Quote from: R7 on 01/10/2014 05:12 pmNo, suggesting stepping backwards to a real world solution that's already done test flights. Helicopter rotor may be a bit too much to take all the way into orbit but for first stage transport and DL of the EDL, who knows?Ok, fine, I'll play your game. When have we seen multiple helicopters flown in a formation, lifting a heavy payload while connected by a frame? Please, I'd like to know.
No, suggesting stepping backwards to a real world solution that's already done test flights. Helicopter rotor may be a bit too much to take all the way into orbit but for first stage transport and DL of the EDL, who knows?
Quote from: Lars_J on 01/10/2014 05:36 pmQuote from: R7 on 01/10/2014 05:12 pmNo, suggesting stepping backwards to a real world solution that's already done test flights. Helicopter rotor may be a bit too much to take all the way into orbit but for first stage transport and DL of the EDL, who knows?Ok, fine, I'll play your game. When have we seen multiple helicopters flown in a formation, lifting a heavy payload while connected by a frame? Please, I'd like to know.The only thing that comes to mind is the Piasecki PA-97 Helistat prototype in 1986. Consists of 4 cut down Sikorsky H34 helo and a Navy ZPG-2W blimp attached to a frame. Think the Helistat concept was ahead of the flight controls systems available at the time. It did not go well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piasecki_PA-97
Still hard to beat a barge.
The other fresh information on this approach I just saw today, http://www.suasnews.com/2014/01/26857/advanced-tactics-unveils-the-at-transformer-the-future-of-roadable-vtol-aircraft-and-modular-cargo-systems/ - claims 1600lb payload lift, so not far from the "tons" area.
Quote from: Joffan on 01/10/2014 10:49 pmThe other fresh information on this approach I just saw today, http://www.suasnews.com/2014/01/26857/advanced-tactics-unveils-the-at-transformer-the-future-of-roadable-vtol-aircraft-and-modular-cargo-systems/ - claims 1600lb payload lift, so not far from the "tons" area.eh.. 'Still hard to beat a barge." .. 21ton did the man say..
It IS hard to beat a barge - if you don't have any major landmasses in the way. Just took a look - they shipped an ET to VAFB SLC-6 via the Panama Canal for fit checks (with OV-101 Enterprise) - so east coast / west coast launch site isn't a big issue with any conceivable diameter stage in the forseeable future. Assuming, of course, that time isn't an issue - one thing that barges aren't is *fast*.My skycrane hexacopter comment was really just a throw-away response to the suggestion of bolting a cockpit and wings on a stage and flying it - if you WANT to fly it, there are simpler ways to do it. I'm surprised the idea got this much traction - although it *is* a fun idea, and you can see how it might work.My best candidate for a show-stopper is the mass of the frame - you're looking at somethin able to rigidy support a 10,000 pound (or more) rocket stage and keep 6 Skycranes a minimum of 22 meters apart (rotor diameter is 21.7m ;-) - I can see that being a bit heavy. Still, you 've got 120,000 pounds of payload capability with 6 birds ...
You DID watch the video Lars_J posted above, didn't you??
I'm primarily thinking about BFR stages that would hypothetically be built in Brownsville and launched from Boca Chica. They don't have to go far, and getting a route through the ship channel to a loading area near the launch site shouldn't be too difficult. Any other launch site they might travel to is also accessible by barge. True, they aren't fast, but for a reusable vehicle that gets a bit of stockpiling, time for first delivery really wouldn't be of the essence. There's just no reason to rush these things.
