Author Topic: New project, Objective Europa: crowd-researched human exploration of Europa (Read 15053 times)

Robotbeat · « **on:** 09/18/2013 08:51 pm »

http://www.objective-europa.com/
"Crowd-researched crewed mission to ice moon Europa"

Quote

Objective Europa aims to send human beings to Jupiter’s icy moon, Europa, on a one way mission in search of extraterrestrial life while expanding the borders of exploration and knowledge for all mankind.
The starting point of Objective Europa is purely theoretical (Phase I) but will move into more advanced phases including prototyping, technology try-outs, and eventually a crewed launch.
Objective Europa is a crowd-researched project made up of an international team of volunteers. Many people from a wide range of backgrounds have already joined and become a vital part of the mission. We encourage you to join us and help in any area you are interested in. You do not have to be a rocket scientist or astrobiologist; site maintenance, social media control, conference arrangement, lobbying (and much more) are equally important tasks.
The destination for this crewed mission is Jupiter’s sixth closest moon, Europa. Its deep ocean and active geology provide a solid platform for extraterrestrial life, making Europa one of the most enticing locations to explore in the solar system. The 600 day flight required to reach Europa is manageable with today’s technology, and the many challenges of such a mission pose a perfect starting point for new research and innovative thinking.
If you find ice and water more appealing than Martian deserts, we invite you to join our project and help us take the first steps towards exploring Europa.

Robotbeat · « **Reply #1 on:** 09/18/2013 08:56 pm »

The teaser seems to imply it's a one-way mission.

Looks like someone REALLY liked Europa Report.

Lurker Steve · « **Reply #2 on:** 09/18/2013 09:40 pm »

Quote from: Robotbeat on 09/18/2013 08:56 pm

The teaser seems to imply it's a one-way mission.

Looks like someone REALLY liked Europa Report.

Or they are looking for little black Obelisks...

Robert Thompson · « **Reply #3 on:** 09/19/2013 03:07 am »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonization_of_Europa
"high level of radiation from Jupiter's radiation belt, which is about 10 times as strong as Earth's Van Allen radiation belts. As Europa receives 540 rem of radiation per day (500 rem is a fatal dose),[2] a human would not survive at or near the surface of Europa for long without significant radiation shielding."

Edit: This might be PsyOps from Mars-One.

Robotbeat · « **Reply #4 on:** 09/19/2013 03:22 am »

Quote from: Hernalt on 09/19/2013 03:07 am

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonization_of_Europa
"high level of radiation from Jupiter's radiation belt, which is about 10 times as strong as Earth's Van Allen radiation belts. As Europa receives 540 rem of radiation per day (500 rem is a fatal dose),[2] a human would not survive at or near the surface of Europa for long without significant radiation shielding."

Edit: This might be PsyOps from Mars-One.

Who says they wouldn't be using significant radiation shielding? Obviously they would have to.

dcporter · « **Reply #5 on:** 09/19/2013 03:29 am »

Quote from: Robotbeat on 09/19/2013 03:22 am

Quote from: Hernalt on 09/19/2013 03:07 am
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonization_of_Europa
"high level of radiation from Jupiter's radiation belt, which is about 10 times as strong as Earth's Van Allen radiation belts. As Europa receives 540 rem of radiation per day (500 rem is a fatal dose),[2] a human would not survive at or near the surface of Europa for long without significant radiation shielding."

Edit: This might be PsyOps from Mars-One.
Who says they wouldn't be using significant radiation shielding? Obviously they would have to.

Water works, right? Know anywhere in the viscinity with loads of liquid water?

Vultur · « **Reply #6 on:** 09/19/2013 03:35 am »

One way mission to EUROPA?

Is this serious? Even if they could somehow get the funding, they'd have to deal with Jupiter's radiation belts. And solar power being much less effective at Jupiter. And...

This seems way less feasible than Mars One (which I think is also unlikely to get sufficient funding).

Robotbeat · « **Reply #7 on:** 09/19/2013 03:37 am »

Quote from: Vultur on 09/19/2013 03:35 am

One way mission to EUROPA?

One-way isn't a sure thing.

Quote

Is this serious? Even if they could somehow get the funding, they'd have to deal with Jupiter's radiation belts. And solar power being much less effective at Jupiter. And...

This seems way less feasible than Mars One (which I think is also unlikely to get sufficient funding).

It's just a group to study what it'd take to do such a mission. No big funding (it's probably volunteer), just a forum for discussing what it'd take. Definitely nothing to get excited about, but still fun to talk about...

go4mars · « **Reply #8 on:** 09/19/2013 07:23 am »

Nifty video. I wonder who made it and how many people are behind this.

R7 · « **Reply #9 on:** 09/19/2013 08:46 am »

Quote from: Robotbeat on 09/19/2013 03:37 am

Quote from: Vultur on 09/19/2013 03:35 am
One way mission to EUROPA?
One-way isn't a sure thing.

The video implies and text explicitly states:

Quote

The ideas behind Objective Europa is sending human beings to Jupiter’s icy moon, Europa, on a one way mission expanding the borders of exploration and knowledge for all mankind – while continuing the search of extraterrestrial life.

But what's with all these "Let's send people to into outer space to die" ploys? Are space-geeks depressed?

Interesting name in the team though:

Pierre-Yves Cousteau
Ambassador, scientist and diver

Jacques Cousteau's youngest son I presume?

edit: and Kristian von Bengtson, Copenhagen Suborbitals. HEAT-1600 gonna need a bit of upgrade.

KelvinZero · « **Reply #10 on:** 09/19/2013 09:38 am »

The one way element does make it a bit odd. I would expand it to two way just so it makes more sense to people. (or change it to a hypothetical colonization transport) It is not like they are asking for the 100s of billions probably needed for the actual mission. I see it like those Interstellar vehicle studies. Just to see what is involved is interesting, and thinking about where we want to be a century or more from now can create enthusiasm for smaller but relevant projects it turns out we could start right now.

I reckon you want to land something that can melt into the ice to explore it, and adding ISRU to the lander to return probably is not such a huge extension of that. And you want this done before the crew arrive for the additional reason of having a long term survivable environment assuming they figure out how to survive that far.

How about some sort of tiny moon/cycler on a highly eliptical orbit that you can ride from a safe distance to skim past Europa. You could start setting this up robotically long before sending humans, or maybe you could build a base with many meters of water shielding out near callisto and use some sort of slingshotting around moons to adjust its orbit to skim Europa later.

That just leaves the problem of surviving the radiation from the cycler to the surface.

(I have been a long term fan of melting into the ice to build a survivable environment. I would definitely master Ceres, the poles of Mars, and even Callisto first)

QuantumG · « **Reply #11 on:** 09/19/2013 11:32 am »

Quote from: R7 on 09/19/2013 08:46 am

But what's with all these "Let's send people to into outer space to die" ploys? Are space-geeks depressed?

Everybody dies. What matters is how you live.

Robert Thompson · « **Reply #12 on:** 09/19/2013 10:58 pm »

Mars-One is forcing *some conversation and *some public awareness and *some technology development. This could do that as well. It'd be a stretch to say 100-Year-Starship is forcing anything. Something in the middle, something that constrains itself to, say, our solar system, can at least generate public awareness of technical requirements. Anyone have a figure with today's TRL to get a human astronaut to live for 24 hours under Europa's ice? I'd figure it starts at half a trillion.

*non-vanishing

KelvinZero · « **Reply #13 on:** 09/20/2013 02:44 am »

Quote from: Hernalt on 09/19/2013 10:58 pm

Anyone have a figure with today's TRL to get a human astronaut to live for 24 hours under Europa's ice? I'd figure it starts at half a trillion.

No clue. Lets start the discussion with how on earth you would do it. Thats all this is to me.

If we can get to the point of melting a significant hole in the ice I think you could assume water for ISRU at least. If we can get someone into the hole and not already doomed from the radiation they received on the way, extending 24 hours to months should be comparatively trivial, surely?

Robotbeat · « **Reply #14 on:** 09/20/2013 03:08 am »

The trip is just 600 days, we've done 438 at once, most of the way, and we've made improvements in treatments. We've sent probes to Jupiter before, a big burn near Jupiter means you can insert into Jupiter orbit fairly efficiently, with another burn to insert into Europa orbit. I bet we could get someone on the surface of Europa (and stay alive for weeks) for significantly less than half a trillion dollars. Heck, I bet you could get them back alive and well for less than half a trillion dollars.

The big question is how the heck you make a stable hole through a thick crust.

R7 · « **Reply #15 on:** 09/20/2013 08:35 am »

Quote from: Robotbeat on 09/20/2013 03:08 am

The trip is just 600 days

...

we could get someone on the surface of Europa (and stay alive for weeks)

Yeah, and then what? Is the plan to send old people who promptly croak after that? Terminally ill? Or will a perfectly healthy crew wave goodbyes and bite the cyanide pills?

IMO this goes way beyond technical discussion to profound question; is it ok to send people to certain premature deaths in the name of science? Mars One at least plans to support and grow the colony indefinitely so that people can live out their natural life. Even if you got volunteers to Europa then there's the question how it will reverberate through rest of the society. Personally I think a manned science mission planned to end with group suicide is big pile of horse manure. Modern civil society doesn't need science from anywhere that desperate.

Robotbeat · « **Reply #16 on:** 09/20/2013 08:38 am »

Quote from: R7 on 09/20/2013 08:35 am

Quote from: Robotbeat on 09/20/2013 03:08 am
The trip is just 600 days

...

we could get someone on the surface of Europa (and stay alive for weeks)

Yeah, and then what? Is the plan to send old people who promptly croak after that? Terminally ill? Or will a perfectly healthy crew wave goodbyes and bite the cyanide pills?

IMO this goes way beyond technical discussion to profound question; is it ok to send people to certain premature deaths in the name of science? Mars One at least plans to support and grow the colony indefinitely so that people can live out their natural life. Even if you got volunteers to Europa then there's the question how it will reverberate through rest of the society. Personally I think a manned science mission planned to end with group suicide is big pile of horse manure. Modern civil society doesn't need science from anywhere that desperate.

I agree with you. It will never happen get off the ground if it ends in suicide. Most certainly THIS venture is not going to be anything more than a study that may eventually provide input to long-future human missions.

Warren Platts · « **Reply #17 on:** 09/20/2013 11:50 am »

Callisto has a much more benign radiation environment.

Oli · « **Reply #18 on:** 09/20/2013 12:28 pm »

Quote from: QuantumG

Quote from: R7 on 09/19/2013 08:46 AM

But what's with all these "Let's send people to into outer space to die" ploys? Are space-geeks depressed?

Everybody dies. What matters is how you live.

You say spending the last years of your life in a tin can is "living"?

KelvinZero · « **Reply #19 on:** 09/20/2013 01:42 pm »

Quote from: Warren Platts on 09/20/2013 11:50 am

Callisto has a much more benign radiation environment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moons_of_Jupiter
And a bunch of smaller moons, easier to visit for ISRU in preparation for Europa. There are lots of lower hanging fruit. Europa is interesting, but I think we would need to spot alien artifacts before we accepted a "Europa Direct"