Author Topic: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2  (Read 379601 times)

Offline Gordon Widera

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #20 on: 04/08/2013 02:44 am »
Valley Morning Star

SpaceX presentation set for Tuesday

http://www.valleymorningstar.com/news/local_news/article_f3c322fe-9ff3-11e2-8e9f-0019bb30f31a.html

I have no knowledge about this organization but I'm curious why have this meeting at all? Is it a curtesy to Mexico or is there some other reason?

Offline mlindner

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #21 on: 04/08/2013 02:48 am »
Valley Morning Star

SpaceX presentation set for Tuesday

http://www.valleymorningstar.com/news/local_news/article_f3c322fe-9ff3-11e2-8e9f-0019bb30f31a.html

I have no knowledge about this organization but I'm curious why have this meeting at all? Is it a curtesy to Mexico or is there some other reason?

It appears to be a 3rd party action, with no help from SpaceX. So no courtesy to Mexico at all.
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Offline Gordon Widera

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #22 on: 04/09/2013 01:08 am »
News article from what I believe is a Channel 4 News posted on valleycentral.com with short video about Cameron County setting up a space port development corporation.

Cameron County facilitates path for Space X

http://www.valleycentral.com/news/story.aspx?id=882432

Offline Gordon Widera

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #23 on: 04/10/2013 01:08 am »
News article:

SpaceX bill clears unanimously by a vote of 9-0

http://www.kveo.com/news/spacex-bill-clears-unanimously-vote-9-0

Offline RocketmanUS

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #24 on: 04/10/2013 01:22 am »
News article:

SpaceX bill clears unanimously by a vote of 9-0

http://www.kveo.com/news/spacex-bill-clears-unanimously-vote-9-0
According to that report the beaches could still be closed on Saturday and Sundays unless preceding certain holidays.

Looks like they would still be allowed to launch on weekends. If that is true, then that bill went to far.

Offline beancounter

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #25 on: 04/10/2013 01:31 am »
News article:

SpaceX bill clears unanimously by a vote of 9-0

http://www.kveo.com/news/spacex-bill-clears-unanimously-vote-9-0
According to that report the beaches could still be closed on Saturday and Sundays unless preceding certain holidays.

Looks like they would still be allowed to launch on weekends. If that is true, then that bill went to far.

How many weekends would you expect the beach to close?  One a month?  Every other week?  How often is too often?
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Offline RocketmanUS

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #26 on: 04/10/2013 01:37 am »
News article:

SpaceX bill clears unanimously by a vote of 9-0

http://www.kveo.com/news/spacex-bill-clears-unanimously-vote-9-0
According to that report the beaches could still be closed on Saturday and Sundays unless preceding certain holidays.

Looks like they would still be allowed to launch on weekends. If that is true, then that bill went to far.

How many weekends would you expect the beach to close?  One a month?  Every other week?  How often is too often?
If they can't launch mid week ( Tuesday thru Thursday ) instead of the weekend ( consider the workers too ), then what is so important that has to be launched on the weekend?

They need better planning. A launch does not get planned on a week before but months in advance.

And they just had their launch schedule slip again for F9 1.1 1st flight!

Offline mlindner

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #27 on: 04/10/2013 02:16 am »
News article:

SpaceX bill clears unanimously by a vote of 9-0

http://www.kveo.com/news/spacex-bill-clears-unanimously-vote-9-0

This apparently only cleared the committee though right? It still needs to be voted on in the full House, then the full Senate, then signed by the governor. This could take a while.
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Offline kevin-rf

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #28 on: 04/10/2013 02:28 am »
If they can't launch mid week ( Tuesday thru Thursday ) instead of the weekend ( consider the workers too ), then what is so important that has to be launched on the weekend?


Planetary windows and phasing with ISS. Wait Texas should only be GTO.
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Offline Linze

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #29 on: 04/10/2013 02:29 am »
If they can't launch mid week ( Tuesday thru Thursday ) instead of the weekend ( consider the workers too ), then what is so important that has to be launched on the weekend?

They need better planning. A launch does not get planned on a week before but months in advance.

And they just had their launch schedule slip again for F9 1.1 1st flight!

Celestial orbits don't take off on the weekends.  One imagines a complete weekend restriction would have been a deal killer for SpaceX, and it's easy to see why.  Launches have to happen when they have to happen.  It has nothing to do with SpaceX's planning or bumped launches.  Orbits often drive the schedule, not the other way around. 

More than almost any other business type, the space launch businesses has a tremendously legitimate need to operate 7 days per week. Removing nearly a third of all possible launch dates from every annual calendar would be untenable and ridiculous.  Just to keep a sparsely attended strip of sand like Boca Chica beach open each and every weekend?

There's a reason this was approved with unanimous consent.

Offline mlindner

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #30 on: 04/10/2013 02:29 am »
News article:

SpaceX bill clears unanimously by a vote of 9-0

http://www.kveo.com/news/spacex-bill-clears-unanimously-vote-9-0
According to that report the beaches could still be closed on Saturday and Sundays unless preceding certain holidays.

Looks like they would still be allowed to launch on weekends. If that is true, then that bill went to far.

I wrote up a brief description below removing legalese for those who don't want to spend the time to read the bill. (You can look up any bill, local or national with a simple google on the bill ID and the state its in.) Saturdays and Sundays during summer for the most part are not allowed. Not just certain saturdays and sundays.

They have to request the launch date 14 days in advance to the commissioners court for any launch, regardless of date.

The commissioners court can't approve it without approval of the General Land Office if the dates are on one of the following: the Saturday or Sunday preceding Memorial Day, Memorial Day, July 4, Labor Day, any Saturday or Sunday between Memorial Day and Labor Day. They also have to request 28 days in advance instead of 14 in this case. The details of how the General Land Office decide are listed in the bill.

Other than that, it appears that non-summer weekends are treated the same as weekdays, and even those special holidays/weekends are allowed if significant enough reason is given to the General Land Office.

Bill here: http://www.legis.state.tx.us/tlodocs/83R/billtext/html/HB02623I.htm

Edit: For the non US readers. Memorial day is the final Monday of May, Labor day is the first Monday of September.
« Last Edit: 04/10/2013 02:43 am by mlindner »
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Offline Robotbeat

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #31 on: 04/10/2013 03:07 am »
If they can't launch mid week ( Tuesday thru Thursday ) instead of the weekend ( consider the workers too ), then what is so important that has to be launched on the weekend?


Planetary windows and phasing with ISS. Wait Texas should only be GTO.
...You could launch planetary missions from Texas, too.
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Offline llanitedave

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #32 on: 04/10/2013 03:54 am »
News article:

SpaceX bill clears unanimously by a vote of 9-0

http://www.kveo.com/news/spacex-bill-clears-unanimously-vote-9-0
According to that report the beaches could still be closed on Saturday and Sundays unless preceding certain holidays.

Looks like they would still be allowed to launch on weekends. If that is true, then that bill went to far.

I wrote up a brief description below removing legalese for those who don't want to spend the time to read the bill. (You can look up any bill, local or national with a simple google on the bill ID and the state its in.) Saturdays and Sundays during summer for the most part are not allowed. Not just certain saturdays and sundays.

They have to request the launch date 14 days in advance to the commissioners court for any launch, regardless of date.

The commissioners court can't approve it without approval of the General Land Office if the dates are on one of the following: the Saturday or Sunday preceding Memorial Day, Memorial Day, July 4, Labor Day, any Saturday or Sunday between Memorial Day and Labor Day. They also have to request 28 days in advance instead of 14 in this case. The details of how the General Land Office decide are listed in the bill.

Other than that, it appears that non-summer weekends are treated the same as weekdays, and even those special holidays/weekends are allowed if significant enough reason is given to the General Land Office.

Bill here: http://www.legis.state.tx.us/tlodocs/83R/billtext/html/HB02623I.htm

Edit: For the non US readers. Memorial day is the final Monday of May, Labor day is the first Monday of September.

That's not too bad a trade-off.  Summer is when the weekends are most sensitive.
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Offline BobCarver

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #33 on: 04/10/2013 06:50 am »
News article:

SpaceX bill clears unanimously by a vote of 9-0

http://www.kveo.com/news/spacex-bill-clears-unanimously-vote-9-0

This apparently only cleared the committee though right? It still needs to be voted on in the full House, then the full Senate, then signed by the governor. This could take a while.

Better not. The lege is only in session every other year for 140 calendar days.... And, there's less than two months to go!
« Last Edit: 04/10/2013 07:10 am by BobCarver »

Offline RocketmanUS

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #34 on: 04/10/2013 06:26 pm »
If they can't launch mid week ( Tuesday thru Thursday ) instead of the weekend ( consider the workers too ), then what is so important that has to be launched on the weekend?


Planetary windows and phasing with ISS. Wait Texas should only be GTO.
...You could launch planetary missions from Texas, too.
I understand launch windows, however they should then choose the best launch location that would also not disrupted local activity that has already been planned on. And they should have more than one launch window. A good reason for air launch. 

Offline rcoppola

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #35 on: 04/10/2013 06:50 pm »
I don't recall reading what kind of activity this beach gets. It doesn't exactly scream the Hamptons to me. Are we talking about hundreds of people, thousands, tens of thousand?



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Offline PreferToLurk

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #36 on: 04/10/2013 07:11 pm »
I don't recall reading what kind of activity this beach gets. It doesn't exactly scream the Hamptons to me. Are we talking about hundreds of people, thousands, tens of thousand?





It doesnt matter.  The argument being made is that one persons liberty outways any corporation's desire to infringe that liberty.  Which is silly.  Reasonable mediation between conflicting desires should occur, and that is exactly what the local land use board will be doing. 

Offline rcoppola

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #37 on: 04/10/2013 07:43 pm »
I don't recall reading what kind of activity this beach gets. It doesn't exactly scream the Hamptons to me. Are we talking about hundreds of people, thousands, tens of thousand?





It doesnt matter.  The argument being made is that one persons liberty outways any corporation's desire to infringe that liberty.  Which is silly.  Reasonable mediation between conflicting desires should occur, and that is exactly what the local land use board will be doing. 
Thanks, but you're over-thinking my question. I'm just curious as to how many people we are taking about.



 
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Offline Kabloona

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #38 on: 04/10/2013 08:26 pm »
I don't recall reading what kind of activity this beach gets. It doesn't exactly scream the Hamptons to me. Are we talking about hundreds of people, thousands, tens of thousand?


It doesnt matter.  The argument being made is that one persons liberty outways any corporation's desire to infringe that liberty.  Which is silly.  Reasonable mediation between conflicting desires should occur, and that is exactly what the local land use board will be doing. 
Thanks, but you're over-thinking my question. I'm just curious as to how many people we are taking about.


It may not be the Hamptons, but it's 1000 acres of beachfront within easy reach of Brownsville, population near 200k. Given the brutal summer heat down there, I can imagine it being a first resort on weekends for many Brownsville residents.

I have seen pictures, and I guarantee you if that beach/park were anywhere in the Northeast coastal area where I live, it would have thousands during summer weekends. And the summer heat in Brownsville is much, much worse.

But this whole debate is a bit overblown IMHO. SpaceX won't want to upset the locals, and even aerospace workers like their weekends off. I don't see how there are going to be many, if any, cases where SpaceX absolutely, positively has to launch on a summer weekend.
« Last Edit: 04/10/2013 08:34 pm by Kabloona »

Offline docmordrid

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 2
« Reply #39 on: 04/10/2013 09:30 pm »
It's not like it's the ONLY beach in the area. Hell, South Padre Island (AKA Spring Break Central) is 5 miles away, and there are other beaches along that coast. You can also drive across the border to Matamoros and hit Bagdad beach.
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