Shuttle Questions Q and A (2)

• #240 by Jim on 01 Aug, 2006 12:45
• the shuttle orbiter, the OMS engines gimbal to put the thrust vector thru the CG.   They are moved to the proper position before each burn.  Don't know if this feature is allowed in Orbiter
  
  PS this isn't an Orbiter Qand A thread.
• #241 by mkirk on 01 Aug, 2006 20:41
• Maybe these two attached diagrams will help illustrate what Jim is saying about the burn vector going through the oribter's cg.
  
  As an example the OMS trim angles for the Deorbit Burn are usually Pitch 0.0, Left Yaw -5.7, Right Yaw +5.7.  These OMS gimbal angles combined with the orbiters attitude during the burn enusre that the desired result is achieved.
  
  OMS burns come in two basic forms, those using targets designed to get the orbiter to a specific spot in space (defined by such parameters as altitude, slope, delta V etc) and targets which are desinged to change the orbital velocity (i.e. add or subtract energy from the current orbit).
  
  Mark Kirkman

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• #242 by elmarko on 02 Aug, 2006 01:54
• Quote

  Jim - 1/8/2006  1:32 PM
  
  the shuttle orbiter, the OMS engines gimbal to put the thrust vector thru the CG.   They are moved to the proper position before each burn.  Don't know if this feature is allowed in Orbiter
  
  PS this isn't an Orbiter Qand A thread.

  
  I am well aware it is not an Orbiter Q and A thread, but I don't see any problem with comparing things if it helps to understand the way the real Orbiter works...
• #243 by zinfab on 02 Aug, 2006 01:59
• I think excluding orbiter questions defines "Shuttle Questions Q and A" a little too narrowly... but that's just me.
• #244 by j2_ on 02 Aug, 2006 02:03
• Mkirk,
  
  The diagrams you posted were really helpful. An illustration of the orbiter's CG explains it all.
  
  Thanks
• #245 by spaceshuttle on 05 Aug, 2006 05:49
• okay, several questions.
  
  1. how many OTV cameras are there total?
  2. how come OTVs 170/070 are used more than OTVs 171/071?
  3. will the shuttles be back on 39a for anymore launches?
  4. where is the launch sound recording system device recorder, whatever, located?
  5. where can i obtain sound recordings of launches without the launch commentary?
  6. does anyone know the coodinates/geographical info on OTVs 071/171 and 070/170
  7. during rollover, the SSMEs look worn, kind of like galvanized steel, but later they'll appear black/charcoal grey with the coolant tubes and the bottom edge sometimes being a vivid silver (see an sts-107 SSME replacement picture vs. the ssme close-up at launch, for example)
  8. anyone know the names of the launch commentators?
• #246 by norm103 on 05 Aug, 2006 06:35
• "6. does anyone know the coodinates/geographical info on OTVs 071/171 and 070/170 "
  
  this may hlep

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• #247 by HKS on 05 Aug, 2006 11:06
• I have a question:
  Most of the shuttle cargo is installed at the pad from the RSS, while the shuttle is standing vertical, but I read that some cargo is installed in the shuttle while it is in the OPF, what kind of cargo is it that needs to be installed in the OPF?
• #248 by Jim on 05 Aug, 2006 14:34
• Quote

  spaceshuttle - 5/8/2006  1:36 AM
  
  okay, several questions.
  
  1. how many OTV cameras are there total?
  2. how come OTVs 170/070 are used more than OTVs 171/071?
  3. will the shuttles be back on 39a for anymore launches?
  4. where is the launch sound recording system device recorder, whatever, located?
  5. where can i obtain sound recordings of launches without the launch commentary?
  6. does anyone know the coodinates/geographical info on OTVs 071/171 and 070/170
  7. during rollover, the SSMEs look worn, kind of like galvanized steel, but later they'll appear black/charcoal grey with the coolant tubes and the bottom edge sometimes being a vivid silver (see an sts-107 SSME replacement picture vs. the ssme close-up at launch, for example)
  8. anyone know the names of the launch commentators?

  
  1.  The previous diagrams should them at the pads, but they are in the VAB, OPF, SSPF, O&C and other KSC facilities.
  2. director's chouce
  3.  Yes, see other threads
  4.  on the incline to the pad
  5.  doubt it
  6.  see diagrams
  7.  Different cameras
  8.  George Diller, Bruce Buckingham,
• #249 by Jim on 05 Aug, 2006 14:38
• Quote

  HKS - 5/8/2006  6:53 AM
  
  I have a question:
  Most of the shuttle cargo is installed at the pad from the RSS, while the shuttle is standing vertical, but I read that some cargo is installed in the shuttle while it is in the OPF, what kind of cargo is it that needs to be installed in the OPF?

  
  
  Not any of the future ISS parts are horizontal
  Historically, Spacelab Modules, SIR,Spacelab pallets and some SPACEHAB module missions, mostly the sortie type payloads
  
  
  
  
• #250 by psloss on 05 Aug, 2006 14:55
• Quote

  spaceshuttle - 5/8/2006  1:36 AM
  
  2. how come OTVs 170/070 are used more than OTVs 171/071?
  

  If you're referring to the TV broadcasts of launch attempts, and in particular "watching" SSME start, then it helps to be familiar with the surface winds on that day.  There's often an Easterly sea breeze (and in the summer, usually) which will tend to push the engine exhaust into the 071/171 camera.  So that's a likely influence on which camera of the two is zoomed in on the engines and which one has a wide shot at the time of ignition.
  
  Edit: looking at some launch video, it may mostly be that the 070/170 position is more likely to have an unobscured view of the engines from start through liftoff, even in a light wind.
  
• #251 by HKS on 05 Aug, 2006 17:30
• Quote

  Jim - 5/8/2006  4:25 PM
  
  

  Quote

  HKS - 5/8/2006  6:53 AM
  
  I have a question:
  Most of the shuttle cargo is installed at the pad from the RSS, while the shuttle is standing vertical, but I read that some cargo is installed in the shuttle while it is in the OPF, what kind of cargo is it that needs to be installed in the OPF?

  
  
  Not any of the future ISS parts are horizontal
  Historically, Spacelab Modules, SIR,Spacelab pallets and some SPACEHAB module missions, mostly the sortie type payloads
  
  

  So the SpaceHab Single Modules (S/HAB-SM) for STS-116 and STS-118 will be installed horizontal?
• #252 by Jim on 05 Aug, 2006 19:58
• I meant the early ones.  Since STS-76, they went vertical.  Have to check on STS-107, it might have gone horizontal
• #253 by STSFan10 on 08 Aug, 2006 15:13
• Logged on to say that I really appreciate these two big Q and A threads. Real eye opener.
• #254 by spaceshuttle on 08 Aug, 2006 20:40
• Quote

  STSFan10 - 8/8/2006  10:00 AM
  
  Logged on to say that I really appreciate these two big Q and A threads. Real eye opener.

  
  heck, i thought insideKSC forums were great. this here is f-ing AWESOME!
• #255 by norm103 on 12 Aug, 2006 05:49
• hey guys why not paint the ET with golw in the dark paint
• #256 by DaveS on 12 Aug, 2006 06:57
• Quote

  Jim - 5/8/2006  9:45 PM
  
  I meant the early ones.  Since STS-76, they went vertical.  Have to check on STS-107, it might have gone horizontal

  Yep. SpaceHAB RDM, FREESTAR and the EDO cryokit were installed into the payload bay while the orbiter was in the OPF.
• #257 by MKremer on 12 Aug, 2006 06:59
• Paint adds weight, plus it doesn't do anything to help the ET foam issues. Might as well sell advertising space on the ET to make some money if that's the case.
• #258 by norm103 on 12 Aug, 2006 08:36
• i ment to see it at night so they cold see form loss at night
• #259 by MKremer on 12 Aug, 2006 09:31
• The brightness from the SSMEs and SRBs would likely overwhelm any attempt to image much fainter specks of paint/foam at night no matter what type of camera was used. Radar would work as well or better than visual imagery at night.