SpaceX Falcon 9 v1.1 - Dragon - CRS-5/SpX-5 -Jan. 10, 2015 - DISCUSSION

[ugordan]

NASA guys getting ticked at all the drone ship questions. 

Yes, this is getting quite embarrassing even though Hans is constantly trying to emphasize CRS-5 mission is what's of utmost importance here.

[ScottMC]

I think I have solved it! Zone 2 (Blue area B on my map https://mapsengine.google.com/map/edit?mid=zp15b_P5ERVk.koWeOnV6-O-o) is a continuation of the liftoff zone (Yellow area A) with a break in it to act as a ship corridor. To test this I tracked and plotted a line of 3 tanker ships in the area and they are pretty much dead center of the gap.

Why would there be a ship corridor in the middle of an exclusion zone?  The point of an exclusion zone is to prevent ships from traveling there, lest a rocket fall on their heads.

Good question. The liftoff zones seem to be shrinking with each passing flight likely due to increased confidence. CRS-4 was tiny compared to the first launches. Atlas and Delta launches also have tiny liftoff areas. This does raise the question again of what the point of that zone is...

The mystery zone might be in case of some destructive loss of control at the point of grid-fin deployment (near the blue dot on image below).  Seems to fit in well with the mentioned deploy at the 5 minute mark.  The first zone seems to cover any possible destruction of the rocket up until MECO.

[ericspittle]

My notes so far from the portions of the presser that talked about the landing (these are far from perfect, I was listening and helping my son with homework, hopefully others can fill in my gaps, I believe everything to be correct though):

Safezone around barge approx 10 miles per RSO

Cameras and telemetry on the vehicle, there will not likely be real time information but data will be recorded locally near the drone ship. Later clarified that they don't want to make promises because they can't guarantee good satellite connection in the field, they will not have realtime through traditional communications.

4-10 foot waves in landing area for tomorrow, 14 (I think, I am trying to help my son with homework so I'm missing some of this) feet on Friday, neither one is a problem for the barge

Stage will stay on ASDS for the trip home

The barge may be a continued part of their landing plans, they mentioned that depending on the manifest it may be easier (even once they can land on land, RTL) to land on the barge still.

"In terms of video I want to say that it will come out by the end of the day [...] another thing where the link has to work, a couple hours, a day or two."

Grid fins deploy outside of the atmosphere before re-entry.

Space X: "NASA wants to make sure it doesn't take attention away from the main mission [...] there's no impact to the main mission."
NASA: they are proud to have a partner that will be trying to "further space flight in general, this is an exciting time from our perspective as well" (sorry, I tried to get the full quote and couldn't type fast enough)

"It is not a barge [...] it is a drone ship"

About 9 minutes after launch for landing.

The ultimate vision is to make this more like an aircraft where minimal service is required between landing and takeoff.

No update on Falcon Heavy launch dates

[OnWithTheShow]

NASA very interested in flying more 1 year missions. May need to wait until commercial crew is online to give more flexibility in seating.

[OnWithTheShow]

They asked if SpaceX would be interested in Wallops as a future launch site. To which Hans mentioned for now they are fine with the 4 pads they have.

[OnWithTheShow]

Flight is 40% consumables, 30% research, 30% spare parts.

[ericspittle]

The plan if a ship comes within their ASDS safety zone: "chase it away"

[edfishel]

Thanks, everyone, for the help!

[mme]

Some more tidbits from the pre-launch presser:

The webcast will focus on the primary mission.

They may not know the results immediately since the satellite internet is not always working.

Telemetry and video will be stored "locally" and it can take a while to transmit everything back to SpaceX.

If it's successful, video will be released in a day ... or two.

If Hawthorne learns it's successful, he imagines we'll find out quickly.  (I think he was implying via social media)

The stage will stay on the barge.  It safes itself and the support ship can control the safing aspects remotely if needed.  The RP-1 stays in the rocket, "like an airplane."

Crew will board the drone ship an hour or two after it lands to "tie down" the stage.

[FinalFrontier]

Some more tidbits from the pre-launch presser:

The webcast will focus on the primary mission.

They may not know the results immediately since the satellite internet is not always working.

Telemetry and video will be stored "locally" and it can take a while to transmit everything back to SpaceX.

If it's successful, video will be released in a day ... or two.

If Hawthorne learns it's successful, he imagines we'll find out quickly.  (I think he was implying via social media)

The stage will stay on the barge.  It safes itself and the support ship can control the safing aspects remotely if needed.  The RP-1 stays in the rocket, "like an airplane."

Crew will board the drone ship an hour or two after it lands to "tie down" the stage.

Glad to hear they still plan to try it. I don't see any reason for this not to work.

[mme]

And a few more items from the pre-launch presser I haven't seen yet:

The first static fire was short, they were on the fence but decided to be cautious.

The support ship(s) will be outside of the range safety zone, "something like 10 miles ... I think."

Hans will be very excited if it works, there will be a huge celebration.

Accuracy is the primary challenge to this attempt.  They've done a lot of simulations, but this is the first real flight (with grid fins.)

The entire sequence is automatic, the rocket "flies itself."

Upon return the stage will be thoroughly examined to see if they need to make any modifications to support reusability.  They plan to get as many stages up and down as possible and address as much is as needed, but no more.

There are 4 burns, including ascent.

Manifest is busy.  Vandenberg will be used more.

He made an off the hand comment something like "imagine if you could reuse a stage 50 times."

[John44]

NASA ISS Earth Science Briefing: Cloud Aerosol Transport System (CATS)
http://www.space-multimedia.nl.eu.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=9225

NASA ISS Research and Technology Briefing
http://www.space-multimedia.nl.eu.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=9226

SpaceX Commercial Resupply Services (CRS) -5 Prelaunch News Conference
http://www.space-multimedia.nl.eu.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=9227

[guckyfan]

The grid fins will deploy very early. Still basically in vacuum if I recall correctly. Need to see the rerun.

[mme]

The grid fins will deploy very early. Still basically in vacuum if I recall correctly. Need to see the rerun.

Yes, he said something like: The fins fold out 5 minutes into the flight.  [1]  And I forgot the phrasing he used, but it was explicitly before reentry.

[1] how do you quote a paraphrase?

[mme]

Last of the tidbits I heard:

Hans stressed that SpaceX's primary focus is on the mission.  Multiple times.

He made the point several times that it's a big (drone) ship and the waves are not an issue.  The stage will be very stable.

On questions about the weather for the landing, he said that there is no thick cloud rule on the way down.

Hans also mentioned that the grid fins maintain stability and save propellent.

And he confirmed that a hard landing or a partial landing would be very bad.

The first time someone asked for the coordinates of the drone ship, his reply was "stay away."

OK, I think that is everything I got.  I tried to weed out the duplicates.

[somepitch]

Hans did a really good job of that press conference IMO considering a lot of the ASDS questions were likely outside of his direct area of responsibility. Always enjoy hearing his answers.

[cscott]

Hans did a really good job of that press conference IMO considering a lot of the ASDS questions were likely outside of his direct area of responsibility. Always enjoy hearing his answers.

It's also worth noting that some of us on NSF seem to know more about the ASDS than he does. We've been following the various boats on vesselfinder, for example, and have a pretty good idea how many boats there are and exactly where they are right now.  But he did a great job with his blunt "keep away" answer.

[Targeteer]

I haven't been able to find an explanation for the two day gap in launch attempts.  Orbital phasing or something else?

[Robotbeat]

The propulsion system must only be used for station keeping as barge is being pushed by a tug.

That was never in doubt for most of us - except for a vocal minority here.

Hey, you could've been wrong.

No one who knows marine vessels ever thought differently. This platform is much more barge than ship. Now that we've seen new pictures it appears modifications are minimal. Only whats needed to be a stable base for initial landings and not much else. Very much in the SpaceX style of doing business.

Getting back to this issue of the question of whether the propulsion system would only be used for station-keeping, it looks like we have a better answer:

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/552182273865699328
"Drone spaceport ship heads to its hold position in the Atlantic to prepare for a rocket landing" (@elonmusk) (emphasis mine)

...I just want to say... "Neener"

Um, the vessel tracking information clearly shows that the ASDS was delivered to its position by tug.

No one is doubting that a tug was used. The issue was whether the on-board thrusters would (or actually, could) be only used for position-keeping. And unless Musk is a liar, we know that the on-board thrusters were not just used for position-keeping.

...From the tracks, the amount of untowed propulsive sailing by the ASDS was under 5km (which is the distance the support ships appear to be standing off from the target touch down location).

Oh, totally true, I'm sure! But still counts as a (childish) Neener.

[Robotbeat]

Does anyone have a viewing circle map? I'm in the Hampton Roads, VA area, and wanted to see if I should go down to the pier...