On the other hand at frequencies of ~27.12MHz there are diathermy devices for medical issues with 400W CW power. These devices are driven by a huge vacuum radio tube and an automated impedance match system is part of these apparatus.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diathermy
Translation from the german wiki:QuoteFor diathermy following frequency ranges are permitted:
13.56 MHz, 27.12 MHz (wavelength 11 m) and 40.68 MHz short-wave therapy. Penetration depth of more than 20 cm.
434 MHz (wavelength 69 cm) than Dezimeterwellentherapie
2450 MHz (2.45 GHz, wavelength 12 cm) as a so-called microwave therapy. Penetration depth only a few centimeters, the heating is very much determined by the water content of the tissue, see also Dielectric heating.
The applied performance can be several hundred watts in to. Diathermy work in the so-called ISM bands to disturb adjacent radio equipment as little as possible.
But again Magnetrons can be very dangerous, so be careful!!!
-
#3054 by Rodal on 22 Feb, 2016 18:55
-
SAFETY !
Here I list some interesting data for human tissues at the same frequency being used by DoItYourself experimenters like rfmwguy, SeeShells, TheTraveller and others (2.45 GHz):
Dielectric Permittivity and Loss Factor of Biotissues at 2450MHz and Room Temperature Tissue
ε' ε" tan δ
Eye 30 8 0.27
Brain 32 15.5 0.48
Fat 5 0.99 0.20
Muscle 46 13.5 0.29
Kidneys 44.5 14.9 0.33
Skin 43 14 0.33
Blood 65 19.5 0.30
(*) In previous threads I had posted information on experiments conducted on live monkeys that were exposed to microwave fields at microwave (GHz) frequency and 10^2 watts (which lead to permanent damage to the monkey's brains, and even in some cases to their death).
Are any of the other common microwave frequencies safer?
In the microwave range, for water (the main component in human tissue), as the frequency increases, tan δ increases as frequencies of 2.45 GHz are approached and from thereafter, after it reaches a peak near 50 to 100 GHz (the peak is very dependent on temperature) both the real and the imaginary parts of the permittivity decrease, and since both of them change, the tan δ doesn't change that much after that, see this (which shows the real and the imaginary parts of the permittivity, to get tan δ you have to divide the imaginary part by the real part) :
So, the lower the frequency the better, so that the imaginary part of the permittivity is much lower , while the real part is high and fairly constant.
But the frequency would have to be much lower than 1 GHz, the frequency would have to be below the microwave frequency minimum of 0.3GHz, say 0.1 GHz or lower to make a significant difference.
Experimenting with high power microwave magnetrons is bad news for humans (and for the monkeys that unfortunately died in experiments at ~100 watts at 2.45 GHz due to brain damage) ! -
#3055 by rq3 on 22 Feb, 2016 21:10
-
For a build to run on batteries, this is another microwave source I am looking at. It is a little pricey at ~$300 though. http://www.power-hunt.com/12-volt-microwave-DC.php
Can anyone comment on how they think it works? It claims to get 660 watts microwave RF from a direct DC power connection with 55 amps available. It claims to have eliminated the need for an inverter: "Inverter wastes up to 40% or 1000 Watts of battery power during electric conversion. This wasted power is converted to heat that affects internal electronics. If used inside vehicle during warm weather, inverters require additional air conditioning to cool the vehicle. PowerHunts 100% efficiency wastes no power and produces no unwanted heat."
Look again, more closely. It claims 660 watts of INPUT power. In other words, they sell a cute large wire gauge tap to your vehicle battery, so that they can provide 55 amps at 12 volts out of a socket (660 watts). They say nothing about the RF power of the microwave oven, nor it's efficiency. -
#3056 by rq3 on 22 Feb, 2016 21:18
-
SAFETY !
Some time ago Notsosureofit asked: where is that data on the complex dielectric properties of materials?
Here I list some interesting data for human tissues at the same frequency being used by DoItYourself experimenters like rfmwguy, SeeShells, TheTraveller and others (2.45 GHz):
Dielectric Permittivity and Loss Factor of Biotissues at 2450MHz and Room Temperature Tissue
ε' ε" tan δ
Eye 30 8 0.27
Brain 32 15.5 0.48
Fat 5 0.99 0.20
Muscle 46 13.5 0.29
Kidneys 44.5 14.9 0.33
Skin 43 14 0.33
Blood 65 19.5 0.30
CONCLUSION: All these biological tissues have huge values of tan δ, which means large values of thermal damage is quite possible to people exposed to these microwave fields. Contrary to common belief, the greatest danger is not to the eyes, that have tan δ =0.27 or to the skin, which has tan δ = 0.33, but the greatest possible damage seems to be to the brain since it has the largest value of tan δ, which is tan δ = 0.48. If you add to this information the well known fact that the brain has a large amount of water, and that the dipole of water is the main way that home microwaves at 2.45 GHz cook food, the possible damage to the brains of DoItYourself experimenters, that are experimenting with magnetrons powered from hundreds of watts to up to 1 kilowatt, should be self-evident.
Not only is the value of tan δ huge, but also the values of the real part of the relative electrical permittivity are very large (exceeding 30) compared to the relative permittivity of air (1). This means that it is possible, given the correct coupling -for example through evanescent fields- for angles greater than the angle of total internal reflectance the incident microwaves once going inside the tissue will remain trapped in the tissue and not be able to escape, as the tissue will effectively become a dielectric waveguide.
(*)
REFERENCES:
*R. Pethig, Dielectric properties of biological materials: Biophysical and medical applications,
IEEE Trans. Electric. Insul. EI-19:453474 (1984).
http://engineering.dartmouth.edu/~d25559k/ENGG168_files/Papers/Pethig_1984.pdf
* A. Kraszewski, M. A. Stuchly, S. S. Stuchly, and A. M. Smith,In vivo and in vitro dielectric properties of animal tissues at radio frequencies,
BioElectromagnetics 3:421432 (1982).
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/bem.2250030405/abstract
___________
(*) In previous threads I had posted information on experiments conducted on live monkeys that were exposed to microwave fields at microwave (GHz) frequency and 10^2 watts (which lead to permanent damage to the monkey's brains, and even in some cases to their death).
I don't recall if I've shared this gruesome story, but decades ago one of my professors worked at Brookhaven lab with high power RF sputtering (10kw/13.56 MHz). One of his collegues managed to grab the RF feed. On hearing the scream, the good professor pulled the poor soul off of the feed; all of the flesh and muscle sloughed off of the bone like a glove, from the fingertips to the shoulder.
You all be careful out there. -
#3057 by rq3 on 22 Feb, 2016 21:36
-
SAFETY !
Here I list some interesting data for human tissues at the same frequency being used by DoItYourself experimenters like rfmwguy, SeeShells, TheTraveller and others (2.45 GHz):
Dielectric Permittivity and Loss Factor of Biotissues at 2450MHz and Room Temperature Tissue
ε' ε" tan δ
Eye 30 8 0.27
Brain 32 15.5 0.48
Fat 5 0.99 0.20
Muscle 46 13.5 0.29
Kidneys 44.5 14.9 0.33
Skin 43 14 0.33
Blood 65 19.5 0.30
(*) In previous threads I had posted information on experiments conducted on live monkeys that were exposed to microwave fields at microwave (GHz) frequency and 10^2 watts (which lead to permanent damage to the monkey's brains, and even in some cases to their death).
Are any of the other common microwave frequencies safer?
In the microwave range, for water (the main component in human tissue), as the frequency increases, tan δ increases as frequencies of 2.45 GHz are approached and from thereafter, after it reaches a peak near 50 to 100 GHz (the peak is very dependent on temperature) both the real and the imaginary parts of the permittivity decrease, and since both of them change, the tan δ doesn't change that much after that, see this (which shows the real and the imaginary parts of the permittivity, to get tan δ you have to divide the imaginary part by the real part) :
So, the lower the frequency the better, so that the imaginary part of the permittivity is much lower , while the real part is high and fairly constant.
But the frequency would have to be much lower than 1 GHz, the frequency would have to be below the microwave frequency minimum of 0.3GHz, say 0.1 GHz or lower to make a significant difference.
Experimenting with high power microwave magnetrons is bad news for humans (and for the monkeys that unfortunately died in experiments at ~100 watts at 2.45 GHz due to brain damage) !
From personal RF engineering experience, 10 watts at VHF (150 MHz range) is my limit for "finger probing" solid state amplifiers on planar circuits (printed circuit boards). Above 300 MHz, I won't think about anything over 2 watts. With experience, finger probing is very useful for making educated guesstimates for matching capacitors, etc. At 10 watts, you get a definite pinpoint hot spot feeling. At 20 watts, the feeling is instantaneous. Above 40 watts, you're into RF burn territory. And these are NOT "normal" burns. The RF preferentially channels through the tissue along saline gradients, and generally branches out when it hits bone. The result is an extremely focused, almost microscopic, deeply cauterized channel. They take many months to heal. With high enough power, you get the benefit of millions of these channels happening simultaneously, effectively flash boiling the tissue at the bone interface.
I'd almost rather have a hydrofluoric acid burn. On second thought, no I wouldn't. -
#3058 by VAXHeadroom on 22 Feb, 2016 23:30
-
I would like to bring up another aspect of EM fields: The concept of electromagnetic mass. It stems from the consideration, that a charged body is harder to accelerate than an uncharged body (basically: induction-caused).
Applying this concept to the periodically changing EM-fields in the EM-drive cavity.. I wonder, if it is possible to consider any arbitrary volume of space within the cavity as a pseudo charged body (which can obviously not be a point charge), that dynamically changes its integral absolute charge and field direction, and whether the in this way fragmented EM-drive inner volume of space could be viewed /modeled as a matrix of dynamically changing charged pseudo bodies, that interact and thus create the repeatedly observed non-vanishing remaining force of EM-drive like constructs?
Is it possible to replace the colorful field renders from the raw data with a pseudo particle view, that shows the inner frustum volume as a diced matrix of assigned particles? It could be interesting to calculate and visualize, if such a possibly dynamically induced pseudo field of charged particles (akin to a 'crystal lattice'?) behaved like a crystal structure with more time-averaged EM stress on one end of the frustum, than on the other end.
If you can point me to an example of what you'd like to see, I'll see what I can do...
-- Emory
-
#3059 by SeeShells on 22 Feb, 2016 23:31
-
SAFETY !
I don't recall if I've shared this gruesome story, but decades ago one of my professors worked at Brookhaven lab with high power RF sputtering (10kw/13.56 MHz). One of his collegues managed to grab the RF feed. On hearing the scream, the good professor pulled the poor soul off of the feed; all of the flesh and muscle sloughed off of the bone like a glove, from the fingertips to the shoulder.
You all be careful out there.
[/quote]
I couldn't agree more! As a builder I've put the magnetron in a Faraday cage as well as the Frustum under test. I've a microwave meter that I use as well. You CANNOT be over cautious. After 50 years in electronics I've learned you never take anything for granted. If you have never worked with microwaves please be very very careful and know what your doing and working with!
Shell
