Author Topic: CCDev to CCiCAP to CCtCAP Discussion Thread  (Read 811334 times)

Offline yg1968

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #160 on: 08/01/2012 02:13 pm »
Assuming that this report/rumor is true, the selection statement would probably say that ATK has won based on business and technical merits. Whether this is true is hard to verify other than through hearsay.
« Last Edit: 08/01/2012 02:19 pm by yg1968 »

Offline mr. mark

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #161 on: 08/01/2012 02:49 pm »
It's possible SpaceX has received a partial or no award at all. If ATK has received a full award, I would suspect that the selection would look like....ATK and Sierra Nevada receiving full awards and SpaceX or Boeing receiving partial. 

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #162 on: 08/01/2012 02:52 pm »
What I do find a bit curious is that before an announcement is made that those higher up are aware of it. Why go through the motion of a decision being made and then risk exposure politically whether it is from the Hill or the WH. That leaves the opening to lay the claim of political interference. In an ideal world Gerst would tell Bolden, who would inform the WH for go, no go… Then a notification would go out of a decision has been made and not the other way around… Curious…
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Offline Wayne Hale

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #163 on: 08/01/2012 04:09 pm »
Hope I'm not the source for Lurio . . .  I'm just guessing.

Online edkyle99

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #164 on: 08/01/2012 04:15 pm »
http://www.parabolicarc.com/2012/07/31/commercial-crew-announcement-this-week/#more-41471
Nice speculation here about the awards: ...
"I had heard from a source during the NewSpace 2012 Conference that NASA’s announcement had been delayed from July because White House officials are not happy with one of the awards. It’s not clear precisely what that means, but speculation has focused on the possibility of ATK receiving an award for its Ares I-derived Liberty system."

Emphasis on speculation

If any of this rumor (the White House meddling part) is true, than whoever loses has grounds for all manner of appeal, not to mention political haymaking during an election year. 

That's why I don't believe this rumor.

  - Ed Kyle
« Last Edit: 08/01/2012 04:21 pm by edkyle99 »

Offline Chris Bergin

Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #165 on: 08/01/2012 04:16 pm »
Hope I'm not the source for Lurio . . .  I'm just guessing.

There's so much floating around, rumors can be sourced from 101 places right now.

I'm not touching this until they go official. Probably the safest approach.
« Last Edit: 08/01/2012 04:17 pm by Chris Bergin »
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Offline yg1968

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #166 on: 08/01/2012 05:11 pm »
http://www.parabolicarc.com/2012/07/31/commercial-crew-announcement-this-week/#more-41471
Nice speculation here about the awards: ...
"I had heard from a source during the NewSpace 2012 Conference that NASA’s announcement had been delayed from July because White House officials are not happy with one of the awards. It’s not clear precisely what that means, but speculation has focused on the possibility of ATK receiving an award for its Ares I-derived Liberty system."

Emphasis on speculation

If any of this rumor (the White House meddling part) is true, than whoever loses has grounds for all manner of appeal, not to mention political haymaking during an election year. 

That's why I don't believe this rumor.

  - Ed Kyle

It didn't say anything about the White House meddling. It just says that the White House is not happy.

Offline Prober

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #167 on: 08/01/2012 05:12 pm »
Gerst is the selecting officer. If he decides that ATK gets full funding, it gets full funding. The White House (or even Bolden for that matter) cannot undo his selections. The only thing that the White House can do about it is delay the announcement or perhaps renegotiate the deal with Wolf to have four providers instead of three.

If NASA has actually chosen ATK, I hope that it is not for political reasons or because it is launching from KSC or because it has commonality with SLS/MPCV. But given NASA's past history, I am not too confident that Gerst decisions will be based solely on business and technical merits as it should be. If that is the case, I can understand the White House being unhappy about one of Gerst's selections.  Gerst must have know how the White House would react ahead of time. The White House doesn't think of the commercial crew program as an SLS/MPCV supplement program. 

I have heard only good things spoken about Gerstenmeier. Any decisions made purely on business and technical merit will probably - over time, at least - be accepted.

Let’s all try and be kind to him.  Have a feeling some will throw the mud all over regarding this civil servant.
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Offline yg1968

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #168 on: 08/01/2012 05:26 pm »
Gerst is accountable for his decisions. If he made his decisions based on business and technical merits, he has nothing to worry about.
« Last Edit: 08/01/2012 05:27 pm by yg1968 »

Offline Prober

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #169 on: 08/01/2012 05:33 pm »
Gerst is accountable for his decisions. If he made his decisions based on business and technical merits, he has nothing to worry about.

I wish that were true.   When media can say 2+2 =5 ,and people believe it; then we have major problems.
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Offline erioladastra

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #170 on: 08/01/2012 05:53 pm »
http://www.parabolicarc.com/2012/07/31/commercial-crew-announcement-this-week/#more-41471
Nice speculation here about the awards: ...
"I had heard from a source during the NewSpace 2012 Conference that NASA’s announcement had been delayed from July because White House officials are not happy with one of the awards. It’s not clear precisely what that means, but speculation has focused on the possibility of ATK receiving an award for its Ares I-derived Liberty system."

Emphasis on speculation

If any of this rumor (the White House meddling part) is true, than whoever loses has grounds for all manner of appeal, not to mention political haymaking during an election year. 

That's why I don't believe this rumor.

  - Ed Kyle

Can't appeal or sue for SAAs, unlike contract awards.  You can complain but it won't get you anywhere.

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #171 on: 08/01/2012 06:10 pm »
Gerst is the selecting officer. If he decides that ATK gets full funding, it gets full funding. The White House (or even Bolden for that matter) cannot undo his selections. The only thing that the White House can do about it is delay the announcement or perhaps renegotiate the deal with Wolf to have four providers instead of three.

If NASA has actually chosen ATK, I hope that it is not for political reasons or because it is launching from KSC or because it has commonality with SLS/MPCV. But given NASA's past history, I am not too confident that Gerst decisions will be based solely on business and technical merits as it should be. If that is the case, I can understand the White House being unhappy about one of Gerst's selections.  Gerst must have know how the White House would react ahead of time. The White House doesn't think of the commercial crew program as an SLS/MPCV supplement program. 

I have heard only good things spoken about Gerstenmeier. Any decisions made purely on business and technical merit will probably - over time, at least - be accepted.

Let’s all try and be kind to him.  Have a feeling some will throw the mud all over regarding this civil servant.

I’ll second that… Gerst works tirelessly and has had difficult decisions to make on his watch. Government rockets have to serve many masters…
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Offline sdsds

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #172 on: 08/01/2012 06:11 pm »
I am not too confident that Gerst decisions will be based solely on business and technical merits as it should be. [...] I always thought of Gerst as a common sense kind of guy.

I am confident Gerstenmeier's decision will be based solely on the appropriate criteria. He is as a common sense kind of guy with unimpeachable ethics.
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Offline rdale

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Offline Lars_J

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #174 on: 08/01/2012 06:34 pm »

Offline kirghizstan

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #175 on: 08/01/2012 06:37 pm »
http://www.nasa.gov/centers/kennedy/news/releases/2012/release-20120801.html

It looks like your friday prediction was a good one, Wayne. :)

surprise surprise, Wayne was right, what it must be like to be right more than not :D

Offline BrightLight

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #176 on: 08/01/2012 06:41 pm »
way to go RDALE!!!

Offline HammerD

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #177 on: 08/01/2012 06:47 pm »
way to go RDALE!!!

Nice call.  I think ATK's Liberty and SpaceX will get full funding!  Not sure about partial...

Offline Orbiter

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Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #178 on: 08/01/2012 06:49 pm »
way to go RDALE!!!

Nice call.  I think ATK's Liberty and SpaceX will get full funding!  Not sure about partial...

I'm calling it with ATK's Liberty & Dream Chaser getting full funding with CST-100 getting the partial.

Orbiter
« Last Edit: 08/01/2012 06:49 pm by Orbiter »
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Offline Chris Bergin

Re: CCDev to CCiCAP Discussion Thread
« Reply #179 on: 08/01/2012 06:52 pm »
I just hope Dream Chaser doesn't miss out.
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