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#160
by
psloss
on 05 Mar, 2010 16:48
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What are the chances that STS-135 will fly?
If KBH;s bill passes it is certain.
No, that would only authorize the money; it doesn't appropriate it or guarantee it's appropriated. 135's chances are going to depend on how much money is appropriated for FY 2011 and how long it takes to fly out the remaining four flights.
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#161
by
Orbiter
on 08 Mar, 2010 16:03
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What are the chances that STS-135 will fly?
If KBH;s bill passes it is certain.
No, that would only authorize the money; it doesn't appropriate it or guarantee it's appropriated. 135's chances are going to depend on how much money is appropriated for FY 2011 and how long it takes to fly out the remaining four flights.
Or if Commercial suffers any massive delay.
Orbiter
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#162
by
psloss
on 09 Mar, 2010 14:27
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No, that would only authorize the money; it doesn't appropriate it or guarantee it's appropriated. 135's chances are going to depend on how much money is appropriated for FY 2011 and how long it takes to fly out the remaining four flights.
Or if Commercial suffers any massive delay.
The problem with that is how much of a consensus there would be of a "massive" delay this year. It might look like that in hindsight, but delay "guesstimates" this year will probably vary quite a bit.
There were questions about the possibility of STS-135 during today's program-level Shuttle/Station briefing. Most of the information has been covered in articles here; the only thing I heard that was new was needing to get some agreement to do it by the June time-frame, to allow for sufficient training. There should be a video available for review at some point today.
Add: John44 has posted links to the briefing video:
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=20702.msg557923#msg557923
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#163
by
Nomadd
on 11 Mar, 2010 01:27
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I might have missed this somewhere, but giving the political backing for the AMS has the possibility of putting it on STS-135 been considered, if it can be ready by then? Seems like it might be a good way to get backing for going ahead with the mission.
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#164
by
Chris Bergin
on 11 Mar, 2010 01:30
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No Nomadd, that has not been considered.
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#165
by
steveS
on 15 Apr, 2010 17:06
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Chris's latest article says that it is not certain whether Atlantis will fly STS -135. One cited reason is that it does not have SSTP for a longer duration flight. Why would STS -135 be planned as a long duration flight ? STS 133 is planned as a 8 day flight while Atlantis with STS 132 is a 12 day flight. Hence, I would assume that STS 135 would be maximum a 10 day flight which Atlantis can accomplish?
As per payload, STS 135 would carry a PMM ? and can any one reply whether Atlantis is not suitable to carry such a payload?
At the post launch conference of STS 131, one reporter asked whether managers favor Discovery compared to the other 2 orbiters when it comes to scheduling flights? I wonder if Atlantis is not selected for STS 135 (if it flies) whether such a thing will also be one of the factors?.
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#166
by
Chris Bergin
on 15 Apr, 2010 17:10
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#167
by
daniela
on 15 Apr, 2010 18:15
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Sure STS-135 can be flown by Atlantis if so is decided. However there are a few considerations.
The STS-133 mission can still fly at the NET date but now has just a few days of slack left; in addition, the workforce is fully working (both regular hours and paid overtime) and there is not much more room. However when Atlantis returns from STS-132, after initial safing, if there is a good chance that the remaining two the manifest dates will hold more or less, it is to be expected that workers are told to focus on these, and tasks are reassigned. A slippage in STS-335 processing (assuming it is chosen to take seriously that LON) is no problem, there is plenty of time. So it is not obvious that flying Atlantis would have andvantages. On the other hand, Discovery is already set up to fly MLPM (SteveS can you elaborate? What is a PMM? You mean a second PLM? I never heard it, but may be you know something I dont) without reconfiguration of the payload bay and Discovery is perhaps in better shape than Atlantis.
Up to now I dont think anyone knows yet how things will be; also, the decommissioning phase has not been outlined, not even loosely.
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#168
by
steveS
on 15 Apr, 2010 18:35
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Sorry for the typo. I meant a second PLM.
I would like to ask why Discovery would be in a better position to fly again just because its payload bay is configured for a PLM? Can Atlantis's payload bay be also configured after returning from STS 132?
More importantly, what exactly would STS -135 carry ? A PLM or another payload?
(SteveS can you elaborate? What is a PMM? You mean a second PLM? I never heard it, but may be you know something I dont) without reconfiguration of the payload bay and Discovery is perhaps in better shape than Atlantis.
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#169
by
daniela
on 15 Apr, 2010 18:44
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Discovery is fine for flight (well, needs something done between flights but will be done), Atlantis not only is not certified for 135 but had had two flights added (as the program with two Orbiters would have its costs skyrocketing even further) despite having the wrapped composite vessels well beyond their design life (and no way of replacing) and other smaller issues.
I have not heard of any planning of the payload of STS-135 but I am certain someone here will be able to comment.
Decision for a STS-135 (or at least, making NASA aware that it is been considered seriously and to take that into account) does not have to be immediate but it would be very helpful if it happened rather quickly.
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#170
by
Jorge
on 15 Apr, 2010 18:58
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Sorry for the typo. I meant a second PLM.
I would like to ask why Discovery would be in a better position to fly again just because its payload bay is configured for a PLM? Can Atlantis's payload bay be also configured after returning from STS 132?
More importantly, what exactly would STS -135 carry ? A PLM or another payload?
(SteveS can you elaborate? What is a PMM? You mean a second PLM? I never heard it, but may be you know something I dont) without reconfiguration of the payload bay and Discovery is perhaps in better shape than Atlantis.
No, you were correct. The acronym is PMM, not PLM.
There are no plans to convert a second MPLM into a PMM.
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#171
by
psloss
on 15 Apr, 2010 20:34
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Can Atlantis's payload bay be also configured after returning from STS 132?
Yes, and Atlantis will have to be configured to fly Raffaello, as that's the payload for STS-335. What Atlantis lacks is the SSPTS capability. Atlantis will be ready to fly sooner than Discovery, but IF additional time were provided (by providing additional budget) to wait for one of the SSPTS orbiters to be readied, that could be traded with the other factors.
Most likely payload for STS-135 would be Raffaello.
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#172
by
daniela
on 15 Apr, 2010 20:51
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It's hard to evaluate before touchdown of Atlantis. As far as we know, it may even have to land in White Sands, and STS-133 may be on time. In the scenario Atlantis flies STS-135, it'll be certified, but of course there will be some work and some paperwork to do. Also, there would be interaction with the decommissioning activities, but the decommissioning plan is not worked out so far.
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#173
by
psloss
on 15 Apr, 2010 21:01
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It's hard to evaluate before touchdown of Atlantis. As far as we know, it may even have to land in White Sands, and STS-133 may be on time. In the scenario Atlantis flies STS-135, it'll be certified, but of course there will be some work and some paperwork to do. Also, there would be interaction with the decommissioning activities, but the decommissioning plan is not worked out so far.
No, it's already evaluated and the plan is for Atlantis to fly STS-335. What-ifs can cause the plan to change, but those would apply equally to any flight.
It's already been stated that decommissioning will not begin in earnest until after the last flight.
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#174
by
daniela
on 15 Apr, 2010 21:10
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STS-335 of course if it's flown (required + given the goahead) will be flown by Atlantis, except from major malfunctions. If I understand correctly the thread was discussing the possibility that - after STS-133 lands successfully - a further mission, not a LON, is launched. As far as I understand this option will be protected as long as possible (who knows if critical ORUs may fail?) but at present is not favored; however it's possible that in the next few weeks its chances will improve.
Yes of course decommission will not start until the program is completed, but even planning has been deferred. (I agree with the choice, by the way, but decommissioning, in its due time and not earlier, should not be neglected, especially because of the potential of less qualified and less experiences workforce - may be even demotivated workforce - and it's a dangerous job.)
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#175
by
Ben E
on 15 Apr, 2010 23:09
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Out of interest, with the exception of the 132/134/133 crews, are any other astronauts involved in Shuttle simulator training at present? If so, might they be candidates for a potential 135...or would it be more likely to fly a more recently-flown CDR/PLT team, plus whichever two MS are dropped from 133?
Based on that thinking, would it be realistic to suppose a 135 line-up something like this: Poindexter (CDR), Dutton (PLT), Barratt (MS) and Stott (MS)?
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#176
by
steveS
on 16 Apr, 2010 01:36
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Atlantis not only is not certified for 135 but had had two flights added (as the program with two Orbiters would have its costs skyrocketing even further) despite having the wrapped composite vessels well beyond their design life (and no way of replacing) and other smaller issues.
Then why it has been selected for the LON of STS 133? I thought that it has been certified for the LON mission. If it has been, does it have to be re certified separately for a potential STS 135?
Also can anyone give some background information as to why Atlantis was not fitted with SSTP during her last OMDP? while the other 2 orbiters were fitted with SSTPs.
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#177
by
daniela
on 16 Apr, 2010 02:17
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Yes, Atlantis is certified for the LON, while I think for STS-135 additional paperwork (and I'm not sure what work exactly) needs to be done. (Also Discovery would need something done if it flied 135, but it's no big impact to the processing flow).
For STS-335 Atlantis is the natural choice, as Discovery is on orbit and Endeavour would be able to start being processed later, not to mention possible impacts if STS-134 is delayed for whatever reason.
I would think Atlantis was not fitted with SSTP because the program has been winding down and in fact Atlantis was supposed to have already been retired, this is just speculation on my part though.
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#178
by
Jorge
on 16 Apr, 2010 02:47
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Atlantis not only is not certified for 135 but had had two flights added (as the program with two Orbiters would have its costs skyrocketing even further) despite having the wrapped composite vessels well beyond their design life (and no way of replacing) and other smaller issues.
Then why it has been selected for the LON of STS 133? I thought that it has been certified for the LON mission. If it has been, does it have to be re certified separately for a potential STS 135?
Also can anyone give some background information as to why Atlantis was not fitted with SSTP during her last OMDP? while the other 2 orbiters were fitted with SSTPs.
Originally Atlantis was going to be retired after 125, and that decision was not reversed until it was far enough into OMDP to add SSPTS.
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#179
by
Jorge
on 16 Apr, 2010 02:49
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Out of interest, with the exception of the 132/134/133 crews, are any other astronauts involved in Shuttle simulator training at present?
No. There is no generic shuttle training involving astronauts at all. As of STS-131, the remaining generic integrated shuttle orbit sims will be crewed by MOD volunteers.