Author Topic: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities  (Read 184663 times)

Offline Comga

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4012
  • Liked: 1342
  • Likes Given: 1086
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #220 on: 12/22/2015 02:51 PM »
So -- no clue either way as to whether or not a big circle-X has been painted onto the main landing pad at Landing Complex 1, in preparation for tomorrow's landing attempt?

No September image is available on the TerraServer, so the latest remains the one from August which has no X.
There are other resources for overhead photography, but a better hope is for a ground based image Tuesday morning with a smudged, shadowed Space-X. ;)

Done!
What kind of wastrels would dump a perfectly good booster in the ocean after just one use?

Online rcoppola

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1966
  • USA
  • Liked: 1213
  • Likes Given: 507
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #221 on: 12/23/2015 05:32 PM »
Any word where LZ-2 will be placed? Is there another open LC along missile row they can lease and put in another landing pad? I'm thinking of the boosters for FH. (Central core will probably go to the ASDS at this point.)
Sail the oceans of space and set foot upon new lands!
http://www.stormsurgemedia.com

Offline rpapo

  • Cybernetic Mole
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1074
  • Michigan, USA
  • Liked: 487
  • Likes Given: 405
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #222 on: 12/23/2015 05:37 PM »
Any word where LZ-2 will be placed? Is there another open LC along missile row they can lease and put in another landing pad? I'm thinking of the boosters for FH. (Central core will probably go to the ASDS at this point.)
Why?  Setting aside the EIS for the moment, wasn't the plan to build more pads in their currently leased zone?
An Apollo fanboy . . . fifty years ago.

Online rcoppola

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1966
  • USA
  • Liked: 1213
  • Likes Given: 507
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #223 on: 12/23/2015 05:48 PM »
Any word where LZ-2 will be placed? Is there another open LC along missile row they can lease and put in another landing pad? I'm thinking of the boosters for FH. (Central core will probably go to the ASDS at this point.)
Why?  Setting aside the EIS for the moment, wasn't the plan to build more pads in their currently leased zone?
That was indeed the plan the last FH animation outlined. But after seeing the actual return profile, landing and size of the pad, I was wondering if there's enough space at LZ-1 to have two pads of that size, separated by enough distance to allow each booster enough margin "room" to maneuverer. Perhaps there is and they still intend to build another one. It's just a question...
« Last Edit: 12/23/2015 05:49 PM by rcoppola »
Sail the oceans of space and set foot upon new lands!
http://www.stormsurgemedia.com

Offline meekGee

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7893
  • N. California
  • Liked: 4139
  • Likes Given: 843
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #224 on: 12/23/2015 05:52 PM »
Any word where LZ-2 will be placed? Is there another open LC along missile row they can lease and put in another landing pad? I'm thinking of the boosters for FH. (Central core will probably go to the ASDS at this point.)
Why?  Setting aside the EIS for the moment, wasn't the plan to build more pads in their currently leased zone?
That was indeed the plan the last FH animation outlined. But after seeing the actual return profile, landing and size of the pad, I was wondering if there's enough space at LZ-1 to have two pads of that size, separated by enough distance to allow each booster enough margin "room" to maneuverer. Perhaps there is and they still intend to build another one. It's just a question...

Only the center pad is this large, and IMO it is the "crash pad".  The actual landing pads are the four around it, and looking at the landing, they're pretty oversized as they are....   SpaceX could have replaced each pad with four 3' circular pads in the right locations :)

ABCD - Always Be Counting Down

Offline JasonAW3

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2434
  • Claremore, Ok.
  • Liked: 384
  • Likes Given: 11
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #225 on: 12/23/2015 06:05 PM »
Any word where LZ-2 will be placed? Is there another open LC along missile row they can lease and put in another landing pad? I'm thinking of the boosters for FH. (Central core will probably go to the ASDS at this point.)
Why?  Setting aside the EIS for the moment, wasn't the plan to build more pads in their currently leased zone?
That was indeed the plan the last FH animation outlined. But after seeing the actual return profile, landing and size of the pad, I was wondering if there's enough space at LZ-1 to have two pads of that size, separated by enough distance to allow each booster enough margin "room" to maneuverer. Perhaps there is and they still intend to build another one. It's just a question...

Only the center pad is this large, and IMO it is the "crash pad".  The actual landing pads are the four around it, and looking at the landing, they're pretty oversized as they are....   SpaceX could have replaced each pad with four 3' circular pads in the right locations :)

Actually, I wouldn't be at all suprised if the big central one was for the BFR's and MCT's while the outer ones are for the Falcon 9 and Dragonns.
My God!  It's full of universes!

Offline meekGee

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7893
  • N. California
  • Liked: 4139
  • Likes Given: 843
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #226 on: 12/23/2015 06:06 PM »
Any word where LZ-2 will be placed? Is there another open LC along missile row they can lease and put in another landing pad? I'm thinking of the boosters for FH. (Central core will probably go to the ASDS at this point.)
Why?  Setting aside the EIS for the moment, wasn't the plan to build more pads in their currently leased zone?
That was indeed the plan the last FH animation outlined. But after seeing the actual return profile, landing and size of the pad, I was wondering if there's enough space at LZ-1 to have two pads of that size, separated by enough distance to allow each booster enough margin "room" to maneuverer. Perhaps there is and they still intend to build another one. It's just a question...

Only the center pad is this large, and IMO it is the "crash pad".  The actual landing pads are the four around it, and looking at the landing, they're pretty oversized as they are....   SpaceX could have replaced each pad with four 3' circular pads in the right locations :)

Actually, I wouldn't be at all suprised if the big central one was for the BFR's and MCT's while the outer ones are for the Falcon 9 and Dragonns.
That would be a hell of a surprise...
ABCD - Always Be Counting Down

Online rcoppola

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1966
  • USA
  • Liked: 1213
  • Likes Given: 507
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #227 on: 12/23/2015 06:09 PM »
Any word where LZ-2 will be placed? Is there another open LC along missile row they can lease and put in another landing pad? I'm thinking of the boosters for FH. (Central core will probably go to the ASDS at this point.)
Why?  Setting aside the EIS for the moment, wasn't the plan to build more pads in their currently leased zone?
That was indeed the plan the last FH animation outlined. But after seeing the actual return profile, landing and size of the pad, I was wondering if there's enough space at LZ-1 to have two pads of that size, separated by enough distance to allow each booster enough margin "room" to maneuverer. Perhaps there is and they still intend to build another one. It's just a question...

Only the center pad is this large, and IMO it is the "crash pad".  The actual landing pads are the four around it, and looking at the landing, they're pretty oversized as they are....   SpaceX could have replaced each pad with four 3' circular pads in the right locations :)
Yes, I know what you mean and I rationally agree...but I get the feeling these plans have changed. I guess we'll find out soon enough. Perhaps in early spring if not sooner.
« Last Edit: 12/23/2015 06:10 PM by rcoppola »
Sail the oceans of space and set foot upon new lands!
http://www.stormsurgemedia.com

Offline Kansan52

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 897
  • Hutchinson, KS
  • Liked: 273
  • Likes Given: 313
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #228 on: 12/23/2015 06:23 PM »
Logic says (engineering may disagree) but if any margin is needed during landing, that margin could be done with a slightly different timing of the boostback phase. So 1 second difference between each core at that speed should create a large separation at landing. Could be possible that less than a second could do it and have a usable separation.

Online rcoppola

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1966
  • USA
  • Liked: 1213
  • Likes Given: 507
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #229 on: 12/23/2015 06:29 PM »
Logic says (engineering may disagree) but if any margin is needed during landing, that margin could be done with a slightly different timing of the boostback phase. So 1 second difference between each core at that speed should create a large separation at landing. Could be possible that less than a second could do it and have a usable separation.
Absolutely agree. But I wonder what the scenarios look like for one landing successfully and one core not (at the pad)? What are the distance safety margins for potentially not losing both?
« Last Edit: 12/23/2015 06:35 PM by rcoppola »
Sail the oceans of space and set foot upon new lands!
http://www.stormsurgemedia.com

Offline Kansan52

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 897
  • Hutchinson, KS
  • Liked: 273
  • Likes Given: 313
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #230 on: 12/23/2015 06:43 PM »
My guess (and only a guess) is the separation between the pads will be enough. They will be on separate paths.  Not like the turbulence cause by a plane landing then another plane lands on the same runway. Each core is it's own runway, so to speak.

Offline Craig_VG

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 137
  • Liked: 347
  • Likes Given: 368
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #231 on: 12/26/2015 04:28 PM »
Yesterday I was flying to Miami and realized I would pass by the cape. I took out my 300mm and got a couple good shots of the landing pad. If you'd like I can post the original RAW files as you guys are pros at photo editing.

Offline meekGee

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7893
  • N. California
  • Liked: 4139
  • Likes Given: 843
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #232 on: 12/26/2015 05:02 PM »
Yesterday I was flying to Miami and realized I would pass by the cape. I took out my 300mm and got a couple good shots of the landing pad. If you'd like I can post the original RAW files as you guys are pros at photo editing.

Awesome!

Can see the logistics area (rectangular) which supports the idea that the stage was driven by the crane (what an awesome sight!) to a common area where "de-legging" occurs.  (The crane is still there)

Too cool.
ABCD - Always Be Counting Down

Offline Mongo62

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 919
  • Liked: 557
  • Likes Given: 123
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #233 on: 12/26/2015 05:28 PM »
Here is a close-up of the above upper image, showing the area where the paint of the X appears to have been eroded away. The central point of that area must be within a few meters of the intersection of the two SpaceX slashes.


Offline meekGee

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7893
  • N. California
  • Liked: 4139
  • Likes Given: 843
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #234 on: 12/26/2015 05:58 PM »
Sadly, no sign of any of the smaller pads...  I keep seeing one on the lower left (like it was brush-cleared) but I think it's just willful imagination...
ABCD - Always Be Counting Down

Offline Comga

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4012
  • Liked: 1342
  • Likes Given: 1086
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #235 on: 12/26/2015 06:08 PM »
Here is a close-up of the above upper image, showing the area where the paint of the X appears to have been eroded away. The central point of that area must be within a few meters of the intersection of the two SpaceX slashes.

You have insufficient evidence to say that, particularly from this image, which is great for what it is.
We know your second point is correct from the helicopter video, photos and videos from the pad after the landing, and statements by, IIRC, Musk in the post-landing Q&A.
« Last Edit: 12/26/2015 06:09 PM by Comga »
What kind of wastrels would dump a perfectly good booster in the ocean after just one use?

Offline AnalogMan

  • Member
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2950
  • Cambridge, UK
  • Liked: 676
  • Likes Given: 22
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #236 on: 12/26/2015 11:28 PM »
Yesterday I was flying to Miami and realized I would pass by the cape. I took out my 300mm and got a couple good shots of the landing pad. If you'd like I can post the original RAW files as you guys are pros at photo editing.

Tweaked the first photo (maybe a tad too much though!)
« Last Edit: 12/26/2015 11:28 PM by AnalogMan »

Offline meekGee

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7893
  • N. California
  • Liked: 4139
  • Likes Given: 843
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #237 on: 12/27/2015 01:38 AM »
Does anyone have the image of the four small pads?  Maybe we can overlay it (and distort it) to match the picture, and gain some insight
ABCD - Always Be Counting Down

Offline bstrong

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 393
  • Liked: 492
  • Likes Given: 328
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #238 on: 12/27/2015 04:45 AM »
I drew lines connecting the water cannons in an attempt to find the center of the pad, but after seeing the overlay, I just wonder if the paint wasn't completely dry.

Offline the_other_Doug

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2594
  • Minneapolis, MN
  • Liked: 1617
  • Likes Given: 2910
Re: SpaceX Eastern Range Landing Facilities
« Reply #239 on: 12/27/2015 05:30 AM »
From the look of the picture above (and I know, it's not high enough resolution to be certain), it really looks like the blast pattern indicates the stage landed near the edge of the inner ring.  I know, that's not exactly what the helicopter landing video seems to show, but there is a discoloration at about the 1:30 position on the transected circle image bstrong posted.  The edge between the inner concrete pad and the outer gravel ring (I'm assuming) has been scuffed out, and the end of the "X" has been darkened into a streak that looks like it extends into the outer ring.

I wish we could have an overhead image of the pad the morning after, before the crane was attached and the Falcon could have been moved.  Just to see exactly where it landed...
-Doug  (With my shield, not yet upon it)

Tags: