Author Topic: Sea Launch Future  (Read 138836 times)

Offline edzieba

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #300 on: 06/08/2021 01:53 pm »
TAS has an article essentially complaining that the hardware stripped from Odyssey and Sea Launch Commander was somehow specifically to prevent them competing with SpaceX.
Seems to be pure sabre-rattling given the stripping happened months ago and was entirely expected as part of the sale and transfer due to ITAR.

Offline Asteroza

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #301 on: 06/09/2021 12:49 am »
TAS has an article essentially complaining that the hardware stripped from Odyssey and Sea Launch Commander was somehow specifically to prevent them competing with SpaceX.
Seems to be pure sabre-rattling given the stripping happened months ago and was entirely expected as part of the sale and transfer due to ITAR.

The specific complaint of contractually being limited from competing with american launch companies as a condition of asset transfer is a bit of an odd one. If SeaLaunch was to be be resurrected, by definition it would be a global commercial launch provider, and thus de facto be in competition with american launch providers right? Otherwise it would be a russian domestic commercial only launcher, which isn't really commercially viable in the face of competition from Soyuz and Angara, or strictly a russian government payload launcher (which isn't likely considering all the Soyuz work done at Vostochny). It certainly wouldn't be launching chinese payloads due to the cornucopia of chinese launchers. Most other countries would be eager to launch on an american launch provider as well.

Rogozin is conflating american with SpaceX though, which is why he singles out Elon Musk, which leads to entertaining headlines.

Online owais.usmani

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #302 on: 09/21/2021 01:10 pm »
https://tass.ru/kosmos/12464849

Quote
MOSCOW, September 21. / TASS /. The future of the Sea Launch floating cosmodrome should be determined in the near future. This was announced by the general director of Roscosmos Dmitry Rogozin on Tuesday during the scientific-practical conference "Orbit of Youth".

"Soon the fate of the sea launch will be definitively determined," Rogozin said.

The head of Roscosmos added that it is planned to adapt the floating spaceport for the launch of promising Soyuz-5 carrier rockets.

The Sea Launch cosmodrome consists of the Odyssey floating launch platform and the command vessel. The program operated until 2014 - 32 Zenit missile launches were carried out from a platform based off the coast of the United States. In 2014, the launch activities of Sea Launch were suspended, and in September 2016, the S7 group of companies became the owner of the rocket and space complex.

Isn't Soyuz 5 a little too big for Ocean Odyssey and Commander? I thought they would be integrating the Soyuz 6 with RD-180 engine on Sea Launch.

Offline Steven Pietrobon

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #303 on: 09/22/2021 05:40 am »
Soyuz-5 diameter is 4.1 m, compared to 3.9 m for Zenit or an increase of 5%. Some of the handling equipment might need to be changed, but there's plenty of room available on the launch platforms, so space should not be a problem.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irtysh_%28rocket%29
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zenit_%28rocket_family%29
Akin's Laws of Spacecraft Design #1:  Engineering is done with numbers.  Analysis without numbers is only an opinion.

Offline GClark

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #304 on: 09/22/2021 06:09 am »
ISTR that the engine section will be 3.9m & the vehicle flares out to 4.1m above that.

Offline Steven Pietrobon

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #305 on: 09/22/2021 06:28 am »
ISTR that the engine section will be 3.9m & the vehicle flares out to 4.1m above that.

This model shows that.
Akin's Laws of Spacecraft Design #1:  Engineering is done with numbers.  Analysis without numbers is only an opinion.

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #306 on: 09/22/2021 07:06 am »
https://tass.ru/kosmos/12464849

Quote
MOSCOW, September 21. / TASS /. The future of the Sea Launch floating cosmodrome should be determined in the near future. This was announced by the general director of Roscosmos Dmitry Rogozin on Tuesday during the scientific-practical conference "Orbit of Youth".

"Soon the fate of the sea launch will be definitively determined," Rogozin said.

The head of Roscosmos added that it is planned to adapt the floating spaceport for the launch of promising Soyuz-5 carrier rockets.

The Sea Launch cosmodrome consists of the Odyssey floating launch platform and the command vessel. The program operated until 2014 - 32 Zenit missile launches were carried out from a platform based off the coast of the United States. In 2014, the launch activities of Sea Launch were suspended, and in September 2016, the S7 group of companies became the owner of the rocket and space complex.

Isn't Soyuz 5 a little too big for Ocean Odyssey and Commander? I thought they would be integrating the Soyuz 6 with RD-180 engine on Sea Launch.
The shortened versions proposed for the Odyssey Launch Platform are the alternative that only requires minimal Pad zero deck modifications. The full length versions are the separate alternative that requires major modifications to the roof structure of the MIK hangar and tank farm expansion on top of the minimal modifications of the preferred alternative. On top of the firing room, and other control rooms require complete stripping and modernisation via installing domestic replacement hardware for removed intentionally Boeing and Yuzhnoye hardware on ITAR and other grounds of reasons.

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #307 on: 09/22/2021 07:18 am »
https://tass.ru/kosmos/12464849

Quote
MOSCOW, September 21. / TASS /. The future of the Sea Launch floating cosmodrome should be determined in the near future. This was announced by the general director of Roscosmos Dmitry Rogozin on Tuesday during the scientific-practical conference "Orbit of Youth".

"Soon the fate of the sea launch will be definitively determined," Rogozin said.

The head of Roscosmos added that it is planned to adapt the floating spaceport for the launch of promising Soyuz-5 carrier rockets.

The Sea Launch cosmodrome consists of the Odyssey floating launch platform and the command vessel. The program operated until 2014 - 32 Zenit missile launches were carried out from a platform based off the coast of the United States. In 2014, the launch activities of Sea Launch were suspended, and in September 2016, the S7 group of companies became the owner of the rocket and space complex.

Isn't Soyuz 5 a little too big for Ocean Odyssey and Commander? I thought they would be integrating the Soyuz 6 with RD-180 engine on Sea Launch.
The shortened versions proposed for the Odyssey Launch Platform are the alternative that only requires minimal Pad zero deck modifications. The full length versions are the separate alternative that requires major modifications to the roof structure of the MIK hangar and tank farm expansion on top of the minimal modifications of the preferred alternative. On top of the firing room, and other control rooms require complete stripping and modernisation via installing domestic replacement hardware for removed intentionally Boeing and Yuzhnoye hardware on ITAR and other grounds of reasons.
https://tass.ru/kosmos/12464849

Quote
MOSCOW, September 21. / TASS /. The future of the Sea Launch floating cosmodrome should be determined in the near future. This was announced by the general director of Roscosmos Dmitry Rogozin on Tuesday during the scientific-practical conference "Orbit of Youth".

"Soon the fate of the sea launch will be definitively determined," Rogozin said.

The head of Roscosmos added that it is planned to adapt the floating spaceport for the launch of promising Soyuz-5 carrier rockets.

The Sea Launch cosmodrome consists of the Odyssey floating launch platform and the command vessel. The program operated until 2014 - 32 Zenit missile launches were carried out from a platform based off the coast of the United States. In 2014, the launch activities of Sea Launch were suspended, and in September 2016, the S7 group of companies became the owner of the rocket and space complex.

Isn't Soyuz 5 a little too big for Ocean Odyssey and Commander? I thought they would be integrating the Soyuz 6 with RD-180 engine on Sea Launch.
Soyuz-5,6,7 can all be launched from the OLP. The part of Zenit (engine section) that is below the zero deck level at the minus one deck level is kept the same on the new version. At the zero deck level and up the new version adopt the UR-500/Proton tank diameter but uses modern manufacturing processes such as CNC, FSW and other methods. Like developed for Proton-M and Angara-A5M the rocket is designed from day one to support 5m class PLF's in addition to the current Russian PLF offerings.

Online owais.usmani

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #308 on: 09/23/2021 12:44 pm »
Soyuz-5 diameter is 4.1 m, compared to 3.9 m for Zenit or an increase of 5%. Some of the handling equipment might need to be changed, but there's plenty of room available on the launch platforms, so space should not be a problem.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irtysh_%28rocket%29
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zenit_%28rocket_family%29

Are you sure a fully assembled Soyuz 5 can be accommodated inside the internal bays of Commander and Odyssey? 

Offline harrystranger

Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #309 on: 12/06/2021 01:57 pm »
Google Maps shows both ships still in Slavyanka https://www.google.com/maps/@42.8712036,131.3935625,496m/data=!3m1!1e3
According to Google Earth, this was taken in May 2021.

Using lower resolution Sentinel-2 imagery we can see that they're both still there as of 2021-11-15.
It can be really hard to interpret satellite imagery! Local knowledge & an understanding of an areas history are crucial pieces of the puzzle.
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Online owais.usmani

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #310 on: 12/06/2021 04:51 pm »
Google Maps shows both ships still in Slavyanka https://www.google.com/maps/@42.8712036,131.3935625,496m/data=!3m1!1e3
According to Google Earth, this was taken in May 2021.

Using lower resolution Sentinel-2 imagery we can see that they're both still there as of 2021-11-15.

Those ships would most likely remain there until a rocket which they can launch become available.

Online owais.usmani

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Offline Zed_Noir

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #312 on: 01/26/2022 07:52 am »
Sea Launch have no future if Russia moves into Ukraine, IMO. Economic sanctions will be applied that will block anyone from signing a new commercial contract with Roscosmos for years.

Offline Tomness

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #313 on: 01/26/2022 09:21 pm »
Sea Launch have no future if Russia moves into Ukraine, IMO. Economic sanctions will be applied that will block anyone from signing a new commercial contract with Roscosmos for years.

Now if they did, could they get what they need for Zenit in Ukraine?

Offline Asteroza

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #314 on: 01/26/2022 09:50 pm »
https://twitter.com/katlinegrey/status/1485496840913137665

Who has the money to afford that now though? Saudi Arabia? UAE? Singapore?

Sea Launch have no future if Russia moves into Ukraine, IMO. Economic sanctions will be applied that will block anyone from signing a new commercial contract with Roscosmos for years.

Now if they did, could they get what they need for Zenit in Ukraine?

Stockpiled parts maybe. Jigs might have been scrapped though. Taking manufacturing equipment would be hit or miss.

But, the intangible institutional knowledge of factory workers and designers is key, and not exactly something you can take on a whim. Rocket industry tribal lore is still a thing, assuming the rocket tribe is still around (they might have moved on to other industries or abroad).

Online zubenelgenubi

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #315 on: 01/27/2022 12:36 am »
Sea Launch have no future if Russia moves into Ukraine, IMO. Economic sanctions will be applied that will block anyone from signing a new commercial contract with Roscosmos for years.

Now if they did, could they get what they need for Zenit in Ukraine?
I hate to mention it, but your thought does not account for "blowing the works"--scorched earth.

The Ukrainians have done it before to thwart invaders.

The mention is to note the possibility. Any discussion, of spaceflight related equipment or factories, belongs in Space Policy.
« Last Edit: 01/27/2022 12:38 am by zubenelgenubi »
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Online owais.usmani

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #316 on: 01/27/2022 07:02 am »
Sea Launch have no future if Russia moves into Ukraine, IMO. Economic sanctions will be applied that will block anyone from signing a new commercial contract with Roscosmos for years.

Now if they did, could they get what they need for Zenit in Ukraine?

If Sea Launch ever comes back online, it will be using Progress made Soyuz-5 or its derivative using RD-180, not Ukrainian built Zenit.

Offline alexterrell

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #317 on: 01/27/2022 07:25 am »
Sea Launch have no future if Russia moves into Ukraine, IMO. Economic sanctions will be applied that will block anyone from signing a new commercial contract with Roscosmos for years.
Further, I think the threat of Russia moving into Ukraine will block anyone from signing a new commercial contract.

Russia is having great fun watching the west panic, and enjoying the attention, but they don't realise that business will slowly go elsewhere if it can. 

Online Rondaz

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Re: Sea Launch Future
« Reply #318 on: 06/07/2022 08:25 pm »
S7 Space suspends project to create light carrier rocket.

However, the company continues to operate in some areas.

7 JUN, 10:42Updated at: 13:01

MOSCOW, June 7. /TASS/. S7 Space suspended the project to create a light carrier rocket, S7 Group told TASS on Tuesday.

"Due to a lack of opportunity to raise funding, the project to create a light-class carrier rocket has been suspended," the press service said.

The company said that was the reason why it let go some of its staff - 30 people out of more than 100 - in June. "Still, S7 Space continues to operate in some areas, such as additive and welding technologies where work is underway," it said.

In September 2020, the S7 research and development center said that in 2019 it had begun the creation of a light-class carrier rocket with a reusable stage. It said the company could later use the research to build a larger, medium-class carrier rocket for launching from the Sea Launch Cosmodrome.

In January, Arseny Kisarev, director of the company's technological development department, told TASS that there were plans to test the tanks of the rocket in a third-party laboratory in 2022.

https://tass.com/science/1461897

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