SpaceX COTS Demo 1 Updates

[Jim]

Delta II's usually have solids. You cannot do hot fire tests with solids. Even most EELV launches I can remember had some solids.

Yes you can.  How do you think the shuttle did it?  The Delta IV did it with solids

[yg1968]

That PDF does not seem to be the document you are referring to. Or perhaps I am confused.

(see page 5 of the document -which is page 7 of the PDF, see also the index on page 1 -which is page 3 of the PDF)

Wow... that has to be the most byzantine page reference into a PDF document I have seen - I certainly canot make sense of it  
EDIT: Ok I think I found it. But it is still not very conclusive, since the document is lacking context.

The contract line items have been redacted which makes it hard to read. But page 7 of the PDF is where it mentions that it is an option.

[tobi453]

SpaceX Targets November for Dragon Demo Flight:
http://www.spacenews.com/launch/100922-spacex-targets-november-dragon.html

[douglas100]

Looks like Jim got it right again!

[robertross]

Looks like Jim got it right again!

surprise, surprise 

[sdsds]

On the static fire question, is there the possibility that not all the same people will be sitting in the launch control center who sat in those seats during the previous launch?  Giving newcomers first-hand experience of the count all the way to ignition could be reason enough for a static fire test.  The biggest "software" errors sometimes originate from the other side of the keyboard.

[Antares]

Doubtful.  And, any launch team worth its salt would have done enough sims that they wouldn't need any more practice prior to risking flight hardware.

[dbooker]

Couple questions.
1. Is re-entry/return part of the SpaceX COTS 1 Demo flight?
2. Anyone know if the 1st Dragon test article is still in orbit?  If so anyone know when it is projected to re-enter the atmosphere?

[Jim]

Also, a WDR provides this experience too

[Lars_J]

Couple questions.
1. Is re-entry/return part of the SpaceX COTS 1 Demo flight?

Yes.

2. Anyone know if the 1st Dragon test article is still in orbit?  If so anyone know when it is projected to re-enter the atmosphere?

It is no longer in orbit. According to this WIKI page, re-entry occured "around 0050 GMT on June 27, 2010": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_Spacecraft_Qualification_Unit

[AnalogMan]

1. Is re-entry/return part of the SpaceX COTS 1 Demo flight?

This is what SpaceX put in their document to NASA:

"Demo 1 - Core Functionality Flight.

The first flight of Dragon is intended to demonstrate core functionality, such as on orbit maneuvering, structural integrity, systems functions and entry/descent/landing. Note, the spacecraft will be highly instrumented, with multi-megabit telemetry and video on all missions."

[Salo]

http://www.spacenews.com/launch/100922-spacex-targets-november-dragon.html

WASHINGTON — Hawthorne, Calif.-based Space Exploration Technologies (SpaceX) has shifted a planned Oct. 23 launch of its Falcon 9 rocket and Dragon cargo vessel to November.

    “Our targeted launch date is moving — we’ve submitted a request for November 8th or 9th and are waiting for the range to complete their standard deconfliction work and provide a formal approval,” SpaceX spokeswoman Kirstin Brost said in a Sept. 21 e-mail.

[corrodedNut]

New SpaceRef article:

http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewnews.html?id=1447

New photos, including one of the WDR

[Comga]

New SpaceRef article:
http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewnews.html?id=1447
New photos, including one of the WDR

Nice photos indeed but the article has many errors and silliness.
Comets don't flame.
The delay will "allow SpaceX personal (sic) additional time".  Uh, yeah
At this time all American launch pads are "sea side". SLC-40 is no different.
Falcon 9 isn't really "EELV class", which is no criticism.
Dragon will be berthed, not docked.
We know the author was an "invited" "eye witness", but it's not about him.

But I digress...

The Draco engines are again shown covered with those white caps and not flush to the outer surface.  That is still a curiosity.

The tear-out covers for the parachute shrouds are nearly flush, which is what one would suspect, but what is that other red line near the top?  For the drop test the three shroud lines converged at the top of the Dragon pressurized volume.  This potentially fourth line goes somewhere else, and it is definitely not flush.  Any ideas on this?

Looks like gloving around the Merlin engines.  Have we seen this before?

And this was the first post in five days for a launch in six weeks.  How can there be so little to discuss?

(Removed eroneous overcritical remark)

[Lars_J]

New SpaceRef article:
http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewnews.html?id=1447
New photos, including one of the WDR

The Draco engines are again shown covered with those white caps and not flush to the outer surface.  That is still a curiosity.

It looks like these pictures were taken in the middle of installing external insulation on the service section around the Draco's. (note the partial thin while liner near the heatshield which does not extend all around, only the bottom half, in this image: http://images.spaceref.com/news/2010/IMG_8368_KenKremer.jpg)

I'm guessing the remaining dark areas will receive custom-cut insulation to make everything near flush. This way the Draco covers will become flush with the surface around them. The center of the thrusters also look like a similar material that covers the Shuttle thrusters at launch, which is made to pop out at first thruster usage. Or they are just temporary protective covers.

The tear-out covers for the parachute shrouds are nearly flush, which is what one would suspect, but what is that other red line near the top?  For the drop test the three shroud lines converged at the top of the Dragon pressurized volume.  This potentially fourth line goes somewhere else, and it is definitely not flush.  Any ideas on this?

Could it be drogue-related? Or perhaps some trigger mechanism for releasing the nose cone after 2nd stage ignition?

Looks like gloving around the Merlin engines.  Have we seen this before?

Do you mean the blue covers of the engine nozzle? Or the white insulation material at the engine base? The latter looks a little different that what was seen in the pictures before flight 1, although the pictures may not have been taken at the same stage:
F9 flight 1 base: http://images.spaceref.com/news/2010/oospaceximage001.jpg
F9 flight 2 base: http://images.spaceref.com/news/2010/IMG_8278_KenKremer_.jpg

And this was the first post in five days for a launch in six weeks.  How can there be so little to discuss?

There has been plenty of discussion - just not much to add, until we get pictures or news like this. 

[Comga]

]The tear-out covers for the parachute shrouds are nearly flush, which is what one would suspect, but what is that other red line near the top?  For the drop test the three shroud lines converged at the top of the Dragon pressurized volume.  This potentially fourth line goes somewhere else, and it is definitely not flush.  Any ideas on this?

Could it be drogue-related? Or perhaps some trigger mechanism for releasing the nose cone after 2nd stage ignition?

Looks like gloving around the Merlin engines.  Have we seen this before?

Do you mean the blue covers of the engine nozzle? Or the white insulation material at the engine base? The latter looks a little different that what was seen in the pictures before flight 1, although the pictures may not have been taken at the same stage:
F9 flight 1 base: http://images.spaceref.com/news/2010/oospaceximage001.jpg
F9 flight 2 base: http://images.spaceref.com/news/2010/IMG_8278_KenKremer_.jpg

No, it's not the drogues.  They come out of the middle of the three lines that meet at the top.  And I doubt that it has anything to do with the nosecone.

Yes, I meant the white fabric-like material around the engines above the bells.  It is different from any previous image.

[dunderwood]

STS-133 is not the last Shuttle flight.

It is the last flight of Discovery, which is what the article notes. 

[renclod]

No, it's not the drogues.  They come out of the middle of the three lines that meet at the top. 

I think the drogues (two) come out from left and right. Main parachutes (three) come out of the middle.

The "other red line near the top" which "is definitely not flush" could be a [cable] tray for development flight instrumentation (something that a production Dragon won't have). Who knows.

[spacetraveler]

Falcon 9 isn't really "EELV class", which is no criticism.

The most often flown Atlas V is the 401 config, Falcon 9 has basically the same payload capacity to GTO.

It might not be as scalable as the EELVs yet (no F9H) but I would certainly consider it in their class.

[Ben the Space Brit]

Falcon 9 isn't really "EELV class", which is no criticism.

The most often flown Atlas V is the 401 config, Falcon 9 has basically the same payload capacity to GTO.

It might not be as scalable as the EELVs yet (no F9H) but I would certainly consider it in their class.

FWIW, I agree with Jim that the Falcon-9, in its current form, is a Delta-II-class launch vehicle.  The Raptor upper stage and possibly F-1e core derived LFB boosters might change that but that's off-topic for this thread.