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#140
by
input~2
on 28 Nov, 2017 11:58
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#141
by
ZachS09
on 28 Nov, 2017 12:01
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Well, there's always next time to try again.
That's if Roskosmos is confident enough to use Fregat once the investigation is over.
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#142
by
smoliarm
on 28 Nov, 2017 12:01
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Too many problems with those Fregat and Briz upper stages in the past! 
Only one Fregat failed until now.
May 21, 2009...Meridian No. 12L...Soyuz-2.1a/Fregat PLE LC-43/4...Molniya[HEO]...Wrong orbit
Dec 23, 2011...Meridian 5...Soyuz-2.1b/Fregat-M PLE LC-43/4...Molniya[FTO]...Fail to orbit
Aug 22, 2014...Galileo 5 & 6 (Doresa & Milena)...Soyuz-STB/Fregat-MT...Ko ELS...MEO-Gal[HEO]...Wrong orbit
May 21 2009 = human error, discrepancy in flight program data for Soyuz and Fregat
Dec 23 2011 = third stage aborted due to pressurization failure
Aug 22, 2014 = Fregat control system failure
>>Aug 22, 2014 = Fregat control system failure
- no, I recall there was quite different official assessment.
Therefore I'm not sure your first two explanations are correct.
Anyway my point was - we do NOT know for sure the root causes for those two failures.
And as we don't know - we can't exclude Fregat from *the list*
Also - there was Fobos-Grunt stuck in LEO. And its escape stage was *modified* Fregat.
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#143
by
Liss
on 28 Nov, 2017 12:16
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May 21 2009 = human error, discrepancy in flight program data for Soyuz and Fregat
Dec 23 2011 = third stage aborted due to pressurization failure
Aug 22, 2014 = Fregat control system failure
>>Aug 22, 2014 = Fregat control system failure
- no, I recall there was quite different official assessment.
Therefore I'm not sure your first two explanations are correct.
Anyway my point was - we do NOT know for sure the root causes for those two failures.
And as we don't know - we can't exclude Fregat from *the list*
Also - there was Fobos-Grunt stuck in LEO. And its escape stage was *modified* Fregat.
Well, you are correct in the case of 2014 (this was a failure not in control system but in fuel system for attitude control thrusters). And I stand with my statement on two other failures.
As of Fobos Grunt, it was first of all a project management failure leading to launch of a defective spacecraft.
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#144
by
Stevenzop
on 28 Nov, 2017 12:59
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Interfax: A human error could have led to a wrong orientation of the Fregat upper stage during its 1st engine firing, sending the whole stack into the Atlantic:
https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/935465312178331648
Is it possible to determine roughly where this could have re-entered?
I only ask because I've been puzzling all morning over a bright flash I saw in the sky at about 07:30-8am ish here in the North East of Scotland. I had assumed it was a meteor, but then I read this. Could the Fregat burn have been so far off as to cause a re-entry over the UK? I'm guessing not, but the timings look eerily close!
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#145
by
input~2
on 28 Nov, 2017 13:36
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Interfax: A human error could have led to a wrong orientation of the Fregat upper stage during its 1st engine firing, sending the whole stack into the Atlantic:
https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/935465312178331648
Is it possible to determine roughly where this could have re-entered?
I only ask because I've been puzzling all morning over a bright flash I saw in the sky at about 07:30-8am ish here in the North East of Scotland. I had assumed it was a meteor, but then I read this. Could the Fregat burn have been so far off as to cause a re-entry over the UK? I'm guessing not, but the timings look eerily close!
Well, not impossible when looking at the flight path
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#146
by
Liss
on 28 Nov, 2017 13:50
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Sven Grahn: Nothing has been found in orbit according to Space Command. Message with that content sent from JSpOC/SSA to the Cubesat owners waiting for TLEs.
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#147
by
Chris Bergin
on 28 Nov, 2017 13:54
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#148
by
woods170
on 28 Nov, 2017 14:04
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Too many problems with those Fregat and Briz upper stages in the past!
Only one Fregat failed until now.
Thanks for the correction - I thought there was more than one.
Previously Fregat had experienced:
- Two (2) full failures (both in 2011) One of those was the one-off Fregat-SB propulsion module for Phobos-Grunt.
- Two (2) partial failures (2009 and 2014)
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#149
by
Liss
on 28 Nov, 2017 14:09
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Previously Fregat had experienced:
- Two (2) full failures (both in 2011) One of those was the one-off Fregat-SB propulsion module for Phobos-Grunt.
- Two (2) partial failures (2009 and 2014)
You are wrong. Only the 22 Aug 2014 mission failure was attributed to Fregat failure.
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#150
by
Machdiamond
on 28 Nov, 2017 14:12
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#151
by
Jester
on 28 Nov, 2017 14:55
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Interfax: A human error could have led to a wrong orientation of the Fregat upper stage during its 1st engine firing, sending the whole stack into the Atlantic:
https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/935465312178331648
Is it possible to determine roughly where this could have re-entered?
I only ask because I've been puzzling all morning over a bright flash I saw in the sky at about 07:30-8am ish here in the North East of Scotland. I had assumed it was a meteor, but then I read this. Could the Fregat burn have been so far off as to cause a re-entry over the UK? I'm guessing not, but the timings look eerily close!
Well, not impossible when looking at the flight path
Thanks, you have a source of the flight path/trajectory ?
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#152
by
russianhalo117
on 28 Nov, 2017 15:03
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#153
by
Danderman
on 28 Nov, 2017 15:05
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My vague recollection is that Fregat does not have a uplink command link. And, I can’t think of a reason to provide new commands to an upper stage during nominal flight.
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#154
by
russianhalo117
on 28 Nov, 2017 15:11
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My vague recollection is that Fregat does not have a uplink command link. And, I can’t think of a reason to provide new commands to an upper stage during nominal flight.
Fregat cannot talk to Luch in its current iteration and Russian based launches do not employ ESA/Arianespace ground stations for tracking
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#155
by
DatUser14
on 28 Nov, 2017 15:18
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Interfax: A human error could have led to a wrong orientation of the Fregat upper stage during its 1st engine firing, sending the whole stack into the Atlantic:
https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/935465312178331648
Is it possible to determine roughly where this could have re-entered?
I only ask because I've been puzzling all morning over a bright flash I saw in the sky at about 07:30-8am ish here in the North East of Scotland. I had assumed it was a meteor, but then I read this. Could the Fregat burn have been so far off as to cause a re-entry over the UK? I'm guessing not, but the timings look eerily close!
Well, not impossible when looking at the flight path
Thanks, you have a source of the flight path/trajectory ?
this, from this article:
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/meteor-m2-1.html
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#156
by
Jester
on 28 Nov, 2017 15:24
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Interfax: A human error could have led to a wrong orientation of the Fregat upper stage during its 1st engine firing, sending the whole stack into the Atlantic:
https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/935465312178331648
Is it possible to determine roughly where this could have re-entered?
I only ask because I've been puzzling all morning over a bright flash I saw in the sky at about 07:30-8am ish here in the North East of Scotland. I had assumed it was a meteor, but then I read this. Could the Fregat burn have been so far off as to cause a re-entry over the UK? I'm guessing not, but the timings look eerily close!
Well, not impossible when looking at the flight path
Thanks, you have a source of the flight path/trajectory ?
this, from this article: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/meteor-m2-1.html
No, its not, Input has a different source
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#157
by
input~2
on 28 Nov, 2017 15:25
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Interfax: A human error could have led to a wrong orientation of the Fregat upper stage during its 1st engine firing, sending the whole stack into the Atlantic:
https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/935465312178331648
Is it possible to determine roughly where this could have re-entered?
I only ask because I've been puzzling all morning over a bright flash I saw in the sky at about 07:30-8am ish here in the North East of Scotland. I had assumed it was a meteor, but then I read this. Could the Fregat burn have been so far off as to cause a re-entry over the UK? I'm guessing not, but the timings look eerily close!
Well, not impossible when looking at the flight path
Thanks, you have a source of the flight path/trajectory ?
I put together the flight path of Soyuz-2-1-b from the NOTAMs I reproduced earlier in this thread (
2nd stage and
3rd stage)
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#158
by
Jester
on 28 Nov, 2017 15:36
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Interfax: A human error could have led to a wrong orientation of the Fregat upper stage during its 1st engine firing, sending the whole stack into the Atlantic:
https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/935465312178331648
Is it possible to determine roughly where this could have re-entered?
I only ask because I've been puzzling all morning over a bright flash I saw in the sky at about 07:30-8am ish here in the North East of Scotland. I had assumed it was a meteor, but then I read this. Could the Fregat burn have been so far off as to cause a re-entry over the UK? I'm guessing not, but the timings look eerily close!
Well, not impossible when looking at the flight path
Thanks, you have a source of the flight path/trajectory ?
I put together the flight path of Soyuz-2-1-b from the NOTAMs I reproduced earlier in this thread (2nd stage and 3rd stage)
Thanks
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#159
by
B777 pilot
on 28 Nov, 2017 16:24
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Amazing sighting this morning!! I'm an airline pilot, and was flying over the North Atlantic this morning at N50W035 when this bright fireball came out of the direction from Iceland. It passed right overhead us at around N50W035, around 06.00UTC. Unfortunately my iPad didn't take a proper picture, but see the attachments. There were many many pilots who saw it, as we all started talking about it on the air-to-air frequency. An amazing sight. It broke up into thousands of burning pieces.
There's one pilot who took a video, and said he will upload it to YouTube in the next hours. I'm searching...
