SpaceX Falcon 9 v1.1 - Thaicom 6 - DISCUSSION THREAD

[johnmoe]

How about a date from an actual newspaper?
http://www.wacotrib.com/blogs/joe_science/spacex-satellite-launch-set-for-dec/article_b31d65b4-6822-11e3-9f40-001a4bcf887a.html

[edfishel]

Strongly encourage you to invest in L2 on this web site to get those answers.

[uko]

How about a date from an actual newspaper?
http://www.wacotrib.com/blogs/joe_science/spacex-satellite-launch-set-for-dec/article_b31d65b4-6822-11e3-9f40-001a4bcf887a.html

Wow! That is an actual public update.. you should revive the hibernating update thread with that

[Lar]

Have a wild idea. If the ISS cooling issues requires a contingency flight to bring up EMUs, parts, etc. Can SpaceX refurbished a used Dragon and use the Thiacom 6 LV & the CRS-3 Dragon trunk for such a flight?

What is wrong with the existing CRS-3 Dragon?

Nothing, aside from the electrical mods (waterproofing & freezer requirements) + resultant testing, may need to be hastened. But then NASA, may have already asked them, after this problem occured. As this Dragon is slated to have a EMU fixture in it anyways.  I do not think, there will be another pump unit, ready for launch in the trunk section in time though. As it sounds like, it is the same type of unit changeout, as earlier this year. So they may need more spares soon.

It would be a real PITA, to get any failed pump units goundside. Depess Dragon, open side or main hatch (demating req for main) put pump unit into Dragon. This would preferably in a sealed bag, could a crew transfer bag be large enough? Close & secure hatch, re-mate if needed & repress Dragon. There will be more to it, of course, but this is the only way I can think of, without hauling it through the station itself. Might be better, to send up another Dragon later, for failed ORUs, if it comes down to it.

But probably, we will soon be having Pad Thai for Launch, unless NASA needs things sooner.

As I understand it there are 3 spares for the unit about to be replaced already on-orbit. No need to disrupt this launch for that.  Replacement spares could go up on CRS-4 or later, with an extended trunk. Not sure how to bring the old unit back without using your depressurised Dragon/bagging approach...  but that's a discussion for a different thread.

How about a date from an actual newspaper?
http://www.wacotrib.com/blogs/joe_science/spacex-satellite-launch-set-for-dec/article_b31d65b4-6822-11e3-9f40-001a4bcf887a.html

Wow! That is an actual public update.. you should revive the hibernating update thread with that

"Joe Science" (Joseph Abbott) seems to have good sources and often reports neat McGregor stuff first. Glad to hear that apparently the range approved the SpaceX request.

[ChrisWilson68]

Have a wild idea. If the ISS cooling issues requires a contingency flight to bring up EMUs, parts, etc. Can SpaceX refurbished a used Dragon and use the Thiacom 6 LV & the CRS-3 Dragon trunk for such a flight?

What is wrong with the existing CRS-3 Dragon?

Nothing, aside from the electrical mods (waterproofing & freezer requirements) + resultant testing, may need to be hastened. But then NASA, may have already asked them, after this problem occured. As this Dragon is slated to have a EMU fixture in it anyways.  I do not think, there will be another pump unit, ready for launch in the trunk section in time though. As it sounds like, it is the same type of unit changeout, as earlier this year. So they may need more spares soon.

It would be a real PITA, to get any failed pump units goundside. Depess Dragon, open side or main hatch (demating req for main) put pump unit into Dragon. This would preferably in a sealed bag, could a crew transfer bag be large enough? Close & secure hatch, re-mate if needed & repress Dragon. There will be more to it, of course, but this is the only way I can think of, without hauling it through the station itself. Might be better, to send up another Dragon later, for failed ORUs, if it comes down to it.

What would be the advantage of going to all that trouble as opposed to just bringing the unit into the ISS through the usual airlock and then to Dragon through the ISS?  That is, if it's even worth that much trouble to bring the failed unit back down to Earth.

[Jason1701]

Have a wild idea. If the ISS cooling issues requires a contingency flight to bring up EMUs, parts, etc. Can SpaceX refurbished a used Dragon and use the Thiacom 6 LV & the CRS-3 Dragon trunk for such a flight?

What is wrong with the existing CRS-3 Dragon?

Nothing, aside from the electrical mods (waterproofing & freezer requirements) + resultant testing, may need to be hastened. But then NASA, may have already asked them, after this problem occured. As this Dragon is slated to have a EMU fixture in it anyways.  I do not think, there will be another pump unit, ready for launch in the trunk section in time though. As it sounds like, it is the same type of unit changeout, as earlier this year. So they may need more spares soon.

It would be a real PITA, to get any failed pump units goundside. Depess Dragon, open side or main hatch (demating req for main) put pump unit into Dragon. This would preferably in a sealed bag, could a crew transfer bag be large enough? Close & secure hatch, re-mate if needed & repress Dragon. There will be more to it, of course, but this is the only way I can think of, without hauling it through the station itself. Might be better, to send up another Dragon later, for failed ORUs, if it comes down to it.

What would be the advantage of going to all that trouble as opposed to just bringing the unit into the ISS through the usual airlock and then to Dragon through the ISS?  That is, if it's even worth that much trouble to bring the failed unit back down to Earth.

Could the used PM have too much ammonia to justify bringing inside? That might preclude its ever returning to Earth.

Edit: sorry, we should probably continue this in another thread.

[Xspace_engineerX]

Anyone know when the hot fire for this launch is going to take place? I assume quite soon.

[Jakusb]

Anyone know when the hot fire for this launch is going to take place? I assume quite soon.

Often such details get posted first on L2 before they make it to the public boards... Maybe this time too.

[butters]

Tangentially related, but if you've read the news, you may have heard that Thailand is currently undergoing some serious political, social, and financial turmoil. The prime minister is embroiled in a nepotism scandal involving her exiled brother, the parliament has been dissolved, protesters are disrupting preparations for new elections, their financial system has suffered the biggest outflow of foreign investment in at least 14 years, and their currency has collapsed over 5% over the past two months with no end in sight. The last time anything like this happened in Thailand, it sparked the Asian financial crisis of 1997.

So I hope that the new year starts off with a much more positive news cycle for Thailand. They really need this, not merely to deflect attention from their acute short-term issues, but to emphasize their prospects over the long-term as vibrant democracy investing in their economic future. Few events speak  to the ambitions of a developing nation more elegantly than a satellite launch.

[Robotbeat]

Well-said, Butters!

[macpacheco]

Anyone know when the hot fire for this launch is going to take place? I assume quite soon.

Hot fire should be underway based on scheduling information given. But there's zero information about it.
Is there anybody in the Cape that could tells us about the rocket being in the pad at any time today, or any other visible preparations that would confirm the static fire workflow is underway ?

[marshal]

SPACEX FALCON 9 LAUNCH SET FOR JAN. 3

By Space Coast Daily  //  December 27, 2013

BREVARD COUNTY • KENNEDY SPACE CENTER, FLORIDA – A Falcon 9 rocket will light up the skies of the Space Coast during a SpaceX liftoff scheduled for Friday, Jan. 3.

The rocket is set to blast off from Launch Complex 40 at Cape Canaveral Air Force Station at 5:50 p.m. EST, carrying a Thaicom 6 telecommunications satellite.

http://spacecoastdaily.com/2013/12/spacex-falcon-9-launch-set-for-jan-3/

[macpacheco]

SPACEX FALCON 9 LAUNCH SET FOR JAN. 3

By Space Coast Daily  //  December 27, 2013

BREVARD COUNTY • KENNEDY SPACE CENTER, FLORIDA – A Falcon 9 rocket will light up the skies of the Space Coast during a SpaceX liftoff scheduled for Friday, Jan. 3.

The rocket is set to blast off from Launch Complex 40 at Cape Canaveral Air Force Station at 5:50 p.m. EST, carrying a Thaicom 6 telecommunications satellite.

http://spacecoastdaily.com/2013/12/spacex-falcon-9-launch-set-for-jan-3/

Thanks, but I'm asking about a hot fire / static fire / WDR. That was scheduled for today.
In order to do it, they would have to take the rocket out, erect it on the pad, hours prior, so hence my question.

[Kim Keller]

Well the SpaceX engineers in Florida do have to make all of the hardware mods needed/discovered during the Cassiope and SES-8 campaigns. None of the fixes for those mods could have trickled back to Hawthorne and been incorporated into the production vehicles in time for Thiacom.

In fact, how long do we think any/all mods needed for problems discovered at a particular launch will take to work their way into production? I know, it depends. But I'm asking about Falcon 9 v1.1, both stages, and more particularly about Cassiope, SES-8 and Thiacom - 6.

Maybe this post should be in a SpaceX General Section thread?

Other then second stage hardware mods for engine restart, which I imagine would already have been worked into Thiacom 2nd stage, what other "hardware mods" are we talking about? There was some GSE clean-up needed but I"m not aware of additional F9 design issues that would require serious hardware mods?

None.  Sounded like a nominal mission to me but there may have been something in the telemetary that hasn't been revealed.  Conspiracy theorists go for your life   

SpaceX plays its cards close to the chest. It hasn't told you everything about SES-8 (and I'm not either). Suffice to say that Thaicom-6 will fly on a slightly different rocket. And that's ALL I'm sayin".

[Robotbeat]

Well the SpaceX engineers in Florida do have to make all of the hardware mods needed/discovered during the Cassiope and SES-8 campaigns. None of the fixes for those mods could have trickled back to Hawthorne and been incorporated into the production vehicles in time for Thiacom.

In fact, how long do we think any/all mods needed for problems discovered at a particular launch will take to work their way into production? I know, it depends. But I'm asking about Falcon 9 v1.1, both stages, and more particularly about Cassiope, SES-8 and Thiacom - 6.

Maybe this post should be in a SpaceX General Section thread?

Other then second stage hardware mods for engine restart, which I imagine would already have been worked into Thiacom 2nd stage, what other "hardware mods" are we talking about? There was some GSE clean-up needed but I"m not aware of additional F9 design issues that would require serious hardware mods?

None.  Sounded like a nominal mission to me but there may have been something in the telemetary that hasn't been revealed.  Conspiracy theorists go for your life   

SpaceX plays its cards close to the chest. It hasn't told you everything about SES-8 (and I'm not either). Suffice to say that Thaicom-6 will fly on a slightly different rocket. And that's ALL I'm sayin".

Excuse the skepticism, but is this first-hand or second-hand information? I know you're usually pretty solid, but if this is from the NASA contractor grapevine (not direct information), I'm not sure how much credence I would give it (as a real issue). The same grapevine was saying this summer that SpaceX wouldn't launch v1.1 until about December, but they launched in September (I won a bet, there).

_{I'm not actually expecting a response.}

[ChrisWilson68]

Well the SpaceX engineers in Florida do have to make all of the hardware mods needed/discovered during the Cassiope and SES-8 campaigns. None of the fixes for those mods could have trickled back to Hawthorne and been incorporated into the production vehicles in time for Thiacom.

In fact, how long do we think any/all mods needed for problems discovered at a particular launch will take to work their way into production? I know, it depends. But I'm asking about Falcon 9 v1.1, both stages, and more particularly about Cassiope, SES-8 and Thiacom - 6.

Maybe this post should be in a SpaceX General Section thread?

Other then second stage hardware mods for engine restart, which I imagine would already have been worked into Thiacom 2nd stage, what other "hardware mods" are we talking about? There was some GSE clean-up needed but I"m not aware of additional F9 design issues that would require serious hardware mods?

None.  Sounded like a nominal mission to me but there may have been something in the telemetary that hasn't been revealed.  Conspiracy theorists go for your life   ::)

SpaceX plays its cards close to the chest. It hasn't told you everything about SES-8 (and I'm not either). Suffice to say that Thaicom-6 will fly on a slightly different rocket. And that's ALL I'm sayin".

That would hardly be surprising or cause for concern.  I expect little details to be noticed that didn't go exactly as expected, and I would expect SpaceX to make slight tweaks to improve those things on the next flight.

The fact that they're launching Thaicom-6 so soon after SES-8 indicates whatever little tweaks SpaceX made they weren't considered that big a deal.  They didn't send the hardware back to Hawthorne or even McGregor.  They spent a lot longer between CASSIOPE and SES-8, and the only change there was some insulation for a TEA-TEB line.

[cleonard]

They spent a lot longer between CASSIOPE and SES-8, and the only change there was some insulation for a TEA-TEB line.

Are you sure about that?  It may have been the only change that they talked about, but I really doubt that it was the only change.

[ChrisWilson68]

They spent a lot longer between CASSIOPE and SES-8, and the only change there was some insulation for a TEA-TEB line.

Are you sure about that?  It may have been the only change that they talked about, but I really doubt that it was the only change.

Sure, there might have been other minor changes, but I do believe that the insulation was the main change to address the restart failure, and that the restart failure was the major thing they fixed between CASSIOPE and SES-8.

[Lars_J]

They spent a lot longer between CASSIOPE and SES-8, and the only change there was some insulation for a TEA-TEB line.

Are you sure about that?  It may have been the only change that they talked about, but I really doubt that it was the only change.

You have some evidence to back up that "doubt" of yours?

[justineet]

Well the SpaceX engineers in Florida do have to make all of the hardware mods needed/discovered during the Cassiope and SES-8 campaigns. None of the fixes for those mods could have trickled back to Hawthorne and been incorporated into the production vehicles in time for Thiacom.

In fact, how long do we think any/all mods needed for problems discovered at a particular launch will take to work their way into production? I know, it depends. But I'm asking about Falcon 9 v1.1, both stages, and more particularly about Cassiope, SES-8 and Thiacom - 6.

Maybe this post should be in a SpaceX General Section thread?

Other then second stage hardware mods for engine restart, which I imagine would already have been worked into Thiacom 2nd stage, what other "hardware mods" are we talking about? There was some GSE clean-up needed but I"m not aware of additional F9 design issues that would require serious hardware mods?

None.  Sounded like a nominal mission to me but there may have been something in the telemetary that hasn't been revealed.  Conspiracy theorists go for your life   

SpaceX plays its cards close to the chest. It hasn't told you everything about SES-8 (and I'm not either). Suffice to say that Thaicom-6 will fly on a slightly different rocket. And that's ALL I'm sayin".

That would hardly be surprising or cause for concern.  I expect little details to be noticed that didn't go exactly as expected, and I would expect SpaceX to make slight tweaks to improve those things on the next flight.

The fact that they're launching Thaicom-6 so soon after SES-8 indicates whatever little tweaks SpaceX made they weren't considered that big a deal.  They didn't send the hardware back to Hawthorne or even McGregor.  They spent a lot longer between CASSIOPE and SES-8, and the only change there was some insulation for a TEA-TEB line.

I think Kim is referring their work on reuseablity not any issue with SES-8 launch.