Orbital space tourism business model

[QuantumG]

you'd be surprised how many keep themselves extremely busy at things like sailing themselves to different ports of call or flying Netjets back and forth to the Keys to scuba dive.

I know a few people like that myself.. they're far from being millionaires who have the kind of money we're talking about here.

[Orbital Debris]

Links posted on the Bigelow thread indicate ~35 million for 3 months. 

I would agree that no single billionaire would be away from business for extended stays.  Extensive comm coverage means investing in bandwidth and ground stations.  Extended stays mean extensive training.

I think extended stays would be oriented toward sovereign nations and corporate.

As far as health affects - the negative (calcium loss, radiation) effects of zero g would outweigh health effects.  Calcium sloughing begins within a 24 hours of reaching orbit. 

[dbhyslop]

I know a few people like that myself.. they're far from being millionaires who have the kind of money we're talking about here.

Two individuals I'm thinking about specifically with about $100M total.  If I was collecting about 7% a year I wouldn't be too afraid to burn $5M on an experience like this.

I assume that there would also be people with less money who do it who really can't responsibly afford it.  There are mailmen who quit their jobs and take second mortgages to climb Everest.  For a spaceflight, that might mean people with $10-20M who are willing to burn a substantial portion of their wealth.

[vulture4]

I believe the Aerospace Corp study found that a significant market would require a price <$2M to LEO. Space Adventures sold a handful of seats at $20-$30M but not enough for a viable business model. I have not heard anyone offer $60M, the current price. If we want more than a handful of people to ever fly in space a substantial reduction in cost is essential.

[baddux]

Even if it would be possible to stay longer in orbit what would the customers do there for several days (or weeks or months)?

It will be great to look at the window and experience zero-g but I believe it's not enough once you have experienced those. Every day in orbit will cost a lot anyway so not a good deal to go there and read books or do business work online.

And if for example 1 hour is enough to experience space do you actually want to go to orbit would it make more sense to do a longer 500km/1 hour suborbital trip. You don't notice it anyway whether you are freefalling towards the earth or next to the earth.

[A_M_Swallow]

An hour in a place is a change of flight.  So this is pointing towards 2 or 3 day holidays.  There are plenty of long weekend trips around.

[mrmandias]

Links posted on the Bigelow thread indicate ~35 million for 3 months. 

I would agree that no single billionaire would be away from business for extended stays.  Extensive comm coverage means investing in bandwidth and ground stations.  Extended stays mean extensive training.

I think extended stays would be oriented toward sovereign nations and corporate.

As far as health affects - the negative (calcium loss, radiation) effects of zero g would outweigh health effects.  Calcium sloughing begins within a 24 hours of reaching orbit. 

For geriatric retirement, you don't care about calcium loss if you are not planning on returning, and radiation is really only a risk for long-term cancer, which isn't nearly as much a concern if you are already old.

That is not to say that geriatric retirement is a good idea, we have little data at the moment and what data we do have suggests that zero-g is bad for you even in ways that oldsters would care about.  But we can't say for sure that there's no gravity point where ther are health benefits and where the old feel young again.   Maybe the killer app for space is something like .8 g,  where again centimillionaires can feel vigorous and strong again.  Might that be worth $100 mill to someone whose worth $200 mill?  Quite possible.

[billh]

Space Adventures sold a handful of seats at $20-$30M but not enough for a viable business model. I have not heard anyone offer $60M, the current price.

They've sold every seat that was available. The reason you haven't heard about any flights recently is that since the shuttle stopped helping with ISS crew rotations every seat on the Soyuz is needed for that purpose. The latest word is that there won't be any more seats available than 2015 at the earliest. They have people like Sergey Brin of Google on the waiting list right now.

[Valerij]

Links posted on the Bigelow thread indicate ~35 million for 3 months. 

I would agree that no single billionaire would be away from business for extended stays.  Extensive comm coverage means investing in bandwidth and ground stations.  Extended stays mean extensive training.

I think extended stays would be oriented toward sovereign nations and corporate.

As far as health affects - the negative (calcium loss, radiation) effects of zero g would outweigh health effects.  Calcium sloughing begins within a 24 hours of reaching orbit. 

I assume that enough expensive long (2-3 months) flight in space hotel too quickly becomes popular. And $35M the real price for such flight.

1) Such flight close enough analogy to long sea cruise.

2) For businessmen of video of conference instead of direct participation solve the majority of problems. The Internet and a reliable communication allow the businessman not to come off for a long time management of the enterprises.

3) Rupture of the prices between short-term stay in an orbit and long space cruise will create atmosphere elite "the closed club". In a year only 20-30 persons can visit such mode in hotel.

4) Travel companies will certainly undertake efforts for increase of popularity of such flights. For example, they can send in hotel of any celebrities, known politicians, sportsmen or popular actors, is possible after their career end. And pay flight of this celebrity sponsors can, and this event can be used in the advertising company of the sponsor.

But creation of "space hotel" and a spaceship which will bring to this hotel of clients, very much will accelerate the future events

[JohnFornaro]

Some people sail ... on luxury yachts over 2 million.

You need to double check the prices, my friend.  Unless by "over", you mean a factor of ten or so.

But your larger point, that rich folks have plenty of leisure time, still holds.  The other point also holds, which Jon Goff touches on, is that 6 months of "training" is not seen as "vacation".  Note the different spellings.  OI'm going out on a limb here, but, when you buy your yacht, you don't want to be swabbing the poop deck, working in the engine room, yada yada.  Whatever "training" or "orientation" is needed should be on the order of a few weeks.

In 1990, a wealthy client of mine sold off his business to the tune of low nine figures, and spent at least the next ten years on his yacht.  But these are anecdotal stories, and mine could be countered with the fellow who's net worth is only in the low seven figures, who works sixty hour weeks, and only takes off the long weekend or two.

Such flight close enough analogy to long sea cruise.

Well no.  The analogy is only similar in the length of time, about three months.  I assure you that it is far more interesting to spend $100-$200K to cruise Earthly ports than it would be to spend those three months and $35M looking at the stars, your four walls, and pooping less frequently.

[QuantumG]

Not to mention that a yacht is an asset.

Now, if you were talking about rich folks buying reusable space planes, then we might have a ball game.

[Valerij]

Such flight close enough analogy to long sea cruise.

Well no.  The analogy is only similar in the length of time, about three months.  I assure you that it is far more interesting to spend $100-$200K to cruise Earthly ports than it would be to spend those three months and $35M looking at the stars, your four walls, and pooping less frequently.

I perfectly understand a difference between round-the-world sea cruise in cost $100K - $200K and space cruise $35M. Modern owners of the largest yachts have enough money what to order space cruise. And the basic advantage from their point of view will be that such cruise is accessible to very limited number of people.

It is not enough such clients, all no more than several tens a year. But it is quite enough, possibilities of space hotel too are insignificant, no more than twenty-thirty visitors in a year. And they will not buy inexpensive tickets for suborbital flights or for some hours in an orbit

[dcporter]

Not to mention that a yacht is an asset.

Mmmmm not sure this is applicable the way you think. Put "hole in the water you throw money into" into Google and poke around.