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#1680 by roma847 on 16 Jun, 2019 12:04
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Hello everybody,
but this is just one side of the ET/Orbiter Interface.
But the other side on the Shuttle has to fit too.
And therewith it looks pretty poor on the Airfix Kit, 
because the two Orbiter doors are not present, let alone their deepenings in the opened state, just like one needs it for the Stack (ET/Orbiter).
Source: NASA
The least would therefore be a solution in which one could glue a Decal or a paper printout of the two doors in the opened state onto the appropriate place, which would look a bit better, namely something like here.
It would be even still better, of course, if the two deepenings were really brought in, however, and then glue the Umbilical decals into, or simply the printout, and the two doors in between, what I could imagine.
This is what my friend Mike (egt95) did in the ARC forum on his STS-1 stack.
Source: arcforums.com (egt95)
But since this place at the finished stack on the MLP can not be seen anyway, glued decals/printouts without the openings, but with glued doors would actually suffice.
In the meantime I started with the modification of the Airfix-Longerons, which protrude anyway and do not rest on flat. These are these stripes on both sides at the end of the LH2 tank, on which the oblique Thrust Struts and the Vertical Struts are mounted, because these parts do not look like in reality, as one could see already on this well-known photo of the ET-8.
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (Jester)
For me, it seems, that the SOFI patterns has been leveled in this area, with only the front wedge-shaped part is supporting the oblique strut.
And this I have modified by sanding off the Kit-Longerons accordingly, whereby now the front slant ramp must be filled accordingly.
And here I have tried to adapt the TPS cladding from the Newware Kit, for which I had to sand off approx. half of the lower block of the Airfix-Strut, however, whereby the lower part of the Resin-cladding seems too clunky to me, which is why it still has to slim down a bit.
But every beginning is difficult, just do not panic ...
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#1681 by Tony Trout on 18 Jun, 2019 13:55
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WOW!!!! I love your model work!!!! This is something that I would love to have, myself, but, due to my disability I'm not good with working with my hands. I'd love to have a space shuttle model just like this to display in my room. A couple of other models I'd love to have (non-space-related):
Airwolf (1984-1986 television show) helicopter
"BJ & The Bear" 1979-1981 television show about a truck driver and a chimp named "Bear"
(The "Airwolf" model is on the way....however, I would need for someone to build the "BJ & The Bear" truck & trailer).
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#1682 by roma847 on 18 Jun, 2019 16:21
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Thanks Tony for your nice words.
Maybe you can find here in the forum someone who can help you with the construction, unfortunately I'm too far away, sorry.
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#1683 by roma847 on 18 Jun, 2019 16:23
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Hello everybody,
who wants to know more about the ET cabling as well as about the Cable trays and their Thermal protection system (TPS), here one still can find some interesting information.
Source: System Definition Handbook SLWT (Lockheed Martin)
Source: System Definition Handbook SLWT (Lockheed Martin)
As one can see in the first picture, it was distinguished between Internal and External LO2/LH2 Cabling.
But there is another important interface, namely the ET/SRB interface between the ET and the SRBs, about whose cables, sensors, etc. the separation of the burned SRBs has been activated.
And unfortunately, this interface with the associated Cable Tray is also missing in the Airfix Kit and therefore also needs to be scratched.
In this photo of the ET-8 one can see the transition of the Cable Tray from the vertical strut to the SRB Support, where the wiring passes through the Upper Attach Strut.
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (woods170)
This also makes it clear what these strange extensions at the end of the vertical strut mean, which I have noticed time and again.
Source: nasaspaceflight.com (woods170)
These are the cable ends running from the root point of the Upper Attach Strut to the Aft ET/SRB Attach Ring (see previous picture).
And these are those cables that can be seen in this photo, which can be seen at the bottom of the SRB Cable Tray in the previous image,
Source: NASA
and then run into the booster via the Upper Attach Strut.
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#1684 by roma847 on 25 Jun, 2019 22:15
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Hello everybody,
although there is now clarity about the SRB struts, I still have problems with the shape of the Vertical strut of the ET/Orbiter Attachment, because the lower part of the Newware TPS-Facing looked a bit too clunky, why I've dealt with this assembly once again and have analyzed further photos.
For this I have repeatedly compared these two photos of the ET-8 (STS-6) and first tried to reconstruct the contours of the struts and to bring into agreement, which is not so easy, because the images were taken from different positions and thus certain details are partially obscured. 
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (Jester)
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (woods170)
In particular, the two yellow and blue marked areas have puzzled me, whereby the yellow marked wedge-shaped foot looks somehow different than the one on the Newware strut. Whose chunky form is more akin to the struts used in later missions, as seen here in STS-134 (ET-122). 
Source: NASA
Irritating is also the lower contour directly at the yellow arrowhead in the first image, which does not belong to the strut, but to the flattened SOFI pattern area of the Longeron, which is illustrated in this image by the yellow contour.
Furthermore, it can be seen from the blue dimension arrows that the lower foot part is not wedge-shaped as the Newware part.
And with this the vertical strut gets this blue drawn contour with a flowing transition to the SRB Cable Tray, which extends to the Upper Strut. 
This still leaves this question mark at the blue marked recess from the first picture open, which one unfortunately can not see in this last view.
This wedge-shaped part seems in my opinion to be a part of the TPS facing which has been retrofitted, this recess probably having been finished later. In contrast to the SOFI Spray applications, these TPS parts were molded separately and mounted individually, just like the Intertank Closeouts.
And these are now the estimated dimensions for the scratch construction of the Vertical Strut, which show that especially the chunky foot part of the Newware facing does not fit the mould of the ET-8 and therefore has to be modified.
As reference dimension (yellow) was used the diameter of the rear part of the Thrust Strut, which is 16,6" at the original, which roughly corresponds to 3 mm of the Airfix part.
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#1685 by roma847 on 07 Jul, 2019 11:06
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Hello everybody,
what you will have noticed already, but unfortunately I have to slow down a bit, because I have to take care more of my sick wife and our poodle Gino, who suffered two cruciate ligament tears in no time, 
whose second cruciate ligament tear will be operated next week.
But nonetheless, it should go on on the Launch pad.
I'm still dealing with the rear ET/Orbiter Attachments, especially since besides the adaptation of the Newware Kit parts, also some things of the Airfix Kit have to be corrected or modified.
What looks so nice and vivid on the Reference detail photos,
Source: NASA
is in scale 1:144 everything much smaller and therefore does not appear so readily feasible by Scratch-building.
That's why I've put on the orbiter, and as one can easily see, there's a hell of few place to accommodate the LH2/LO2 Umbilicals and associated Cable Trays as well as GH2/GO2 Press. Lines.
And thus immediately to a curiosity of the Airfix kit, after which the GH2 Press. Line directly discharges into the LO2 Feedline (see the small hole just before the bow), which in reality would be a disaster of course.
While the GO2 Press. Line is correctly laid and leads to LO2 Umbilical, the GH2 Press. Line runs below the Crossbeam to the other side to the LH2 Umbilical.
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (DDG40)
Here are two other views with the still too chunky TPS cladding of the Vertical Strut, which I have sanded so that it fits better into the picture.
And now more details come into play, which also want to be accommodated. These are the Diagonal Strut, as well as the LO2 Feedline/Umbilical Support Brackets, of which there is also one on the other side of the bow, but which is missing,
as one can see on this image.
On this drawing one can indeed see the different versions of these LH2/LO2 Feedline/Umbilical Support Brackets very nicely,
Source: System Definition Handbook SLWT (Lockheed Martin)
however, it should be noted that all these parts are provided with a TPS cladding, which must be taken into consideration when scratching them.
Source: NASA
Source: NASA
These two rings here are needless, because they do not exist on the real LO2 Feedline,
as one can see on this image.
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (DDG40)
On it one can see the last two (out of five) LO2 Feedline Supports with the rings in front of them, which are missing at Airfix, excepting the ring in the next picture, but after that nothing like that comes up before the LO2 Umbilical.
And finally to the chunky TPS cladding of the Vertical Strut,
which I slimmed down even further (right), as one can see here.
Now I have still to modify the left strut and its cladding accordingly, so that both sides look identically.
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#1686 by roma847 on 07 Jul, 2019 20:37
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Hi friends,
for a better idea of the true size of these parts I've put my Cent coin on the tank.
And with some patience, I then have placed the coin on the Crossbeam, so you have a good comparison with the size of the Umbilical Plates. 
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#1687 by roma847 on 13 Jul, 2019 10:43
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Hello everybody,
now I will start scratch building of the LH2/LO2 Umbilical plates, which look quite nice on the drawing, but in 1:144 these are only about 7 mm x 5 mm small plates, for which I have used Styrene (1 mm). Normally, 1,5 mm thickness would be more correct, but it should be remembered that the upper part of the Umbilical Plates protrudes into the orbiter openings, whose recess I want to avoid, because this place will not be seen later anyway on the shuttle Stack. That's why I'll use 1 mm thick platelets on which then the orbiter rests flat.
Source: NASA
Since I have to take into account the distance to the Orbiter during testing the small Umbilical plates and tiny Cable trays, I've considered a small stencil (1 mm Styrene, which is much easier to handle.
On this stencil I have drawn the openings for the ET/Orbiter Attachment as well as for the two LH2/LO2 Feedlines from my scaled down drawing (1:144), as well as have cut out small paper stencils of both umbilicals.
After the plate fits quite well already (the red ones are the Cable trays),
now follows the production of the two Umbilical plates, whose drawings I have glued with transparent tape on the 1 mm Styrene plate.
In order to be able to cut out and file the small plates, I first drilled the holes (Ø 3 mm) for the Feedlines and plugged in rod plugs, so that the templates can not slip during handling.
And then I cut out the little plates, whereat I've always compared it with the contours of the two umbilicals in this larger photo, because the parts are really tiny and also difficult to hold, which was much facilitated by the inserted holding rod.
Source: NASA
And then I've carefully cut the contours of the stencils with the diagonal cutter and then gradually filed and ground the final shape all around, which was quite tedious.
I started with the LO2Umbilical plate.
Then the holding stopper could finally be removed,
and this is now the finished part.
And in the same way followed the production of the LH2 Umbilical Plate.
And these are the two finished Umbilical plates,
which can now be test fitted on the Attachment.
And as one can see, the two parts fit quite well with the attachment.
And now a look ahead to the outer LO2Support Bracket, which is missing on the Airfix Feedline which I have drawn red.
Source: System Definition Handbook SLWT (Lockheed Martin)
Little by little, the bird builds its nest ...
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#1688 by roma847 on 13 Jul, 2019 22:06
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Hello friends,
for an even better overview when fitting and assembling the Umbilical plates and Cable trays I have made the same template of Acrylic glass (PPMA), which now allows the total vista,
what is certainly an advantage when handling. 
Okay, I could have come to that immediately ...
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#1689 by llanitedave on 14 Jul, 2019 22:11
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Manfred, I continue to be amazed and in awe of the exquisite fineness of your work. it's a thing of beauty.
My best to you and your wife's health. -
#1690 by roma847 on 14 Jul, 2019 22:57
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Thanks Dave for your nice compliments and best wishes.
Yeah, small and tricky details, that has always been my passion, it's like a drug, I can't let go ...
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#1691 by roma847 on 15 Jul, 2019 13:05
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Hello everybody,
today, I've been dealing with some filing and sanding work, first I had to sand the Vertical Strut of the ET/Orbiter Attachment on the LH2 side for the TPS cladding of the Newware Kit and had to modify the Resin part still a little bit. And then there was also the associated Longeron, which had to be modified too.
Since the outer LO2Feedline Support Bracket was missing anyway and the inner did not quite fit and was a bit too small, I've scratched both Support Brackets new. It should be noted, however, that both brackets look similar, but have not the same shape. The inner bracket is a bit lower, 
because the Diagonal Cross Strut runs over it and needs the appropriate space, as onecan see on this image.
Source: NASA
Afterwards I've sanded off the two unnecessary wide rings at the end of the Feedline. As one can see here, I have to smooth the line around the stub yet, which has to be removed anyway after the tests and its hole must be filled too, because in reality there were neither the two rings nor this holder.
Last night I did not notice the nicks, but even all the more so in daylight.
These are the modified parts,
whose seat on the ET I've tried next. And as one can see, they fit quite well so far.
Now I'm going to modify the too short LH2 Feedline Support Brackets, and then it goes on with the tricky Cable Trays with all due respect.
But scaremongering does not apply!
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#1692 by roma847 on 18 Jul, 2019 21:02
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Hello friends,
after I've taken a look at the LH2 Feedline again and comparing it with my Reference photos,
Source: georgesrockets.com (George Gassaway)
Source: NASA
I have decided to remove the rings that are too narrow (0,5 mm) and to replace them with wider ones (1 mm), which are much better corresponding to the original.
No sooner said than done! But when I measured the stub then after grinding off the rings, its diameter was instead of 3 mm only 2,7 mm, which I did not like.
That's why I took a rod Ø 3 mm and bent it under hot air according to my proven Balsa-Bending-Technique.
But as it is sometimes, if one has not bent anything for a long time, this bending process did not go satisfactorily, because the lower balsa support behind the kink was too short, so that the kink of the rod was not bent exactly enough, but was slightly rounded as one will see.
I have taken this into account by a longer slope of the support and a more stable clamping of the rod, which has resulted in a more accurate bend,
what one can see in the following picture by comparing the two bended rods. Above it are already to see the 1 mm wide rings, which I have cut off from a tube with Ø 4 mm, which I have previously drilled out to 3 mm.
Then I have filed the new stub to the required length and drilled a hole for the guide pin (Ø 1,2 mm),
and glued it in place.
Here the two rings have been pushed onto the Feedline, which I will glue with MEK.
And so the new LH2 Feedline looks like after fitting,
which I like much better now.
And now I could also adjust the Feedline Brackets, which sit directly above the upper ring. But if one looks closely, one can still see a further ring directly below the Umbilical Plate.
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (DaveS)
And this ring I have now also housed yet, as one can see in these two pictures, wherewith I now let it be good.
The odd little cutouts in this ring I prefer to avoid because the ring might not be able to bear it.
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#1693 by Starbase101 on 19 Jul, 2019 04:24
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Coming along nicely. Knowing your high attention to details, would it not be possible to carefully file the ring's cutouts after it's been glued to the feedline so it's supported by the larger rod?
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#1694 by roma847 on 19 Jul, 2019 21:54
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Thanks Mike for your well-meant inspiration, but these parts are so small that one can barely handle them.
But you've egged me on a little bit,
so I'll try to apply the little cutouts in this upper ring by using my smallest round file, wich is only 0,5 mm at the top.
And I think that should work, keep your fingers crossed!
BTW, above one can see one of the two tiny LH2 Feedline Brackets.
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#1695 by roma847 on 28 Jul, 2019 23:10
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Hello everybody,
but as I mean by this time, these recesses in the upper rings seem to be filled up conclusively with the appropriate TPS material, which is why it is unnecessary.
Furthermore the Support Brackets for the LH2 Feedline also look different and are also mounted differently than the brackets for the LO2 Feedline on the right side.
Source: NASA
As can be seen from this image, the two LH2 Brackets are not rigidly connected to the crossbeam like the LO2 Brackets, but rather are slightly laterally movable by Hinge elements, which is said to allow unrestricted relative distortion between the rear ET and the orbiter.
Source: NASA
More precise information about the shape of the outer LH2 Bracket is given by this drawing, from which I have also determined the dimensions, whereby I've used the width of the Airfix Crossbeam (2,7 mm) as reference measure. 
Source: System Definition Handbook SLWT, Vol. II (Lockheed Martin)
However, one has to keep in mind that this is the SLWT Handbook, i.e. this is how the Super Lightweight Tank (SLWT) looked like, which was used starting at the end of 1998, with some modifications in order to reduce weight in favor of larger payloads, compared to the Lightweight Tank (LWT) used for the first time at STS-6 (ET-8).
And as a further closer look at just this ET-8 shows, the inner bracket looks a bit different than my previous one,
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (Jester)
which is why I've modified it a bit (right).
In order to finally fix the brackets and bond them with the Crossbeam, I put the Orbiter back on and fixed it with tape to see the exact distances and to adjust the brackets accordingly.
And in this position, the inner bracket was glued by using MEK with the Crossbeam and the LH2 Feedline.
And now to the preparation of the outer bracket, which is drawn slightly longer, to which later the two holders for the LH2 Cable Tray are glued, as can be seen from the drawing.
The front cable tray mount is nice to see in this photo, but whereby the two Umbilical photos in the capcomespace dossier are reversed unfortunately.
Source: capcomespace.net
This was followed by the fitting of the outer bracket,
and their cutback to the right length,
and finally their gluing with the crossbeam and the feedline with MEK.
Then I was able to remove the orbiter again and scrutinize from all sides the [color= blue]LH2 Feedline[/color], glued on the crossbeam.
And now I could either glue the LO2 Feedline Brackets or lay the LH2 Cable Tray on the front of the Crossbeam.
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#1696 by roma847 on 30 Jul, 2019 20:04
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Hello friends,
I've now chosen to glue the LO2 Feedline Brackets, for which I've now also used 1 mm Styrene, so that the strengths of the brackets on both sides are the same.
However, I've only glued the brackets to the Crossbeam, and not to the Feedline, because I still have to glue the rings next to the Feedline supports, as well as the front missing support behind the Intertank, for what I need enough freedom of action.
The positioning and gluing of the tiny brackets was quite tricky, but then I've managed it quite well.
And the Diagonal Cross Strut fits in between quite well too.
Then I've still glued the Resin-TPS-Claddings to the Vertical Struts, so they will not be lost.
And now it can go on with the LH2 Cable Tray on the crossbeam.
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#1697 by roma847 on 09 Aug, 2019 12:59
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Hello everybody,
in order to be able to scratch-build the LH2 Cable Tray as completely as possible, which I'm intending, I first had to clarify its continuous course, which lasted long enough. And this course can be subdivided into two parts.
The first and much longer, but simpler part extends over the entire LH2 Tank, starting behind the Intertank, and then flows into the right Vertical Strut at its top end (see yellow circle). For the moment, however, I will defer this part until later, because it has to go along with the laying of the Ice Frost Ramps of the GH2/GO2 Press. Lines, what will follow later.
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (DDG40)
In this strut, the cables then run upwards and enter the gray "Distribution box" from behind,
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (DaveS)
and from there the cable tray runs on the front side of the Crossbeam to the other side, which I will show in more detail.
Source: Scott Phillips
And now follows the difficult and time-consuming part of every scratch exercise, in which I always have to determine the required dimensions of the individual parts by using suitable reference photos/drawings.
One is spoiled for choice, depending on which reference measure (yellow) one refers, either to parts of the original photos, or to those of the Airfix Kit, which then sometimes can lead to a compromise between the two possibilities, so to speak on something between.
In the following photo, the transition from the "Distribution box" to the following Cable Tray is unfortunately covered, which is why I had to determine it by appropriate cutting lines to be able to estimate its dimensions.
The dimensions of the "Distribution box" can indeed be determined well from the next image, but here the transition area to the cable tray is covered, which is why no clear reference dimension can be found. That's why in anticipation of the next photos I used the height of the Cable Tray (2,7 mm) as reference measurement.
This is the already oftener shown photo by DaveS,
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (DaveS)
on which one can see in a rotated and greatly enlarged representation of the transition of the LH2 Cable Tray from the vertical strut into the "Distribution box" very clearly, whereby the oblique perspective allows no accurate measurement of the parts.
But there is this photo by George Gassaway,
Source: georgesrockets.com (George Gassaway)
which, in rotated and enlarged view, allows some important estimates due to the almost direct view, as well as the height of the Cable Tray (2,7 mm), previously chosen as a reference measurement, which in turn was determined from the diameter of the Thrust Strut of the Airfix Kit (Ø 3,2mm).
And so the LH2 Cable Tray arrives on the other side of the Crossbeam, whereby here one also can see well the TPS cladding of the GH2 Press. Line. And from there it is only a short distance to the LH2 Umbilical Plate, into which both the Cable Tray and the Press. Line are inserted from the bottom, wherewith we finally arrived at our destination.
Source: georgesrockets.com (George Gassaway)
Source: capcomespace.net
And so now for the practical implementation, wherefor which I have used this drawing from the ET Bible.
Source: System Definition Handbook SLWT, Vol. II (Lockheed Martin)
Into this drawing, I have drawn as a reference measurement the distance between the two support points of the Airfix orbiter (32 mm) and then reduced the drawing to 1:144 and also still mirrored.
And with this I have now tried to draw a true to scale template for the Cable Tray with the appendage of the "Distribution box" and print out, which I also managed to some extent.
But what looked just so nice and catchy on the photos yet, shrinks on a scale of 1:144 after the expression again together in such a way, so I had to look twice when cutting out the Cable Tray.
And that's what the part looks like on the Airfix Crossbeam,
which I now only need to transfer to 0,5 mm Styrene sheet and carefully to cut it out.
On the right side of the Cable Tray one has to add this rounding and, if possible, also the 90° bend to the front, which one can see well in the zoom on this photo of the ET-121.
Source: NASA
And for completion, all that is still missing is the TPS cladding of the GH2 Press. Line, which will be made later.
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#1698 by roma847 on 10 Aug, 2019 17:21
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Hello everybody,
as one can see in this photo, the TPS Cladding of the Vertical Strut is reaching still a bit more upwards, has a few steps there and looks thus a little bit different than the Newware-Resin-Cladding.
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (DaveS)
In order to enable the connection to the Distribution box of the LH2 Cable Tray based on the original, I have tried to recreate these details and have glued tiny particles of the narrowest and thinnest Evergreen strips around the strut,
what was again a delicate fidding, whereby the transitions still need to be slightly sanded.
Then I've fixed the paper template of the LH2 Cable Tray with the Distribution box on the Crossbeam again to see whether or how this matches with the clearances, and whether there is still enough space for this box,
which could be about right, as one can see here.
Then I've transferred this template onto a 0,5 mm Styrene sheet and cut it out piecewise, for which I used my finest Mini-saw (0,1 mm) for the long cuts and for the short cuts my Chisel cutter.
And after that long cut, the part has been finally exposed,
and was then finely smoothened at the edges.
The following test fitting of the Cable Tray at the Crossbeam looked quite well,
so that I could turn to the small Distribution box for which I've used an Evergreen square profile 1,5 mm x 2 mm,
which, however, was difficult to handle.
As the test fitting of the Cable tray with the glued box shows, the seat is quite neat, so that only the sloping bottom side would be something to straighten.
Then only the cable connection would have to be attached, after which it could then continue on the other side.
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#1699 by roma847 on 18 Aug, 2019 22:16
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Hello everybody,
in the meantime, I've attached this Cable connection between the Vertical strut and the Distribution box, for which I've glued two tiny pieces of Evergreen Strip which are barely noticeable. 
And now to the other end of this Cable Tray in the red circle, which after the arc at the end firstly goes down and then immediately runs rearward in a short 90° arc underneath the Crossbeam.
Source: NASA
This course can be followed in the following photos.
Source: NASA
Source: georgesrockets.com (George Gassaway)
Source: capcomespace.net
In this drawing, the course of the two Cable trays is simplified depicted, but what is helpful for scratch-building.
Source: System Definition Handbook SLWT, Vol. I (Lockheed Martin)
Behind the crossbeam follows at the end of the cable tray the angled transition of the parts with TPS Cladding (2, 3, 4, 5) up to the Umbilical Plate under the orbiter, which seems to be difficult to scratch due to the minimal dimensions of the parts, especially since the clear height between the Cable Tray and the Umbilical Plate is only 3 mm, from what the height of the CT transition to 4 mm results, which should become quite tricky. 
Source: georgesrockets.com (George Gassaway)
Afterwards I've tried the arc of the Cable Tray on the front of the Crossbeam with the help of my Balsa & Bending Technique. 
During mounting one has to make sure that the Cable Tray is not directly in contact underneath the Crossbeam but sits on a small spacer (0,4 mm) which is already glued here.
As the test mounting shows, however, from the arc would leave almost nothing left, which would probably complicate a flush connection.
Therefore, it will probably be better if the cable tray is first glued to the front with a bit of supernatant, after which a matching strip is glued in the interspace which then is rounded.
And this construction I've tested provisionally with tape,
and was surprised that the clear height between the Cable tray (0,6 mm x 1 mm) and the Umbilical plate is actually 3 mm and thus is perfectly in accordance with my previous estimates of the measurements.
And this is a first attempt to make the TPS arc (part 2) from a rectangular profile 1,5 mm x 3,2 mm,
whereby I am looking forward to the result.
