Author Topic: Golden Spike announce Phase A for commercial lunar landing missions (Read 268606 times)

Warren Platts · « **Reply #520 on:** 12/21/2012 08:44 pm »

Quote from: HMXHMX on 12/21/2012 07:52 pm

No need to guess. The team was announced.

Very cool, but do you have a link for that that would have a little more info?

So here is the correct list with links:

1. Space Florida
2. Zero Point Frontiers
3. Armadillo Aerospace
4. Southwest Research Institute
5. Moon Express
6. International Lunar Observatory Association
7. Paragon Space Development Corporation
8. Masten Space Systems
9. United Launch Alliance

HMXHMX · « **Reply #521 on:** 12/21/2012 10:25 pm »

Quote from: Warren Platts on 12/21/2012 08:44 pm

Quote from: HMXHMX on 12/21/2012 07:52 pm
No need to guess. The team was announced.

Very cool, but do you have a link for that that would have a little more info?

So here is the correct list with links:

1. Space Florida
2. Zero Point Frontiers
3. Armadillo Aerospace
4. Southwest Research Institute
5. Moon Express
6. International Lunar Observatory Association
7. Paragon Space Development Corporation
8. Masten Space Systems
9. United Launch Alliance

No link, sorry. I recalled seeing such a list day of their announcement, went into Goggle (images) and searched for it, and found that, which matched my memory. But I didn't save the search.

sdsds · « **Reply #522 on:** 12/21/2012 10:51 pm »

The image is available in a reasonable size from http://www.flickr.com/photos/goldenspikeco/8249387075/

As a huge pdf it is
http://goldenspikecompany.com/wp-content/uploads/GSC%20Partners_Logo.pdf

In nice text it is in
http://goldenspikecompany.com/wp-content/uploads/GSC%20Officers_Advisors_Partners.pdf

where they are called the "LUNAR LANDER SYSTEMS (LLS) TEAM". Perhaps other companies (launch providers other than ULA, for example) might also be called "partners" of GS, but are not part of the LLS team.

My personal guess is that SpaceX declined to give GS permission to publicly disclose information about upper stage developments that SpaceX may have privately disclosed.

JohnFornaro · « **Reply #523 on:** 12/22/2012 12:55 am »

Quote from: sdsds on 12/21/2012 10:51 pm

My personal guess is that SpaceX declined to give GS permission to publicly disclose information about upper stage developments that SpaceX may have privately disclosed.

I'd agree with that.

yg1968 · « **Reply #524 on:** 12/22/2012 01:36 pm »

Dec. 21 (Bloomberg) -- Golden Spike CEO Alan Stern discusses a developing space venture. He speaks with Betty Liu on Bloomberg Television's "Money Moves." (Source: Bloomberg):
http://bloom.bg/XVr7Z2

Chris Bergin · « **Reply #525 on:** 01/03/2013 03:25 pm »

GS do the right thing and get a presser out on dev.....last thing we wanted was silence, so this is good. Bobby Block with the win on that score.

Will write it up, but here's the presser:

THE GOLDEN SPIKE COMPANY ANNOUNCES NORTHROP GRUMMAN UNDER STUDY CONTRACT FOR LUNAR LANDER DESIGN

BOULDER, CO. (January 3, 2013) – The Golden Spike Company announced today that it has entered into a contract with Northrop Grumman Corporation for the design of a new lunar lander that fits within Golden Spike’s “head start” commercial lunar architecture.

Northrop Grumman’s participation brings heritage lunar engineering expertise to Golden Spike. Northrop Grumman is a major aerospace and defense contractor. Its legacy companies -- Grumman and TRW -- designed and built the Lunar Module and Lunar Module Descent Engines for the Apollo moon landing missions that between 1969 and 1972 ferried a crew of two astronauts from lunar orbit to the lunar surface and back again six times.

Golden Spike debuted last month as the first commercial aerospace company planning to offer routine exploration expeditions to the surface of the Moon by the end of the decade. The company aims to use existing rockets and emerging commercial-crew spacecraft to allow nations, individuals and corporations to mount their own lunar expeditions. The lander is the only significant hardware that needs to be designed from the ground up.

"This is a significant step forward in our plans,” said Golden Spike’s Board Chairman, Gerry Griffin. “Northrop Grumman brings Golden Spike a unique body of knowledge and skills as the only company to ever build a successful human-rated lunar lander, the Apollo Lunar Module.”

Dr. S. Alan Stern, Golden Spike’s President and CEO, added: “We’re very proud to be working with Northrop Grumman, which has the most experience and successful performance record for human lunar lander designs in the world.”

Among the tasks Northrop Grumman will perform for Golden Spike are:
Reviewing requirements and synthesizing a set of study ground rules and assumptions emphasizing system reliability, automated/ground command operability, and affordability
Establishing velocity (Δv) budgets from and to low lunar orbit for pragmatic lunar landing sites
Exploring a wide variety of Lunar Lander concept options, including staging, propellants, engines, reusability, autonomy, systems capabilities for exploration, as well as landing site flexibility
Establishing the design trade space and establish pragmatic limits for future more detailed analysis and development
“This study is one of a number of initial studies we’re undertaking to begin creating the design requirements and specs for the lander contract competition we expect to hold to select a Golden Spike lander for flight development,” said Golden Spike’s Lunar Lander Systems Study (LLaSS) engineering chief, James R. French.

Golden Spike predicts its customers will want to explore the Moon for varying reasons—scientific exploration and discovery, national prestige, commercial development, marketing, entertainment, and even personal achievement. Market studies by the company show the possibility of 15-25 or more expeditions in the decade following a first landing.

# # #

About Golden Spike: The Golden Spike Company (GSC) is a US-based commercial space company incorporated in 2010 with the objective of providing human expeditions to the Moon. It is named after the ceremonial final spike that joined the rails of the First Transcontinental Railroad across the United States, on May 10, 1869, and opened up the frontier to new opportunities. Similarly, Golden Spike intends to break new ground and create an enduring link to the next frontier, providing regular and reliable expeditions to the Moon at prices that create a new market for space commercialization and inspire millions.

Ben the Space Brit · « **Reply #526 on:** 01/03/2013 04:08 pm »

Northrop Grumman? As in Apollo LEM Grumman? Well, that might give them a head start on certain elements of this work.

go4mars · « **Reply #527 on:** 01/03/2013 04:09 pm »

Great choice and appropriate study tasks. Nice to see!

JohnFornaro · « **Reply #528 on:** 01/03/2013 05:05 pm »

Totally agree. Excellent news!

Robert Thompson · « **Reply #529 on:** 01/03/2013 05:12 pm »

"pragmatic lunar landing sites"

I'd love to hear if the clients have interest in specific destinations or latitudes, and how it would be reflected in final price (above the projected baseline price). SpaceX repeated what NASA had done many times, and was celebrated by an engaged public for a time. It is consistent to expect that the first commercial landing to successfully repeat a basic Apollo earth-facing low latitude mare is going to be celebrated with such fervor as if it had been a commercial landing to the lunar poles, an achievement the public is not prepared to comprehend. If the client list supports a variety of desired destinations, GS can focus earliest on the 'good enough' low latitude landings which leaves plenty of room for 'better' high latitude / plane change landings. Costs could drop faster if they perfect the lowest hanging fruit. I hope to see subtle, genteel and gradual one-upmanship in landed capabilities. Sneetch stars like Virgin Galactic appears to be successfully selling may come in time.

Chris Bergin · « **Reply #530 on:** 01/03/2013 05:33 pm »

Ok, written it up, and made it a bit meatier with the NASA side of things:
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2013/01/golden-spike-northrop-grumman-lunar-lander/

simonbp · « **Reply #531 on:** 01/03/2013 06:39 pm »

Quote from: Hernalt on 01/03/2013 05:12 pm

"pragmatic lunar landing sites"

http://www.lpi.usra.edu/nlsi/CLSE-landing-site-study/

Shameless plug. IMHO the SPA section is by far the best.

Rocket Science · « **Reply #532 on:** 01/03/2013 09:17 pm »

Great article Chris!

Northop-Grumman, now that was a “no brainer”... Hard to beat perfection!

KelvinZero · « **Reply #533 on:** 01/03/2013 09:33 pm »

So to what degree is Northrop Grumman endorsing Golden Spike, I mean is it "Sure, we would design you a flying dog kennel if you paid us" or "This is a brand we wish to be associated with", or a third motivation?

WmThomas · « **Reply #534 on:** 01/04/2013 12:46 am »

Quote from: Rocket Science on 01/03/2013 09:17 pm

Great article Chris! Northop-Grumman, now that was a “no brainer”... Hard to beat perfection!

Why is Northrup-Grumman a "no-brainer" for a moon landing system?

Is there anyone employed there who worked on the Apollo program? Is there anyone with special expertise that is relevant?

What do they know today that others don't?

spectre9 · « **Reply #535 on:** 01/04/2013 12:49 am »

Great article thanks Chris.

I hope this results in moving towards real hardware. I'm sure we'll get the pretty powerpoint in any case.

RocketmanUS · « **Reply #536 on:** 01/04/2013 01:23 am »

Some were around 28,600lb using hypergolics it could be possible to go LLO to Lunar surface and back to LLO with about 1,000lb of two crew and some cargo. That being a single stage. That same stage could place about 10,000lb of cargo on the Lunar surface from LLO, would need to be refueled on the surface to return to LLO. So a lander around the size of the Apollo descent stage could be used.

With modern materials and manufacturing technics could the Apollo descent stage be made lighter with the same performance? If so could it be made to have no greater mass and to be able to hold 35% more propellant?

Warren Platts · « **Reply #537 on:** 01/04/2013 01:25 am »

Quote from: WmThomas on 01/04/2013 12:46 am

Quote from: Rocket Science on 01/03/2013 09:17 pm
Great article Chris! Northop-Grumman, now that was a “no brainer”... Hard to beat perfection!

Why is Northrup-Grumman a "no-brainer" for a moon landing system?

Is there anyone employed there who worked on the Apollo program? Is there anyone with special expertise that is relevant?

What do they know today that others don't?

How to finish a project? It's easy to start projects; finishing them is hard.

Plus they probably still have the blueprints for the original LEM in a dusty vault somewhere.

simonbp · « **Reply #538 on:** 01/04/2013 02:48 am »

Quote from: Warren Platts on 01/04/2013 01:25 am

Plus they probably still have the blueprints for the original LEM in a dusty vault somewhere.

Which means precisely nothing. Did Boeing dust off Apollo CSM blueprints when they designed CST-100? No, they designed a new vehicle from scratch just using lessons learned from the old design.

Work that NG did for Altair will be much more relevant for this.

Nelson Bridwell · « **Reply #539 on:** 01/04/2013 03:16 am »

Quote from: Chris Bergin on 01/03/2013 03:25 pm

THE GOLDEN SPIKE COMPANY ANNOUNCES NORTHROP GRUMMAN UNDER STUDY CONTRACT FOR LUNAR LANDER DESIGN

This sounds like a very reasonable decision.

Even though Apollo was a half century ago, the involvement of Northrop Grumman should inspire considerably greater customer confidence than the newer, cheaper kids on the block, some of whom are still crashing test rockets, left and right.

The involvement of an experienced aerospace firm also appears more in line with the $9B development cost projection from GS, and with the available budget of potential clients.