Author Topic: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013  (Read 20079 times)

Offline Soheil

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Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Last Edit: 04/23/2013 07:21 pm by Soheil »
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Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #1 on: 04/23/2013 10:31 pm »
Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
Interesting CGI there. Can you provide some links to some more info as we get closer to first launch.

Offline Danderman

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #2 on: 04/24/2013 03:30 am »
This Simorgh seems like a different class launcher than the earlier Safir, which was a R-18 derivative (R-18 is the term used for missiles based on the alleged R-18 Russian design for a Scud upgrade, which was never built in Russia. Allegedly, Makayev sold the design to some 3rd world nation, which then went on to build the R-18 and sell it to other countries. R-18 class missiles have a diameter of 1.25 meters).

Simorgh seems to be a copy of the Unha system, which may be based on the Burya engine (4 Scud engines operating in parallel), with a small second stage based on R-27 verniers). The North Koreans used a smaller third stage, but its not clear if Simorgh has a 3rd stage in the payload fairing.

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #3 on: 04/24/2013 07:34 pm »
This Simorgh seems like a different class launcher than the earlier Safir, which was a R-18 derivative (R-18 is the term used for missiles based on the alleged R-18 Russian design for a Scud upgrade, which was never built in Russia. Allegedly, Makayev sold the design to some 3rd world nation, which then went on to build the R-18 and sell it to other countries. R-18 class missiles have a diameter of 1.25 meters).

Simorgh seems to be a copy of the Unha system, which may be based on the Burya engine (4 Scud engines operating in parallel), with a small second stage based on R-27 verniers). The North Koreans used a smaller third stage, but its not clear if Simorgh has a 3rd stage in the payload fairing.

I was told that Simorgh design is much closer to PRC design than Unha-3 family. There is strong evidence that Iran has/had an agreement with PRC well before UN Sanctions for engine development and technology transfer regarding certain elements of rocket design. It is known that the second stage of Simorgh is a more powerful engine and a more efficient design and thus eliminate the need for a third stage. Also Simorgh's second stage is longer than Unha-3's second stage based on some provided information dating back to 2012. There is also some vague information that for some GTO payloads Simorgh may employ a solid-apogee kick stage. There is also mention that design of Simorgh's first stage allows for future inclusion of up to four jettisonable stage zero boosters along lines of PRC's CZ style liquid strap-on boosters. I am currently working to find more detailed information and description of Simorgh family, but I am running into contradictory information vary from year to year, however the information regarding Simorgh stage one is fairly consistent now over last two years and information on other stages is not quite so consistent.

Offline Danderman

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #4 on: 04/24/2013 10:21 pm »

I was told that Simorgh design is much closer to PRC design than Unha-3 family.

You may be correct, but you should note that the CZ-1 launch vehicle which put the first Chinese satellite in orbit also used a Burya-derivative engine in its first stage.


« Last Edit: 04/24/2013 10:22 pm by Danderman »

Offline Soheil

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #5 on: 04/25/2013 09:28 am »
Iran is very innovative in improving the performance of the engines. The engines of the Safir-1B were already qualified for the new fuel combination UDMH/N2O4. On the qualification of the engines for the second stage of the Simorgh was also worked.
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Offline Galactic Penguin SST

Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #6 on: 04/25/2013 10:26 am »
Are those 3D models your own work or release from official sources?
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Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #7 on: 04/25/2013 02:15 pm »
Are those 3D models your own work or release from official sources?
Well Hessam appears to be an government engineering design corporation. It is also Sanctioned by EU and USA, but not UN.
« Last Edit: 04/25/2013 02:20 pm by russianhalo117 »

Offline Danderman

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #8 on: 04/25/2013 03:26 pm »
Iran is very innovative in improving the performance of the engines. The engines of the Safir-1B were already qualified for the new fuel combination UDMH/N2O4. On the qualification of the engines for the second stage of the Simorgh was also worked.

I am not sure that R-18 did not use this propellant combination already, as all contemporary Makaev designs did.
« Last Edit: 04/25/2013 03:26 pm by Danderman »

Offline Soheil

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #9 on: 04/25/2013 03:35 pm »
Are those 3D models your own work or release from official sources?
Well Hessam appears to be an government engineering design corporation. It is also Sanctioned by EU and USA, but not UN.

what !?  :o

He is a 3D artist  :D
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Offline Soheil

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #10 on: 04/25/2013 03:43 pm »
Are those 3D models your own work or release from official sources?

My own work ... from official informations
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Offline Soheil

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #11 on: 04/25/2013 04:10 pm »
Iran is very innovative in improving the performance of the engines. The engines of the Safir-1B were already qualified for the new fuel combination UDMH/N2O4. On the qualification of the engines for the second stage of the Simorgh was also worked.

I am not sure that R-18 did not use this propellant combination already, as all contemporary Makaev designs did.


Unha-3 debris analysis:

After examining the 3.2-ton wreckage a team of 42 South Korean military, rocket and missile experts has concluded that the wreckage is an oxidizer container,
which stored RFNA (red fuming nitric acid) ,to fuel the rocket's first-stage propellant.
« Last Edit: 04/25/2013 04:12 pm by Soheil »
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Offline Hooligan

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #12 on: 04/29/2013 06:47 am »
Iran is very innovative in improving the performance of the engines. The engines of the Safir-1B were already qualified for the new fuel combination UDMH/N2O4. On the qualification of the engines for the second stage of the Simorgh was also worked.

Do you have any evidence or specifics to support this claim.  The conversion is not simple, nor would the enhancements be optimized.  This seems to be more myth than fact, but I will keep an open mind of some facts are presented.

Offline Soheil

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #13 on: 05/01/2013 07:04 pm »
Iran is very innovative in improving the performance of the engines. The engines of the Safir-1B were already qualified for the new fuel combination UDMH/N2O4. On the qualification of the engines for the second stage of the Simorgh was also worked.

Do you have any evidence or specifics to support this claim.  The conversion is not simple, nor would the enhancements be optimized.  This seems to be more myth than fact, but I will keep an open mind of some facts are presented.

myth !?
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Offline Comet

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #14 on: 05/03/2013 12:37 pm »


My own work ... from official informations

Those are nice renderings, but the statment above is - to me - a bit of exaggeration. WHAT are the "official information" other than some pictures published on Iran space technologies day in 2010?

There is NOTHING in the 3d art that is NEW or UNKNOWN from previous pictures. For example - where is the steering system for the first stage? The location of the fuel and oxidizer tanks?

Offline Soheil

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #15 on: 05/03/2013 01:37 pm »


My own work ... from official informations

Those are nice renderings, but the statment above is - to me - a bit of exaggeration. WHAT are the "official information" other than some pictures published on Iran space technologies day in 2010?

There is NOTHING in the 3d art that is NEW or UNKNOWN from previous pictures. For example - where is the steering system for the first stage? The location of the fuel and oxidizer tanks?

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Offline Catatonia

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #16 on: 05/03/2013 05:52 pm »
Where is the launch site for this ?
They would need something of the same size as the North Korean site ? I didn't know they had that.

Offline Satori

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #17 on: 05/03/2013 06:31 pm »
Not far from the Safir launch pad. On the Iranian Space thread there are a few Google earth images of the Iman Khomeini launch site.

Where is the launch site for this ?
They would need something of the same size as the North Korean site ? I didn't know they had that.

Offline Soheil

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #18 on: 05/04/2013 03:00 pm »
Where is the launch site for this ?
They would need something of the same size as the North Korean site ? I didn't know they had that.

https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=35.236802,53.950462&spn=0.001183,0.002642&t=h&z=19

far more better than north korean ...
« Last Edit: 05/04/2013 03:06 pm by Soheil »
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Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Simorgh SLV > Preview > First launch > Summer-2013
« Reply #19 on: 05/04/2013 09:26 pm »
Where is the launch site for this ?
They would need something of the same size as the North Korean site ? I didn't know they had that.

https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=35.236802,53.950462&spn=0.001183,0.002642&t=h&z=19

far more better than north korean ...
It looks like there will be a second launcher pad in the future.

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