Author Topic: Orion Discussion Thread 2  (Read 123962 times)

Offline su27k

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #320 on: 07/23/2018 02:26 AM »
They got Orion to the White House as showcase for some Made in America parade: https://twitter.com/nasahqphoto/status/1021088510504316930, pretty strange choice given the service module is built by the Europeans....

Online catdlr

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #321 on: 07/23/2018 05:32 AM »
They got Orion to the White House as showcase for some Made in America parade: https://twitter.com/nasahqphoto/status/1021088510504316930, pretty strange choice given the service module is built by the Europeans....

Here is more of the arrival:  https://www.flickr.com/photos/nasahqphoto/albums/72157669355997107
Tony De La Rosa

Offline envy887

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #322 on: 07/23/2018 04:51 PM »
They got Orion to the White House as showcase for some Made in America parade: https://twitter.com/nasahqphoto/status/1021088510504316930, pretty strange choice given the service module is built by the Europeans....

I don't see the service module at all. That looks like the EFT-1 module, which didn't even have a real service module.

Online russianhalo117

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #323 on: 07/24/2018 03:23 PM »
They got Orion to the White House as showcase for some Made in America parade: https://twitter.com/nasahqphoto/status/1021088510504316930, pretty strange choice given the service module is built by the Europeans....

I don't see the service module at all. That looks like the EFT-1 module, which didn't even have a real service module.
It is from EFT-1 and the LM built SM ETA that flew burned up on reentry.

Offline su27k

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #324 on: 07/25/2018 02:27 PM »
They got Orion to the White House as showcase for some Made in America parade: https://twitter.com/nasahqphoto/status/1021088510504316930, pretty strange choice given the service module is built by the Europeans....

I don't see the service module at all. That looks like the EFT-1 module, which didn't even have a real service module.

I'll just quote @nasawatch which explains the irony better: http://nasawatch.com/archives/2018/07/that-madeinamer.html

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Keith's note: And the eager #MadeInAmerica fans left out a paragraph "The Service Module is being built by Airbus Defence and Space." which is, of course, a European company using lots of European subcontractors. The European Service Module (ESM) is a rather crucial part of the overall system. How odd that the Coalition - and NASA - seem to forget to mention this fact in the furry of trying to hop on the latest White House slogan bandwagon.

Its also odd, that in the rush to tow piece of space hardware inside the White House gate that no one mentions the wholly American spacecraft being built by the private sector by Boeing, SpaceX, Sierra Nevada, Virgin Galactic, and Blue Origin. That is the real #MadeInAmerica story. And why wasn't the Commercial Spaceflight Federation invited to participate? Their members have more spacecraft and launch systems #MadeInAmerica than NASA does.

Offline Khadgars

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #325 on: 07/26/2018 12:51 AM »
Not sure I understand the backlash.  I would ague the Orion capsule, of which several are being built currently, is much more technically challenging and requires more R&D than the Service Module.  Not that the SM isn't critically important, but NASAWATCh is just splitting hairs so they can make their usual, dull point over and over.

Offline Coastal Ron

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #326 on: 07/26/2018 04:51 PM »
Not sure I understand the backlash.

Boeing, SpaceX, Blue Origin and Sierra Nevada are building spacecraft that are 100% built in the U.S. of A.

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I would ague the Orion capsule, of which several are being built currently, is much more technically challenging and requires more R&D than the Service Module.

No one was debating the percentage, but if you look at the stack the Service Module is a significant portion of the Orion transportation system. Even if it's an 80/20 content ratio, it's pretty close to 50/50 in size.

And regardless why ESA is building the Service Module, the Orion Command Module can't go anywhere without it - so NASA can't go anywhere in space without European help. So not as "Built in America" as commercial spacecraft.

The Trump administration just wanted to tout NASA, but in doing so they ignored the real American innovation taking place in space transportation.
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline Khadgars

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #327 on: 07/27/2018 08:02 PM »
Are you even sure that is a true statement?  Did SpaceX or BO even provide any interest on being there?  Knowing Trump, the event was likely ill planned without much notice.

There could be many reasons why they did not take part in the event that doesn't include shying away from your (and mine) favorite private enterprises.

As a side note, I agree it would have been nice to see D2, CST-100, DreamChaser there, but bashing NASA yet again for something they literally have no control over is just childish.

Offline Coastal Ron

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #328 on: 07/27/2018 08:27 PM »
Are you even sure that is a true statement?  Did SpaceX or BO even provide any interest on being there?  Knowing Trump, the event was likely ill planned without much notice.

Yet Trump's people were able to get NASA to hustle up the Orion vehicle from Florida with no problem.

Do you think Elon Musk or Boeing would pass up a chance to show off their spacecraft?

Blue Origin would not have been invited because of Trump's tiff with Bezos, and maybe promoting Sierra Nevada's Dream Chaser would have been iffy because of the owners - even though they are living the American Dream©.

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There could be many reasons why they did not take part in the event that doesn't include shying away from your (and mine) favorite private enterprises.

As you said, bad planning can't be ruled out when talking about Trump's executive office. But if NASA can hustle up an Orion, Boeing and SpaceX could have hustled up a version of their spacecraft.

Quote
As a side note, I agree it would have been nice to see D2, CST-100, DreamChaser there, but bashing NASA yet again for something they literally have no control over is just childish.

NASA wasn't in control of the event, so why would you think I'm "bashing NASA"? Weird.
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline TripleSeven

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #329 on: 07/29/2018 03:02 PM »
Are you even sure that is a true statement?  Did SpaceX or BO even provide any interest on being there?  Knowing Trump, the event was likely ill planned without much notice.



NASA wasn't in control of the event, so why would you think I'm "bashing NASA"? Weird.

my "guess" is that Trump's people did not want anything but Orion there.  this is a political not technical judgment...but my guess is that Trump will latch onto Orion like its his personal "cat" and hope like heck that it flies sometime in his first term as a symbol of "America being great"

I dont think that they consider the private efforts part of that plan

Offline Khadgars

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #330 on: 07/29/2018 04:29 PM »
To be honest, I think Trump intentionally did not invite SpaceX and BO because they're considered "liberal" or democrat "companies" if that makes sense.  He's shown to be quite petty in that regard.

In any case, you can't fault Orion for being there.  It's definitely supporting American R&D and manufacturing.

Offline AncientU

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #331 on: 07/29/2018 08:08 PM »
To be honest, I think Trump intentionally did not invite SpaceX and BO because they're considered "liberal" or democrat "companies" if that makes sense.  He's shown to be quite petty in that regard.

In any case, you can't fault Orion for being there.  It's definitely supporting American R&D and manufacturing.

How is Orion supporting R&D?
It's a capsule... that lands in the ocean.  (I think that has already been developed.)
« Last Edit: 07/29/2018 08:09 PM by AncientU »
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Offline Robotbeat

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #332 on: 07/30/2018 02:51 AM »
To be honest, I think Trump intentionally did not invite SpaceX and BO because they're considered "liberal" or democrat "companies" if that makes sense.  He's shown to be quite petty in that regard....
I doubt it.
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Offline docmordrid

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #333 on: 08/27/2018 04:12 AM »
To be honest, I think Trump intentionally did not invite SpaceX and BO because they're considered "liberal" or democrat "companies" if that makes sense.  >

You clearly missed the praise he gave SpaceX & Musk after the Falcon Heavy debut launch.

Ars...

Not to mention the administraton's support for  regulatory changes "NewSpace" requested, and have so far received.
« Last Edit: 08/27/2018 04:23 AM by docmordrid »
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Offline SciNews

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #334 on: 10/10/2018 07:24 PM »
NASA is using HoloLens AR headsets to build its new spacecraft faster
https://www.technologyreview.com/s/612247/nasa-is-using-hololens-ar-headsets-to-build-its-new-spacecraft-faster/
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Lockheed Martin engineers wear the goggles to help them assemble the crew capsule Orionówithout having to read thousands of pages of paper instructions.

Offline docmordrid

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #335 on: 11/27/2018 04:24 PM »
Ummmmm...

https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/1067464407523962880

Anatoly Zak @RussianSpaceWeb
We hear that after years of development, @NASA_Orion's rendezvous system was deemed too unreliable for the cis-station project. So, the effort is underway to upgrade it. INSIDER CONTENT: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/insider-content.html
12:05 PM - Nov 27, 2018
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Offline RonM

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #336 on: 11/27/2018 06:08 PM »
What? Lockheed Martin has been working on this thing for twelve years. The original version would have to dock with Altair in lunar orbit, so docking with LOP-G isn't a new requirement.

Offline M129K

Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #337 on: 11/28/2018 04:02 PM »
Docking at LOP-G likely isn't the problem. Orion not only has to dock, it also has to manoeuvre space station components around and dock those as well, which I think is the likely reason it's deemed unreliable all of a sudden.
Assume the worst. Things can only go uphill from there.

Offline woods170

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #338 on: 11/29/2018 08:00 AM »
Docking at LOP-G likely isn't the problem. Orion not only has to dock, it also has to manoeuvre space station components around and dock those as well, which I think is the likely reason it's deemed unreliable all of a sudden.

Until there is more information available about this supposed problem any posts here, taking guesses at the cause, are pure conjecture.

Offline Proponent

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Re: Orion Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #339 on: 11/29/2018 03:31 PM »
To be honest, I think Trump intentionally did not invite SpaceX and BO because they're considered "liberal" or democrat "companies" if that makes sense.  >

You clearly missed the praise he gave SpaceX & Musk after the Falcon Heavy debut launch.

Ars...

Yeah, but Trump seems to have little persistent interest in space: it's handled by Pence, who is definitely an SLS man.

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