Author Topic: SpaceX Falcon 9 v1.1 - Jason 3 - SLC-4E Vandenberg - Jan 17, 2016 - DISCUSSION  (Read 594338 times)

Offline Skyrocket

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Is this going into polar orbit? If not, launching from Vanderberg, couldn't they land the FS down range at the Cape  instead of RTLS?

It goes to a 66° orbit. And a launch trajectory over populated areas is not a very good idea now.

Offline Dudely

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Is this going into polar orbit? If not, launching from Vanderberg, couldn't they land the FS down range at the Cape  instead of RTLS?

Those two locations are more than an order of magnitude further apart than the first stage is capable of travelling.

Online catdlr

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Jason 3-Continuing Decades of Ocean Surface Measurements

Published on Apr 22, 2015
Did you know satellites can measure Earth’s oceans from space? The Jason-3 satellite, set to launch in July 2015, will collect critical sea surface height data, adding to a satellite data record going back to 1992.

The ocean is an important driver of weather and climate on the planet, and forecasters need this information to predict the intensity of devastating hurricanes before they reach our shores. Jason-3 will also help us track the rise in sea-level over time, allowing our coastal communities to prepare and adjust to a changing climate.

Read more at: http://www.nesdis.noaa.gov/jason-3

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Offline NX-0

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Any idea of where the core for this mission is at, as far as processing?

Offline Ben the Space Brit

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At a guess, this core is probably still in the final stages of production; certainly not shipped to MacGreggor yet.
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Offline ugordan

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Your guess would be wrong.

Offline Ben the Space Brit

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Your guess would be wrong.

Well? don't be so coy, oh wise sage! Tell us the rest!
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Online gongora

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This is the first flight where they have to get it certified as a NASA science mission launch, so it seems they needed to make the vehicle for Jason-3 before the one for CRS-7 in order to have time to get through that process.

Offline ChefPat

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Has the Jason-3 LV been delivered to Vandenberg yet?
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Offline Kim Keller

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Has the Jason-3 LV been delivered to Vandenberg yet?

Not all of it.

Offline docmordrid

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While awaiting EELV certification, SpaceX Falcon 9 this week won NASA certification to launch Jason-3 mission this summer from Vandenberg.

https://www.twitter.com/flatoday_jdean/status/598908964689043456
« Last Edit: 05/14/2015 06:02 pm by docmordrid »
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Online abaddon

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While awaiting EELV certification, SpaceX Falcon 9 this week won NASA certification to launch Jason-3 mission this summer from Vandenberg.

https://www.twitter.com/flatoday_jdean/status/598908964689043456

Can someone please refresh my memory, is this Category 2 certification and is Jason-3 considered to be in the Class B payload class?  For context: http://nodis3.gsfc.nasa.gov/NPD_attachments/AttachmentA_7C.pdf.  Assuming it is Category 2, which of the two certification criteria were used (if anyone knows).  Thanks!
« Last Edit: 05/14/2015 09:37 pm by abaddon »

Offline deruch

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@flatoday_jdean
While awaiting EELV certification, SpaceX Falcon 9 this week won NASA certification to launch Jason-3 mission this summer from Vandenberg.

https://www.twitter.com/flatoday_jdean/status/598908964689043456

Can someone please refresh my memory, is this Category 2 certification and is Jason-3 considered to be in the Class B payload class?  For context: http://nodis3.gsfc.nasa.gov/NPD_attachments/AttachmentA_7C.pdf.  Assuming it is Category 2, which of the two certification criteria were used (if anyone knows).  Thanks!

Yes, Category 2 certification.  Jason-3 should be Class C (Lifecycle cost < $250million) Class B.  SpaceX used the 3 flight path but NASA needed additional data from at least 2 subsequent flights.

Certification matrix is better at the bottom of this document: http://nodis3.gsfc.nasa.gov/displayDir.cfm?t=NPD&c=8610&s=7D

edit: per Kim below, Class B not C.
« Last Edit: 05/15/2015 12:23 am by deruch »
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Online abaddon

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So theoretically, SpaceX is one flight five flights [EDIT: forgot that Dragon flights are not common configuration] short of being able to submit for Category 3 certification, using the Alternative 1 approach?  That's assuming that the legs don't count as a different configuration (they shouldn't).  I am less clear on whether the "Falcon 9 1.2" counts as a launch vehicle configuration common with current F9 1.1... any opinions?  It would be a shame if Jason-3 was the only certified launch configuration and SpaceX had to start over again (although hopefully/presumably the process would not take as long this time if so).

Category 2 certification.  Jason-3 should be Class C (Lifecycle cost < $250million).  SpaceX used the 3 flight path but NASA needed additional data from at least 2 subsequent flights.

Interesting, where did you hear that?  Any idea why they needed data from five flights instead of three?  Was this because of the F9 1.0 -> F9 1.1 switcheroo?  But based on Dragon not being a "common configuration" with a F9 with a fairing that seems unlikely...

Sorry, I know this is a lot of questions to throw out, and not the best organized post.

[EDIT] From the updated link (thanks!):
Quote
Major launch vehicle upgrades may require additional NASA technical penetration and/or flight demonstration
Will be interesting to see how "major" F91.1->F91.2 is considered to be by NASA.
« Last Edit: 05/14/2015 10:45 pm by abaddon »

Offline deruch

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So theoretically, SpaceX is one flight five flights [EDIT: forgot that Dragon flights are not common configuration] short of being able to submit for Category 3 certification, using the Alternative 1 approach?  That's assuming that the legs don't count as a different configuration (they shouldn't).  I am less clear on whether the "Falcon 9 1.2" counts as a launch vehicle configuration common with current F9 1.1... any opinions?  It would be a shame if Jason-3 was the only certified launch configuration and SpaceX had to start over again (although hopefully/presumably the process would not take as long this time if so).

Category 2 certification.  Jason-3 should be Class C (Lifecycle cost < $250million).  SpaceX used the 3 flight path but NASA needed additional data from at least 2 subsequent flights.

Interesting, where did you hear that?  Any idea why they needed data from five flights instead of three?  Was this because of the F9 1.0 -> F9 1.1 switcheroo?  But based on Dragon not being a "common configuration" with a F9 with a fairing that seems unlikely...

Sorry, I know this is a lot of questions to throw out, and not the best organized post.

[EDIT] From the updated link (thanks!):
Quote
Major launch vehicle upgrades may require additional NASA technical penetration and/or flight demonstration
Will be interesting to see how "major" F91.1->F91.2 is considered to be by NASA.

This article, originally posted here, gives a good overview and addresses most of the questions you posed: http://aviationweek.com/space/upgraded-falcon-9-may-need-additional-certification

TL;DR- because SpaceX never did ground-based vacuum testing of the upper stage engine, NASA wanted data on the MVac's performance in vacuum from 2 more flights.

The recertification issue was discussed here starting right after the original posting of that article.  ~Reply #229 of this thread.
« Last Edit: 05/14/2015 11:17 pm by deruch »
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Offline Kim Keller

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Yes, Category 2 certification.  Jason-3 should be Class C (Lifecycle cost < $250million).  SpaceX used the 3 flight path but NASA needed additional data from at least 2 subsequent flights.

JASON-3 is a class B payload. It's rare for a Class B to ride a Cat 2 LV, but the project decided to accept some extra level of risk.

Offline Robotbeat

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Dragon flights are no more different from regular flights of v1.1 than, say, Atlas V 401 are from 501 flights.
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Offline deruch

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Dragon flights are no more different from regular flights of v1.1 than, say, Atlas V 401 are from 501 flights.

I think the confusion is that the USAF considers the fairing as part of the common vehicle configuration but NASA doesn't.  So, for DoD certification CRS launches can't be counted but for NASA cert. they can be.
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Offline Robotbeat

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Dragon flights are no more different from regular flights of v1.1 than, say, Atlas V 401 are from 501 flights.

I think the confusion is that the USAF considers the fairing as part of the common vehicle configuration but NASA doesn't.  So, for DoD certification CRS launches can't be counted but for NASA cert. they can be.
Are you certain about that?
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Offline Jim

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Dragon flights are no more different from regular flights of v1.1 than, say, Atlas V 401 are from 501 flights.

NASA classifies 501 as different core configuration since the Centaur is encapsulated.

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