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#800
by
stone
on 29 Nov, 2012 19:32
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#801
by
StephenB
on 29 Nov, 2012 20:11
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From a
Fox article:
"This is going to be a disappointment," said Chris McKay, a NASA space scientist at Ames Research Center at Moffett Field, Calif. "The press description of the SAM results as 'earthshaking' is, in my view, an unfortunate exaggeration.
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#802
by
Ares67
on 29 Nov, 2012 20:54
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Life on Mars... Remember the hype of 1996?
NASA, with those "Life on Mars" rumors before whatever will be announced in that official press release on Monday... you shot yourself in the foot again!
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#803
by
Hungry4info3
on 29 Nov, 2012 22:17
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NASA ... [snip] ... you shot yourself in the foot again!
I was under the impression most of the hype was from outside NASA.
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#804
by
The Off Topic Sheriff
on 29 Nov, 2012 22:39
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An off topic alarm went off. Trimmed. Keep on the thread title of updates.
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#805
by
robertross
on 29 Nov, 2012 23:46
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Totally ON-TOPIC:
11.29.2012
Source: Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Update Set In San Francisco About Curiosity Mars RoverPASADENA, Calif. -- The next news conference about the NASA Mars rover Curiosity will be held at 9 a.m. Monday, Dec. 3, in San Francisco at the Fall Meeting of the American Geophysical Union (AGU).
Rumors and speculation that there are major new findings from the mission at this early stage are incorrect. The news conference will be an update about first use of the rover's full array of analytical instruments to investigate a drift of sandy soil. One class of substances Curiosity is checking for is organic compounds -- carbon-containing chemicals that can be ingredients for life. At this point in the mission, the instruments on the rover have not detected any definitive evidence of Martian organics.
The Mars Science Laboratory Project and its Curiosity rover are less than four months into a two-year prime mission to investigate whether conditions in Mars' Gale Crater may have been favorable for microbial life. Curiosity is exceeding all expectations for a new mission with all of the instruments and measurement systems performing well. This is spectacular for such a complex system, and one that is operated so far away on Mars by people here on planet Earth. The mission already has found an ancient riverbed on the Red Planet, and there is every expectation for remarkable discoveries still to come.
Audio and visuals from the briefing also will be streamed online at:
http://www.ustream.tv/nasajpl .
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl/news/whatsnew/index.cfm?FuseAction=ShowNews&NewsID=1398
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#806
by
catdlr
on 30 Nov, 2012 04:17
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back to normal status reports:
Curiosity Roves Again
Published on Nov 29, 2012 by JPLnews
After spending six weeks doing science investigations at Rocknest, NASA's Curiosity Mars rover is on the move again to Point Lake and a place to try out the drill.
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#807
by
Dalhousie
on 30 Nov, 2012 07:19
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The MER pages have odometry and sol stats. Are similar stats being recorded online for Curosity? I have not seen any.
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#808
by
iamlucky13
on 30 Nov, 2012 23:59
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The MER pages have odometry and sol stats. Are similar stats being recorded online for Curosity? I have not seen any.
I sent an email a couple weeks ago suggesting odometry would be a nice addition, along with a few other stats if possible. No response, but we'll see if they find the time to throw in some fun bits like that.
There's a couple threads over on UMSF related to odometry. I hope Chris doesn't mind me linking to them:
http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=7457http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=7442&st=75&start=75Also, if you really, really want a sense of where the rover has traveled so far, you MUST try out the "Explore Curiosity" flash widget on the MSL homepage.
Unfortunately, the terrain is not filled in with detail from the MSL imagery, and robotic arm operations are not included, but the topology is pretty high resolution, and you can go back to Sol 1 and let it play through the drives so far. You can spin around the rover in 3-D and admire the highly detailed model. The suspension even actuates as it rolls over the terrain.
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#809
by
Dalhousie
on 01 Dec, 2012 00:55
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Thanks for that, I am glad I am not the only one who misses that data!
I have been using the Google Earth files from UMSF to work out the odometry but they are 1) rough and 2) going to be increasingly tedious as the distance increases.
So far I calculate Curiosity as having averaged about 4 m per sol, compared with 11 m per sol for Oppotunity and 4 m per sol for Spirit (not including the time bogged from May 2009 to end of mission).
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#810
by
fthurber
on 01 Dec, 2012 23:03
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NASA ... [snip] ... you shot yourself in the foot again!
I was under the impression most of the hype was from outside NASA.
Exactly. NASA was not behind the hype; it was the press and over-eager bloggers.
BTW it looks like there was another SAM run of the wind ripple sand on Sol 114. Apparently this is to solidify their SAM findings before the AGU (and the press conference) on Monday. So whatever they found it will be of great interest to planetary geologists but not so much to the jaded public. Interesting Isotopes or carbonates or clays etc....maybe.
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#811
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 03 Dec, 2012 16:05
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#812
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 03 Dec, 2012 16:10
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Apparently Curiosity found perchlorate....
"We picked the right place; we landed on an ancient riverbed." - Michael Meyer
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#813
by
iamlucky13
on 03 Dec, 2012 16:19
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Hmm after so much hype, now no one is watching the ultimate briefing? 
ustream.tv/nasajpl
I just jumped in a little late. As forecast once the rumors died down, they're excited about running both SAM and ChemMin for the first time, and sharing the results. Some discussion of APXS, too.
They were going for "ordinary" Martian samples for the first samples so they could compare to results from other missions. Their sample looks exactly like what they were going for.
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#814
by
iamlucky13
on 03 Dec, 2012 16:25
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Lots of details being shared. I am not going to be able to keep up.
First screen is the bulk gasses from the first SAM run. Decent amount of water vapor.
Second screen is deuterium to hydrogen ratio. Past measurements from earth suggested seasonal variation of D-H. SAM shows high deuterium ratio compared to earth.
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#815
by
iamlucky13
on 03 Dec, 2012 16:28
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And some talk about possible perchlorates based on the gases evolved. Not confirmed, but they would expect these SAM findings if there were some perchlorates breaking down in the sample.
Some talk about having found simple organic compounds and are trying to confirm they're from the sample, not MSL contamination. I missed the first mention of it.
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#816
by
Star One
on 03 Dec, 2012 16:28
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#817
by
iamlucky13
on 03 Dec, 2012 16:34
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Grotzinger is tying the results of each instrument together. Again...I couldn't keep up enough to reasonably summarize what he's saying (I have to keep up the illusion that I'm working, too).
I thought it interesting, however, how he's also linking DAN, RAD, and REMS to the work done by APXS, ChemCam, ChemMin, and SAM. These environmental instruments provide the context in which these samples lie...they know for the first time, for example, the radiation exposure of their sample at location it was taken, rather than as global averages, which affects the formation and breakdown of various compounds in the soil.
(EDIT - A couple minor edits for clarification)
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#818
by
iamlucky13
on 03 Dec, 2012 16:48
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Grotzinger closed by saying the process is not going to be sudden discovery, but gradual, careful, systematic collection and analysis of data.
Now moving to questions.
Q: How do we find out if the organics are Martian or not?
A: Grotzinger - Paul will answer, but for starters, there's some uncertainty we tried to eliminate by making sure the instrument is working right, and eliminate contamination. Brought up possibility of also being from meteors, not just from MSL. If confirmed Martian, next question is abiotic or biotic.
A: Paul Mahaffy - Can use the organic check sample if serious concern to compare for residuals that don't show up in the blank (if something shows up in the blank that should not be there, it's contamination). Before that, though, they do several empty runs.
Q (Emily L - Planetary Society) - Can determine if the compounds, especially chlorinated compounds, were in the soil, or formed as a result of sample handling, heating, etc?
A: Paul - Possible, or likely the heating formed the compounds detected
(My addition - would imply they know the elements present, but need to figure out what they came from)
Q: What does the high deuterium ratio and the presence of perchlorates mean?
A: Paul - Seeing not just heavy hydrogen, but also carbon, oxygen, and expecting to find heavy nitrogen, elevated too. Lighter isotopes are lost to space more easily, so this is expected. Biological processes would concentrate lighter isotopes, however, so precise ratio is interesting.
Perchlorates still unconfirmed. Oxygen and chlorine evolved, possible from calcium perchlorate.
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#819
by
iamlucky13
on 03 Dec, 2012 17:02
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Q (Joe Palka, NPR) - Do we think the chlorine came from perchlorate salts when heated?
A (Paul) - Unconfirmed, but likely. Came out at the right time in the heating process.
Q (Rob Reynolds, Al Jazeera) - In laymans terms, what is the most important or unexpected finding so far, and 2nd what does the recent hype say about the level of interest from laymen?
A (Grotzinger) - I guess I'll take that one (audience laughs). For the second part of the Q, I guess we have to be careful what we say. Things that we think are great discoveries, but they aren't that interesting publicly. Interest comes after we have a clear understanding what we found (very, very poor paraphrase on my part)
A (Michael Meyer) - Spectacular that we found we landed on an ancient riverbed.
Q (I missed the exact question)
A (Grotzinger) - Spectacular data return. When you get your first sample, and it's working, you get really excited. When you get second sample, and consistent results, then we're really doing science.
Q - If the organics are from Mars, how do you tell if biotic?
A (Paul) - Carbon isotopes especially. Filter out geologic and meteor ratios (meteors bring material to Mars should show same ratios as meteors studied on earth).
Q - (missed the question)
A (Grotzinger) - Lots of popular focus on water, not a lot on other necessities of life. Chemistry-wise, organics are being found common in the solar system (references Messenger's recent Mercury findings). Now seeing hints of energy bearing compounds (perchlorates).
Q (Kelly Beedy, Sky and Telescope) - Are the methane compounds indigenous. What are implications of 5x D-H ratio compared to earth.
A (Paul) - Probably the methane compounds (methyl chlorine) formed in SAM. Probably not, for example, from UV reactions.
Lighter hydrogen more rapidly escapes to space than deuterium. What will be interesting is looking for REALLY old trapped water (hydrates), if that water has lower D-H ratio, good reference to determine escape rate.
(EDIT - added a few more details that from memory were mentioned on the question about necessities for life)
