Author Topic: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover  (Read 58051 times)

Online Blackstar

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #200 on: 09/08/2018 03:56 PM »
This and the midterm review are discussed here.

Jason explains the decadal survey around 10 minutes in, Louise shows up about 8 minutes later:

http://www.planetary.org/multimedia/planetary-radio/show/2018/space-policy-edition-29.html

« Last Edit: 09/08/2018 08:32 PM by Blackstar »

Offline catdlr

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #201 on: 09/09/2018 04:14 AM »
Mars sample return

European Space Agency, ESA
Published on May 2, 2018

Spacecraft in orbit and on Mars’s surface have made many exciting discoveries, transforming our understanding of the planet and unveiling clues to the formation of our Solar System, as well as helping us understand our home planet. The next step is to bring samples to Earth for detailed analysis in sophisticated laboratories where results can be verified independently and samples can be reanalysed as laboratory techniques continue to improve.

Bringing Mars to Earth is no simple undertaking—it would require at least three missions from Earth and one never-been-done-before rocket launch from Mars.

A first mission, NASA’s 2020 Mars Rover, is set to collect surface samples in pen-sized canisters as it explores the Red Planet. Up to 31 canisters will be filled and readied for a later pickup – geocaching gone interplanetary.

In the same period, ESA’s ExoMars rover, which is also set to land on Mars in 2021, will be drilling up to two meters below the surface to search for evidence of life.

A second mission with a small fetch rover would land nearby and retrieve the samples in a Martian search-and-rescue operation. This rover would bring the samples back to its lander and place them in a Mars Ascent Vehicle – a small rocket to launch the football-sized container into Mars orbit.

A third launch from Earth would provide a spacecraft sent to orbit Mars and rendezvous with the sample containers. Once the samples are safely collected and loaded into an Earth entry vehicle, the spacecraft would return to Earth, release the vehicle to land in the United States, where the samples will be retrieved and placed in quarantine for detailed analysis by a team of international scientists.

Credits: NASA/ESA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNnJBKR9lqY?t=001

Tony De La Rosa

Offline jbenton

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #202 on: 09/11/2018 06:21 AM »
As promised. (I apologize for the poor quality, but I don't have the ability to grab the source files at the moment, so I'm using screen grabs of our already-compressed pdf of the report.)

... [snip]

[Update: just FYI, this is referred to as the Orbital Sample vehicle, or the OS.]

How does the arm(s) on the MAV lander and/or the fetch rover grab the Orb of Truth here? I don't see any obvious attach points, like what we see on ISS, Hubble, etc.

Thanks.  :)

Offline jbenton

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #203 on: 09/14/2018 08:36 AM »
Here's a fun idea:

Because the Mars 2020 rover leaves a trail of small sample cores for a later fetch rover to pick up, they should name the Mars 2020 rover "Hansel", and they should name the fetch rover "Gretel".  ;D

« Last Edit: 09/14/2018 11:12 PM by jbenton »

Offline vjkane

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #204 on: 09/16/2018 05:06 PM »
Here's a fun idea:

Because the Mars 2020 rover leaves a trail of small sample cores for a later fetch rover to pick up, they should name the Mars 2020 rover "Hansel", and they should name the fetch rover "Gretel".  ;D
Actually the plan is to establish one or two caches of many sample tubes.

Offline jbenton

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #205 on: 09/17/2018 01:51 AM »
Here's a fun idea:

Because the Mars 2020 rover leaves a trail of small sample cores for a later fetch rover to pick up, they should name the Mars 2020 rover "Hansel", and they should name the fetch rover "Gretel".
Actually the plan is to establish one or two caches of many sample tubes.

It's going to drop them into two piles? I guess that makes it easier for the fetch rover to do its job. I thought part of the point was to reduce risk for Mars 2020: if it gets stuck in a rut at least some of the samples would be off-board.
I guess this is kind of a compromise between the original idea of having Mars 2020 fill up a canister with the samples and the idea of leaving a trail of cores.

Offline vjkane

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #206 on: 09/17/2018 03:27 PM »
Here's a fun idea:

Because the Mars 2020 rover leaves a trail of small sample cores for a later fetch rover to pick up, they should name the Mars 2020 rover "Hansel", and they should name the fetch rover "Gretel".
Actually the plan is to establish one or two caches of many sample tubes.

It's going to drop them into two piles? I guess that makes it easier for the fetch rover to do its job. I thought part of the point was to reduce risk for Mars 2020: if it gets stuck in a rut at least some of the samples would be off-board.
I guess this is kind of a compromise between the original idea of having Mars 2020 fill up a canister with the samples and the idea of leaving a trail of cores.

Didn't I post slides about that upstream? We got a good explanation for the sample deposit strategy back in spring. I don't remember the specifics, but they were thinking about establishing safe areas where they would drop the samples. But I suspect that this will be somewhat dynamic based upon what they encounter on the surface. For instance, if the rover gets momentarily stuck somewhere, they will probably not want to risk getting stuck again with samples onboard, so they might get unstuck, return to a safe area, and drop their samples even if that's not the original plan. Then they would proceed. The philosophy is to not build up too much risk of losing a bunch of samples.
I don't have all my files with me at work, so can't post the appropriate slide.  From memory, the current thinking is that the 2020 rover will explore and sample two distinct areas near it's landing site.  After it completes its work in the first, it will travel to the second and deposit its collected sample tubes.  It will then collect the new samples in the second area and deposit them with the first set of samples.  That way, the fetch rover needs to travel to just one location to pick up the samples.

The goal for the fetch rover is to get the samples as quickly as possible.  If the 2020 rover dropped them as it went, then the fetch rover would need to retrace a substantial portion of the 2020 rover's path.  This would be especially problematic if NASA decides to use the Midway site and then go into the crater because they are several kilometers apart.

There is also talk that if the fetch mission will launch in the mid-2020s of keeping the samples on the 2020 rover and having it deliver the samples to the ascent vehicle.  In this strategy, the fetch rover would still be delivered but not depending on it eliminates the risk of failure in an untried mechanism.

Online ncb1397

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #207 on: 10/10/2018 04:41 AM »
Mars 2020 rover progress:


Offline Star One

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #208 on: 10/18/2018 06:28 AM »
Scientists to Debate Landing Site for Next Mars Rover

Quote
Hundreds of scientists and Mars-exploration enthusiasts will convene in a hotel ballroom just north of Los Angeles later this week to present, discuss and deliberate the future landing site for NASA’s next Red Planet rover – Mars 2020. The three-day workshop is the fourth and final in a series designed to ensure NASA receives the broadest range of data and opinion from the scientific community before the agency chooses where to send the new rover.

Offline Perchlorate

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #209 on: 10/18/2018 11:16 AM »
Here's a fun idea:

Because the Mars 2020 rover leaves a trail of small sample cores for a later fetch rover to pick up, they should name the Mars 2020 rover "Hansel", and they should name the fetch rover "Gretel".  ;D

Last 3 rovers have names that are nouns representing positive traits or characteristics of exploration and risk taking (Spirit, Opportunity, Curiosity).

I propose that Mars 2020 be christened "Diligence" in that same vein.

(Then, every time it accomplishes something significant, the mission team can hoist a couple of cold ones and say "Dilly, dilly!")

 ;D
a Civil Engineer, in an age of incivility...

Offline Phil Stooke

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #210 on: 10/18/2018 09:51 PM »
And the votes are in.... no, not for the name, but for the landing site.  Jezero crater and the nearby Midway ellipse are favoured (with an extended mission to the other).  NE Syrtis second, and Columbia Hills is out.

This is only advisory at this stage, not binding.

Offline Star One

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #211 on: 10/22/2018 06:09 PM »
Scientists Double Down on Landing Sites for Sample-Collecting Mars Rover

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By the workshop’s conclusion, the combined tallies suggested a consensus preference for a hybrid approach—one in which the Mars 2020 rover would visit and explore the dry lakebeds and deltas of Jezero Crater as well as the ancient rocks of the Midway site, which is only some 28 kilometers away. That’s not too far, as the crow flies, but still a potentially tall order for a robotic rover trundling across uneven alien terrain. Making the trek would be a stretch goal for the rover, as the traverse could easily require time in excess of its 2.35-year primary mission. Also, even though this two-for-one approach is scientifically compelling, it is not set in stone: The decision of where exactly to send Mars 2020 rests with NASA’s top scientist, Thomas Zurbuchen, who is expected to review the workshop’s findings and announce his choice by year’s end. His review will then go up the NASA leadership chain for a final announcement.

Offline catdlr

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #212 on: 10/27/2018 01:30 AM »
Mars 2020 Parachute a Go

Source:  JPL Newsletter


Quote
In the early hours of Sept. 7, NASA broke a world record.

Less than 2 minutes after the launch of a 58-foot-tall (17.7-meter) Black Brant IX sounding rocket, a payload separated and began its dive back through Earth's atmosphere. When onboard sensors determined the payload had reached the appropriate height and Mach number (38 kilometers altitude, Mach 1.8 ), the payload deployed a parachute. Within four-tenths of a second, the 180-pound parachute billowed out from being a solid cylinder to being fully inflated.

It was the fastest inflation in the history of a parachute this size and created a peak load of almost 70,000 pounds of force.

Video reference in article:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcAgnQ9K7UY?t=001



« Last Edit: 10/27/2018 03:26 AM by catdlr »
Tony De La Rosa

Offline Star One

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #213 on: 10/27/2018 08:06 PM »
Scientists call for ‘mega-mission’ to find ancient life on Mars

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American rocket engineers are being urged to push their next Mars mission to the limits of technological performance. Space scientists have told Nasa they want the agency to “dream big” to ensure their new robot rover, scheduled for launch in 2020, visits a maximum number of sites to increase chances of uncovering signs of ancient life on Mars.

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“The community prefers a mega-mission,” said Bethany Ehlmann, a planetary scientist at the California Institute of Technology, quoted in Nature this month. “If we are going to do a sample return, it has to be a sample cache for the ages.”

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Around 2026, Nasa plans to launch a follow-up mission that would land a rocket launcher and new robot craft, called Fetch Rover, on Mars. Fetch Rover will gather up the caches and deliver them back to the rocket, which will then blast the samples into orbit round Mars. There it will rendezvous with an orbiter to carry the samples back to Earth.

“We will have the strictest quarantine conditions enforced when we collect and store those samples,” said Golombek. “It will be worth the effort and expense, however. This is going to be our best chance of finding out if life evolved independently on another world and that life here is not just a lucky accident.”

Online Zed_Noir

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #214 on: 10/28/2018 07:56 PM »
Scientists call for ‘mega-mission’ to find ancient life on Mars

Quote
American rocket engineers are being urged to push their next Mars mission to the limits of technological performance. Space scientists have told Nasa they want the agency to “dream big” to ensure their new robot rover, scheduled for launch in 2020, visits a maximum number of sites to increase chances of uncovering signs of ancient life on Mars.

Quote
“The community prefers a mega-mission,” said Bethany Ehlmann, a planetary scientist at the California Institute of Technology, quoted in Nature this month. “If we are going to do a sample return, it has to be a sample cache for the ages.”

Quote
Around 2026, Nasa plans to launch a follow-up mission that would land a rocket launcher and new robot craft, called Fetch Rover, on Mars. Fetch Rover will gather up the caches and deliver them back to the rocket, which will then blast the samples into orbit round Mars. There it will rendezvous with an orbiter to carry the samples back to Earth.

“We will have the strictest quarantine conditions enforced when we collect and store those samples,” said Golombek. “It will be worth the effort and expense, however. This is going to be our best chance of finding out if life evolved independently on another world and that life here is not just a lucky accident.”

start ::)

Unless Bethany Ehlmann think that the US Congress is going to substantially increase the budget of your current Mars rover of about $2B. This is just wishful thinking.

This is another example of some in NASA trying to gold-plated a program.

end ::)

Offline Phil Stooke

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #215 on: 10/28/2018 08:33 PM »
Thanks for sharing!  But this isn't about a bigger rover, it's about choosing a mega-mission plan with the same rover.  Landing at Jezero and driving to Midway, or the reverse, rather than choosing just one site.  A bigger range of samples and several interesting strategies for designing the cache for that scenario.  It's all in the recently concluded Mars 2020 landing site workshop.

https://marsnext.jpl.nasa.gov/workshops/wkshp_2018_10.cfm

The scientists preferred this option, now it has to be sold to NASA.  You can safely ignore a sprinkling of journalist-style hype which crept into that report.  No gold-plating required. 

Online hop

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #216 on: 10/28/2018 08:36 PM »
Unless Bethany Ehlmann think that the US Congress is going to substantially increase the budget of your current Mars rover of about $2B. This is just wishful thinking.
If you read the context of the original quote (https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-07064-y), it's clear Dr Ehlmann was commenting on the type and ambitiousness of the landing sites that got the most votes in the workshop, not arguing for additional missions or funding.

Offline Star One

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Re: NASA - Mars 2020 Rover
« Reply #217 on: 10/28/2018 08:46 PM »
Unless Bethany Ehlmann think that the US Congress is going to substantially increase the budget of your current Mars rover of about $2B. This is just wishful thinking.
If you read the context of the original quote (https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-07064-y), it's clear Dr Ehlmann was commenting on the type and ambitiousness of the landing sites that got the most votes in the workshop, not arguing for additional missions or funding.

I thought that was clear from the article?

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