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CZ-3B - Chinasat (Zhongxing) 2A - May 26, 2012
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 12 May, 2012 14:40
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#1
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 15 May, 2012 05:31
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Another rumor points to launch next Tuesday (May 22).
SourceEdit: this rumor assumes that the pictures below shows that the satellite has been transferred to the launch pad. But I'm not sure.
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#2
by
Satori
on 15 May, 2012 11:20
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This is going to be the second Fenghuo-2?
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#3
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 15 May, 2012 13:58
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This is going to be the second Fenghuo-2?
I doubt we'll know until it launches.... which shouldn't be long by now, as the commemorative covers for this launch are now for sale:
http://bbs.941jy.com/read-htm-tid-64334.html .
Next week maybe?
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#4
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 17 May, 2012 10:13
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This is going to be the second Fenghuo-2?
I doubt we'll know until it launches.... which shouldn't be long by now, as the commemorative covers for this launch are now for sale:http://bbs.941jy.com/read-htm-tid-64334.html .
Next week maybe?
Someone posted the trip plans for a team of teenagers that will get a chance of watching this launch, and it seems that the launch is scheduled on May 25 or 26 (probably again at around 1600 GMT), although it states that "plans are subjected to changes".
Source
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#5
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 24 May, 2012 02:52
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Launch time confirmed: May 26, 2012 at 15:56 UTC (11:56 pm local)
Source
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#6
by
Liss
on 24 May, 2012 09:07
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NOTAM:
A0532/12 - A TEMPORARY RESTRICTED AREA ESTABLISHED BOUNDED BY N260808E1142921-N261444E1140013-N255857E1135553-N255223E1142456, BACK TO START. VERTICAL LIMITS: SFC-UNL.ALL ACFT ARE PROHIBITED TO FLY INTO THE AREA. SFC - UNL, 26 MAY 15:55 2012 UNTIL 26 MAY 16:39 2012. CREATED: 24 MAY 08:45 2012
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#7
by
input~2
on 24 May, 2012 11:39
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NOTAM:
A0532/12 - A TEMPORARY RESTRICTED AREA ESTABLISHED BOUNDED BY N260808E1142921-N261444E1140013-N255857E1135553-N255223E1142456, BACK TO START. VERTICAL LIMITS: SFC-UNL.ALL ACFT ARE PROHIBITED TO FLY INTO THE AREA. SFC - UNL, 26 MAY 15:55 2012 UNTIL 26 MAY 16:39 2012. CREATED: 24 MAY 08:45 2012
This is the usual NOTAM for CZ-3B fairing drop zone.
We are still missing the NOTAM for the boosters drop zone..
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#8
by
Satori
on 24 May, 2012 18:04
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Looks like this is a second generation FengHuo tactical communications satellite.
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#9
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 12:28
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Launch center tourists being bussed to the launch site....
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#10
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 12:40
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Oops, I guess the wrong name: it should be Chinasat-2A!
Source
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#11
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 12:43
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#12
by
Satori
on 26 May, 2012 12:43
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Oops, I guess the wrong name: it should be Chinasat-2A!
Source
Any clue about the type of satellite (Fenghuo or Shentong)?
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#13
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 12:45
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Oops, I guess the wrong name: it should be Chinasat-2A!
Source
Any clue about the type of satellite (Fenghuo or Shentong)?
Probably we'll know after it launches.....
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#14
by
Satori
on 26 May, 2012 12:47
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Oops, I guess the wrong name: it should be Chinasat-2A!
Source
Any clue about the type of satellite (Fenghuo or Shentong)?
Probably we'll know after it launches.....
DFH-4?
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#15
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 12:53
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#16
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 13:25
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#17
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 14:30
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#18
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 15:15
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If Chinasat-1A is Fenghuo-2, Chinasat-2A could be Shentong-2
Here's a clue: last time ZX-1A was described as a satellite that "looks like it's holding a sword and a shield" (possibly with a UHF and a dish antenna), but apparently this is not the case of our guest today.
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#19
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 15:43
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Looks like they are using the 4.2 m diameter fairing again....
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#20
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 15:44
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A microblogger calls it "Shentong-2"
‘神通二号’卫星发射现在还有一个小时，该去叫醒睡熟的人，疏散好群众！
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#21
by
Satori
on 26 May, 2012 15:56
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Standing by for news of the launch...
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#22
by
TRNS
on 26 May, 2012 15:58
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No live coverage as usual I assume?
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#23
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 15:58
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#24
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 16:00
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Launched!
西昌卫星此次发射代号为“07-55”通信卫星，发射成功
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#25
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 16:03
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From Xichang city...
(edit: and from the launch site...)
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#26
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 16:32
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#27
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 16:32
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Launch success confirmed by CALT (
source).
The launch time is 15:56:04 UTC.
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#28
by
Satori
on 26 May, 2012 16:33
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Mission success!!! ZX-2A Zhongxing-2A is in orbit!
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#29
by
Chris Bergin
on 26 May, 2012 16:51
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#30
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 17:09
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#31
by
jcm
on 26 May, 2012 17:19
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Interesting that the Chinese sources are using the literal latin letter 'A' this time:
"[Zhong][Xing]2A" - normally Chinese satellites whose English translations
are given as, e.g. "FY-3B" are really "FY-3 02 xing" or something in Chinese.
Wonder if that is a real nomenclature shift or reflects that this time the name
is not the real one (i.e. it's really 'Shentong er hao weixing' and the ZX is a cover
name)? Yes, I'm really stretching into Kremlinology here...
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#32
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 17:23
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Interesting that the Chinese sources are using the literal latin letter 'A' this time:
"[Zhong][Xing]2A" - normally Chinese satellites whose English translations
are given as, e.g. "FY-3B" are really "FY-3 02 xing" or something in Chinese.
Wonder if that is a real nomenclature shift or reflects that this time the name
is not the real one (i.e. it's really 'Shentong er hao weixing' and the ZX is a cover
name)? Yes, I'm really stretching into Kremlinology here...
Could be, but remember there's Chinasat-6B in 2007....
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#33
by
Satori
on 26 May, 2012 17:27
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CZ-3B or CZ-3B/E?
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#34
by
jcm
on 26 May, 2012 17:28
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Interesting that the Chinese sources are using the literal latin letter 'A' this time:
"[Zhong][Xing]2A" - normally Chinese satellites whose English translations
are given as, e.g. "FY-3B" are really "FY-3 02 xing" or something in Chinese.
Wonder if that is a real nomenclature shift or reflects that this time the name
is not the real one (i.e. it's really 'Shentong er hao weixing' and the ZX is a cover
name)? Yes, I'm really stretching into Kremlinology here...
Could be, but remember there's Chinasat-6B in 2007....
Ah, yes. I think that was " zhongxing liu B weixing" if my notes are correct -
the 6 was in Chinese but the B in Latin. So maybe it just depends on whoever is writing the press release and how much exposure to English documentation they've had...
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#35
by
jcm
on 26 May, 2012 17:29
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CZ-3B or CZ-3B/E?
The CALT announcement says that the rocket is 457 tonnes,
56.54m tall, and has 5400 kg GTO capacity. I think these are the right values
for 3B/E rather than 3B, is that correct?
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#36
by
Satori
on 26 May, 2012 17:31
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CZ-3B or CZ-3B/E?
The CALT announcement says that the rocket is 457 tonnes,
56.54m tall, and has 5400 kg GTO capacity. I think these are the right values
for 3B/E rather than 3B, is that correct?
Yes, that is correct Jonathan.
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#37
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 17:41
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#38
by
jcm
on 26 May, 2012 17:43
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Another question - who owns these satellites? Does the Zhongxing name imply that they are operated by China Satcom (Zhongguo weixingtongxin jituangongsi) on behalf
of the military, or that's just a cover and these satellites are owned by some part of the PLA?
And another - "Shen Tong" is presumably an abbreviation for "Shen(something) Tongxin",
where Tongxin means communications.... can our Chinese speakers help here?
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#39
by
Satori
on 26 May, 2012 17:48
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Another question - who owns these satellites? Does the Zhongxing name imply that they are operated by China Satcom (Zhongguo weixingtongxin jituangongsi) on behalf
of the military, or that's just a cover and these satellites are owned by some part of the PLA?
Shentong are operated by the PLA. I think that in this case the Zhongxing designation is just a cover.
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#40
by
limen4
on 26 May, 2012 18:49
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Another question - who owns these satellites? Does the Zhongxing name imply that they are operated by China Satcom (Zhongguo weixingtongxin jituangongsi) on behalf
of the military, or that's just a cover and these satellites are owned by some part of the PLA?
And another - "Shen Tong" is presumably an abbreviation for "Shen(something) Tongxin",
where Tongxin means communications.... can our Chinese speakers help here?
Shentong (神通) means "Magical Power"
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#41
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 19:03
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Another question - who owns these satellites? Does the Zhongxing name imply that they are operated by China Satcom (Zhongguo weixingtongxin jituangongsi) on behalf
of the military, or that's just a cover and these satellites are owned by some part of the PLA?
And another - "Shen Tong" is presumably an abbreviation for "Shen(something) Tongxin",
where Tongxin means communications.... can our Chinese speakers help here?
"Shen Tong" (roughly) means "to communicate with the divine" (interestingly "Feng Huo" refers to the beacon, showing it's ability in mobile communications)
IIRC, most Chinese military satellites (and even part of the manned spaceflight program) are controlled by the PLA's General Armaments Department.
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#42
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 19:10
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#43
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 19:13
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#44
by
input~2
on 26 May, 2012 19:16
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USSTRATCOM has catalogued Object A
38352/2012-028A in 207.1 x 35786.9 km x 27.09°
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#45
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 26 May, 2012 19:23
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No videos on the web yet, but it was confirmed that the exact launch time is 15:56:04.241 UTC.
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#46
by
Phillip Clark
on 26 May, 2012 20:37
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I am curious about the use of the designators for this satellite.
I have the launch on November 14th, 2003 as being Shentong 1 (Zhongxing 20).
Then we had the launch on November 24th, 2010 as Shentong 2 (Zhongxing 20A).
These were on board the CZ-3A vehicle.
Now we have Shentong 2 (Zhongxing 2A) launched today aboard a CZ-3B/E.
Probably the first two launches should be classified as Shentong-1 1 and 2 (or A and B if you want) and today's launch as Shentong-2 1 (or A).
Normally the "A" after a Zhongxing designator means that there has already been a previous Zhongxing flight with the same numerical designator but I cannot see that the Chinese have used the Zhongxing 2 designator anywhere. The Zhongxing designator refers to the location of the satellite (not the satellite itself), rather like the old Soviet-era Statsionar designators.
Any thoughts, comments (which can be repeated in civilised company, of course!), especially about the MIA Zhongxing 2?
.
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#47
by
Skyrocket
on 26 May, 2012 21:39
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Any thoughts, comments (which can be repeated in civilised company, of course!), especially about the MIA Zhongxing 2?
ZX-2 was a satellite launched on 22.12.1988. It had likely nothing to do with ZX-2A or the ST series. Similar there was a ZX-1 launched on 07.03.1988 with no real connection to ZX-1A or the FH series. Seems like some kind of reuse of older designators for military comsats.
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#48
by
Liss
on 26 May, 2012 22:14
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I am curious about the use of the designators for this satellite.
I have the launch on November 14th, 2003 as being Shentong 1 (Zhongxing 20).
Then we had the launch on November 24th, 2010 as Shentong 2 (Zhongxing 20A).
The latter is not correct. The Chinese name for it was Shentong 1 #02 (神通一号02星), and the former became retroactively Shentong 1 #01.
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#49
by
jcm
on 26 May, 2012 22:25
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Another question - who owns these satellites? Does the Zhongxing name imply that they are operated by China Satcom (Zhongguo weixingtongxin jituangongsi) on behalf
of the military, or that's just a cover and these satellites are owned by some part of the PLA?
And another - "Shen Tong" is presumably an abbreviation for "Shen(something) Tongxin",
where Tongxin means communications.... can our Chinese speakers help here?
"Shen Tong" (roughly) means "to communicate with the divine" (interestingly "Feng Huo" refers to the beacon, showing it's ability in mobile communications)
IIRC, most Chinese military satellites (and even part of the manned spaceflight program) are controlled by the PLA's General Armaments Department.
Thanks
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#50
by
Phillip Clark
on 26 May, 2012 22:35
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Thank you Igor, what you say makes sense.
So just Zhongxing 2 to identify now!
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#51
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 27 May, 2012 03:49
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#52
by
jcm
on 27 May, 2012 05:13
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Thank you Igor,
So just Zhongxing 2 to identify now!
What was 1988-111A ? I thought it was Zhongxing er hao. = ZX-2
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#53
by
input~2
on 27 May, 2012 13:46
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#54
by
input~2
on 27 May, 2012 14:05
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#55
by
input~2
on 27 May, 2012 14:09
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#56
by
Artyom.
on 27 May, 2012 16:19
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#57
by
edkyle99
on 27 May, 2012 20:19
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Why is it that for almost every launch from China, western analysts say that the satellite has a military purpose, even when Xinhua says that, for example in this case, Chinasat 2A "will be used to meet the demands for China's radio and TV broadcasting and broadband multimedia transmissions."?
So in the West, the headline invariably reads that yet another military satellite was launched for China.
They can't all be military! And who exactly are these western analysts?
- Ed Kyle
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#58
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 27 May, 2012 20:28
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Why is it that for almost every launch from China, western analysts say that the satellite has a military purpose, even when Xinhua says that, for example in this case, Chinasat 2A "will be used to meet the demands for China's radio and TV broadcasting and broadband multimedia transmissions."?
So in the West, the headline invariably reads that yet another military satellite was launched for China.
They can't all be military! And who exactly are these western analysts?
- Ed Kyle
Well, luckily we now have a clearer sight of Chinese spaceflight, thanks to the various sources on the net. In this case it's pretty clear: the lack of information of the satellite (heck I can't nail the satellite's NAME down until hours before launch), the information posted by many sources on a Chinese forum, plus that it was confirmed that the satellite was indeed a next-generation strategic mil-com satellite (a la DSCS/WGS) per leaks on blogs, all points to its military nature. You can try to compare with the case of ZX-9 (2010) / 10 (2011): information on both are much easier to obtain.
And yup, it "will be used to meet the demands for China's radio and TV broadcasting and broadband multimedia transmissions". They just don't tell you whose those radios, TVs and computers belongs to.
GPS
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#59
by
Satori
on 27 May, 2012 20:35
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In fact, this year this is only the third military launch for China (assuming Tianhui-1B as a military bird) and China has already made 8 launches, so not all the launches are military.
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#60
by
jcm
on 28 May, 2012 04:26
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Why is it that for almost every launch from China, western analysts say that the satellite has a military purpose, even when Xinhua says that, for example in this case, Chinasat 2A "will be used to meet the demands for China's radio and TV broadcasting and broadband multimedia transmissions."?
So in the West, the headline invariably reads that yet another military satellite was launched for China.
They can't all be military! And who exactly are these western analysts?
- Ed Kyle
Ed - I'm one of them ;-)
Here's the funny thing: if you go to the web page of Chinasat
http://www.chinasatcom.com/en/News_Info.aspx?m=20110329113845577061&n=20110329133705937193they list the satellites they operate, and the ones that are rumored to be really military are - surprise - not on their list.
So I'm pretty comfortable with the conclusion that ZX-22, 20, 22A, 20A, 1A and 2A are not really Chinasats.
It's been a pretty good guide for the former USSR and for China that if they don't talk about it in detail, it's probably military. (Now we can 'look up the answers in the back of the book' for the USSR, seems like the UK amateur BIS/Kettering analysts did a pretty good job in figuring out what was what,) One can also conclude from behaviour and orbit sometimes... pretty clear most of the FSW recoverable satellites were recon.
Of the sats launched this year, ZY-3 and TH-1 are under civil management
, but there's some dual use component there FY-2F is known to be civilian under weather bureau control, I am agnostic about the Beidous - like GPS, it's a dual use system and I don't agree with many other analysts that one has to assume it's mainly military. GPS is a great example of the difficulties of labelling everything as either one or the other - mil vs not-mil.
The Yaogan satellites, however, seem to me to be clearly military. Yaogan seems to be almost comparable to the Soviet Kosmos as a cover name for a wide range of different programs about which little is released - a giveaway. The mix of low orbit imaging, radar and infrared satellites strongly suggest that Yaogan is an operational military/intelligence series.
You are right that one does have to be careful to avoid the general paranoia common in US policy circles that label all Chinese activities with the most aggressive interpretation possible. But I think there's no question that a substantial subset of the Chinese space program involves military/intel objectives and assets. Just as ours does - seems like the Chinese government would be remiss if they did NOT have military intelligence, comms and nav systems for their national defense, although I would hope that both they and we refrain from further testing of space weapons and cut back on ballistic missile deployment and testing.
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#61
by
input~2
on 28 May, 2012 06:30
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"The CZ-3B first stage debris hit homes and interrupted a 10 kV high voltage line, cutting power in villages in Suining county, Hunan province."
(
source)
edit: source in English:Satellite wreckage damages homes
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#62
by
input~2
on 28 May, 2012 07:16
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"The CZ-3B first stage debris hit homes and interrupted a 10 kV high voltage line, cutting power in villages in Suining county, Hunan province."
(source)
The village concerned is ShuangJiang located at N265155E1101746
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#63
by
input~2
on 28 May, 2012 07:49
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A booster fell near Maxi village, Guizhou province (N271731E1080509).
180,000 people had been evacuated.
(
source)
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#64
by
Galactic Penguin SST
on 28 May, 2012 09:20
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#65
by
limen4
on 28 May, 2012 13:59
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Any thoughts, comments (which can be repeated in civilised company, of course!), especially about the MIA Zhongxing 2?
ZX-2 was a satellite launched on 22.12.1988. It had likely nothing to do with ZX-2A or the ST series. Similar there was a ZX-1 launched on 07.03.1988 with no real connection to ZX-1A or the FH series. Seems like some kind of reuse of older designators for military comsats.
Some remarks to the Zhongxing-designations for early China comsats and the military nature of some of the satellites.
The Zhongxing-designations were only introduced in the mid 90s together with the establishment of the China Satcom Enterprise. When Spacenet-1 was leased by China Satcom (as a replacement for the ill fated first DFH-3 satellite) the bird received the designation Zhongxing-5 and it seems logical for western observers that that ZX-1 to ZX-4 corresponds to STTW-2 to STTW-5. But until today this has never been confirmed by China official sources.
Surprisingly one alternative name is known for STTW-4 (launched 1990-02-04) – Shen Jian (神箭) which means “Magic Arrow”. This name was revealed by a souvenir envelope issued by XSLC philatelic society. It seems that this name was a military secret, because the issue of the envelope was stopped immediately and only few envelopes have been available for public.
A similar information “accident” occurred when FH-1 was launched. Again the same philatelic society issued an envelope with a very detailed description (also in English language) about the military nature of FH-1 on the reverse site at first. Due to security objections the issue of the envelope was stopped and the text on the remaining envelopes was overprinted.
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#66
by
input~2
on 28 May, 2012 15:03
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Surprisingly one alternative name is known for STTW-4 (launched 1990-02-04) – Shen Jian (神箭) which means “Magic Arrow”. This name was revealed by a souvenir envelope issued by XSLC philatelic society. It seems that this name was a military secret, because the issue of the envelope was stopped immediately and only few envelopes have been available for public.
Isn't it possible that 箭 in 神箭 refers tho the launcher as in 火箭 rather than to the satellite?
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#67
by
limen4
on 28 May, 2012 18:49
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Surprisingly one alternative name is known for STTW-4 (launched 1990-02-04) – Shen Jian (神箭) which means “Magic Arrow”. This name was revealed by a souvenir envelope issued by XSLC philatelic society. It seems that this name was a military secret, because the issue of the envelope was stopped immediately and only few envelopes have been available for public.
Isn't it possible that 箭 in 神箭 refers tho the launcher as in 火箭 rather than to the satellite?
The reverse site of the envelope. Can you help to translate?
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#68
by
input~2
on 28 May, 2012 20:02
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The reverse site of the envelope. Can you help to translate?
A tentative translation:
Shenjian
In 1990 during the Chinese New Year Festivities, China Xichang Satellite Launch Center successfully launched a geostationary satellite, a seal for this special period to remember
Seal, stamp: Zhang Zhijie, Tong Zhongxie
China Xichang Satellite Launch Center Philatelic Society
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#69
by
input~2
on 29 May, 2012 13:28
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We now have Object B
38353/ 2012-028B in 184.0 x 35807.1 km x 26.69°
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#70
by
input~2
on 29 May, 2012 19:22
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Another booster 's debris were recovered in the same area as the first one
(
source)
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#71
by
input~2
on 31 May, 2012 09:39
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#72
by
input~2
on 06 Jun, 2012 13:25
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#73
by
Liss
on 08 Jun, 2012 21:19
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ZX-2A found at 98.3°E.
: