Author Topic: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2  (Read 2406353 times)

Online deruch

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #520 on: 01/05/2015 07:27 AM »
And are we sure about 160' figure? Marmac 300 has 18' height how long is falcon 9 first stage + I/E when on its legs? I think it should be ~47m any good source?
SpaceFlight 101 has 42m for the first stage.  When standing on its legs, it should be about 2m taller.  Plus you have to count the height of the interstage.  Judging by proportions, it appears to be 4-5 meters in length.  That's 49 meters, which is about 160 feet.

Add to that the height of the landing deck above the water, and it's mighty close.  They may need to do it at low tide, or at least avoid high tide.

If anybody has better numbers, feel free to correct my guesstimate.

Using HPU height as basis in meekgee's image  I think ASDS deck was about 11.6ft high. and using Helodriver's awesome pics at Vandenberg and JimNtexas pics(July 6 2014) I think 158 ft(minus cap) is its height on legs. So plenty of margin to clear bridge and power cables.

Does that include the interstage?


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« Last Edit: 01/05/2015 07:28 AM by deruch »
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Offline Ohsin

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #521 on: 01/05/2015 07:53 AM »
Yes it does include inter stage. With cap I meant the cone part onto which crane hooks. Now I wonder how it will get unloaded without it..
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Offline Dave G

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #522 on: 01/05/2015 08:04 AM »
SpaceX specs Falcon 9 at 68.4m (224.4 feet). 

What does this mean?
1) The combined height of the first and second stages only?
2) The height of an F9 with Dragon?
3) The height of an F9 with a satellite PLF?

Offline Ohsin

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #523 on: 01/05/2015 08:21 AM »
SpaceX specs Falcon 9 at 68.4m (224.4 feet). 

What does this mean?
1) The combined height of the first and second stages only?
2) The height of an F9 with Dragon?
3) The height of an F9 with a satellite PLF?


From measurements I think its 3.
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Offline Dave G

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #524 on: 01/05/2015 08:42 AM »
SpaceX specs Falcon 9 at 68.4m (224.4 feet). 

What does this mean?
1) The combined height of the first and second stages only?
2) The height of an F9 with Dragon?
3) The height of an F9 with a satellite PLF?

From measurements I think its 3.

Then measuring this picture, and scaling for 224.4 feet, it looks like the first stage is 163 feet tall, with the interstage, but without legs.



Offline Ohsin

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #525 on: 01/05/2015 09:08 AM »
SpaceX specs Falcon 9 at 68.4m (224.4 feet). 

What does this mean?
1) The combined height of the first and second stages only?
2) The height of an F9 with Dragon?
3) The height of an F9 with a satellite PLF?

From measurements I think its 3.

Then measuring this picture, and scaling for 224.4 feet, it looks like the first stage is 163 feet tall, with the interstage, but without legs.

This is not very good picture for reference. Vandenberg pictures are pretty good as they are taken from a height. Also did you use diameter(12ft) or fairing height(43ft) to deduce?
« Last Edit: 01/05/2015 09:09 AM by Ohsin »
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Offline Dave G

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #526 on: 01/05/2015 09:19 AM »
This is not very good picture for reference. Vandenberg pictures are pretty good as they are taken from a height. Also did you use diameter(12ft) or fairing height(43ft) to deduce?

I measured the total height and the height of the first stage, and then scaled for a total height of 224.4 feet.

The camera angle creates a linear perspective which should scale both measurements equally, unless there are fish-eye type lens distortions, which this picture doesn't appear to have.

Offline PhilW

Yes it does include inter stage. With cap I meant the cone part onto which crane hooks. Now I wonder how it will get unloaded without it..
Maybe that is the intended use of the white adapter that was sitting in front of the 4 x Grey/Blue F9 supports? Bolts into the interstage to allow the F9 to be crane lifted?

Offline Dave G

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #528 on: 01/05/2015 09:45 AM »
Well, this picture produces different results.  Measuring this and scaling for 224.4 feet, it looks like the first stage is 155 feet tall, with the interstage, but without legs.

Offline PhilW

This is not very good picture for reference. Vandenberg pictures are pretty good as they are taken from a height. Also did you use diameter(12ft) or fairing height(43ft) to deduce?

I measured the total height and the height of the first stage, and then scaled for a total height of 224.4 feet.

The camera angle creates a linear perspective which should scale both measurements equally, unless there are fish-eye type lens distortions, which this picture doesn't appear to have.
Would trust SpX has already done this math, way before they leased the dock side land & installed the F9 supports.

Offline Ohsin

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #530 on: 01/05/2015 10:03 AM »
This is not very good picture for reference. Vandenberg pictures are pretty good as they are taken from a height. Also did you use diameter(12ft) or fairing height(43ft) to deduce?

I measured the total height and the height of the first stage, and then scaled for a total height of 224.4 feet.

The camera angle creates a linear perspective which should scale both measurements equally, unless there are fish-eye type lens distortions, which this picture doesn't appear to have.

Curved fairing when seen from below would give wrong measurement. What I do is take a decent image which is sharp and taken from far such that the joining lines between stages is as straight as possible after that use diameter or fairing height as reference and scale it up to full length to get proportional relation then multiply it with known number.
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Offline Dave G

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #531 on: 01/05/2015 10:06 AM »
Would trust SpX has already done this math, way before they leased the dock side land & installed the F9 supports.

Yeah, but its gonna be pretty close to the bottom of the bridge.  As others have said, it'll be a great photo op.  Be surprised if that picture doesn't make the major news outlets.

Offline rpapo

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #532 on: 01/05/2015 11:02 AM »
Yes it does include inter stage. With cap I meant the cone part onto which crane hooks. Now I wonder how it will get unloaded without it..
That cap won't be there.  After the second stage departs, the top of the interstage is an empty tube which used to contain the Merlin 1D Vacuum engine and its nozzle.  That empty space is a cylinder about 15-20 feet deep, and close to 12 feet across.  Look at the recent pictures of the interstage with the grid fins extended to get the idea.

Which of course begs the question of what exactly they are going to connect the crane hook too.  They have to have something, since they did something similar for the stage acceptance tests back in MacGregor (though the interstage might not have been present there).
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Online deruch

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #533 on: 01/05/2015 11:05 AM »
Yes it does include inter stage. With cap I meant the cone part onto which crane hooks. Now I wonder how it will get unloaded without it..
That cap won't be there.  After the second stage departs, the top of the interstage is an empty tube which used to contain the Merlin 1D Vacuum engine and its nozzle.  That empty space is a cylinder about 15-20 feet deep, and close to 12 feet across.  Look at the recent pictures of the interstage with the grid fins extended to get the idea.

Which of course begs the question of what exactly they are going to connect the crane hook too.  They have to have something, since they did something similar for the stage acceptance tests back in MacGregor (though the interstage might not have been present there).

I think he realizes that the cap won't be on it.  Otherwise why would he comment on the difficulties of transferring the stage without it?
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Offline OxCartMark

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #534 on: 01/05/2015 11:16 AM »
Yes it does include inter stage. With cap I meant the cone part onto which crane hooks. Now I wonder how it will get unloaded without it..
Maybe that is the intended use of the white adapter that was sitting in front of the 4 x Grey/Blue F9 supports? Bolts into the interstage to allow the F9 to be crane lifted?
That is my belief.

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Offline cartman

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #535 on: 01/05/2015 12:15 PM »
They are now about 3.3 nautical miles away from their target, so they should be there in an hour or so.
« Last Edit: 01/05/2015 12:15 PM by cartman »

Offline Kabloona

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #536 on: 01/05/2015 12:29 PM »
Last launch attempt, both ships apparently turned their AIS transponders off shortly after leaving port. Wonder why this time is different.

Online deruch

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #537 on: 01/05/2015 12:37 PM »
Last launch attempt, both ships apparently turned their AIS transponders off shortly after leaving port. Wonder why this time is different.

Maybe they didn't.  Maybe we just didn't have anyone track them on the vesselfinder.com site?  They dropped off the marinetraffic.com site at about the same point as we lost them on the previous attempt. 
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Offline Kabloona

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #538 on: 01/05/2015 01:00 PM »
Last launch attempt, both ships apparently turned their AIS transponders off shortly after leaving port. Wonder why this time is different.

Maybe they didn't.  Maybe we just didn't have anyone track them on the vesselfinder.com site?  They dropped off the marinetraffic.com site at about the same point as we lost them on the previous attempt.

Yes, last time I checked periodically on the Marine Traffic app and they were offline for the entire time at sea. This time they are still online with Marine Traffic, so something is different.

Offline robertross

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Re: SpaceX's Autonomous Spaceport Drone Ship Discussion Thread 2
« Reply #539 on: 01/05/2015 01:18 PM »
Last launch attempt, both ships apparently turned their AIS transponders off shortly after leaving port. Wonder why this time is different.

Maybe they didn't.  Maybe we just didn't have anyone track them on the vesselfinder.com site?  They dropped off the marinetraffic.com site at about the same point as we lost them on the previous attempt.

Yes, last time I checked periodically on the Marine Traffic app and they were offline for the entire time at sea. This time they are still online with Marine Traffic, so something is different.

Maybe they realized how persistent the NSF gang is (like finding the ship webcams), and wanted us to refrain from even more clever tactics?  ;)
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