Virgin Galactic and SpaceShipTwo Master Thread (1)

[iamlucky13]

In other words, climbing Mount Everest is an admirable personal achievement which says a lot of great things about the achiever.

Buying a ticket so someone can fly you to 100 km is not a great personal achievement, any more than buying a ticket to the top of Mount Everest would be.

I have no idea whether Virgin's or XCOR's business cases close or not, but the Everest analogy needs to be put to bed.

I chose it as one of many possible examples of people spending large quantities of money recreationally. There's many similarities and many differences, such as your fair point about the greater sense of personal achievement from climbing Everest or my point about the far higher number of people who are physically able to play space tourist. I don't claim it proves anything other than a surprisingly large numbers of people have a lot of money to spend on things most other people wouldn't.

I could similarly have compared how many thousands of cars with six-figure price tags sell in the US each year, or how many hundreds of multi-million dollar private jets and boats sell. Or I suppose there might be statistics to be dug up on how many super-expensive weddings or other parties happen each year.

Or I could just stick with looking at income distribution. Did you know that in the US alone, there are over 84,000 people for whom the price of a ticket would be a month's income or less? (source).

Again, I don't claim this proves anything, but when you learn how much disposable income is actually out there, Virgin Galactic's business model sounds progressively less insane (I say that as a person who originally thought Branson was off his rocker).

The recent discussions we've been having on this thread have been very general and do not include any VG updates. However, I cannot see another suitable thread and I'm hesitating on creating a new one. Here are some of my ideas for a new thread:
- Virgin Galactic: General discussion

 - Virgin Galactic/Scaled Composites: General discussion

 - Commercial suborbital flight: General discussion

Anybody else think this is a good idea? Any preferences as to the thread title?

Cheers

I think the second choice has a suitable scope.

[yg1968]

December 12th update:
http://video.msnbc.msn.com/msnbc.com/45603410 

[yg1968]

This may have been linked already in the Stratolaunch thread but it is worth linking here too:
http://www.virgingalactic.com/news/item/virgin-galactic-welcomes-announcement-of-new-air-launched-space-system-as-foundation-for-commerci/

I hope that in due course, in partnership with Stratolaunch and others, we [Virgin Galactic] will be able to repeat the pattern that has worked so spectacularly well in the suborbital sphere, for orbital spaceflight.”

[go4mars]

I hope that in due course, in partnership with Stratolaunch and others, we [Virgin Galactic] will be able to repeat the pattern that has worked so spectacularly well in the suborbital sphere, for orbital spaceflight.”

I truly wonder how long this has been brewing and if/how Virgin and Stratolaunch have a relationship. 

I talked for a while with George Whitesides in 2008 and even then he was talking in vague terms about Virgin's orbital plans.  At the time I was hopeful but fairly dismissive. 

[Robert Thompson]

http://archived.thespaceshow.com/shows/1669-BWB-2011-12-09.mp3

At around one third, discussion of drop test.

[Garrett]

I created a new VG general discussion thread:
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=27684.0
to encourage using this thread for updates only.

(thanks to user ChrisC for advising me to put a link here)

Cheers,
Garrett

[Danderman]

Virgin Galactic selects NanoRacks to conduct suborbital research aboard SpaceShipTwo

http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewpr.html?pid=36230

MOJAVE, Calif. - (Feb. 27, 2012) Virgin Galactic LLC, the world's first commercial spaceline, announced today that it has selected NanoRacks LLC to construct a rack system to allow research payloads to fly to space aboard Virgin Galactic's SpaceShipTwo (SS2). With these new racks, SS2 will allow researchers to conduct experiments during several minutes of microgravity using a mounting system also employed on the International Space Station (ISS).

By providing routine access for research payloads to suborbital space, Virgin Galactic will expand current research capabilities beyond existing reduced gravity platforms such as drop towers and parabolic flights. SS2's large capacity allows as much as 1,300 pounds (600 kg) of payloads per flight. Additionally, some flights may also include researchers themselves, able to interact with their experiments in real time.

"Virgin Galactic's mission is to revolutionize access to space and NanoRacks' experience placing research payloads on other spacecraft will help us ensure that our vehicle has a simple and effective platform for researchers. The safety, flexibility, capacity and modularity of our new racks will make it easier for researchers to conduct cutting-edge experiments aboard our space vehicles," said George Whitesides, CEO and President of Virgin Galactic. "Reusable suborbital space vehicles will offer a new platform for scientific researchers and technologists. Making this announcement at the Next-Generation Suborbital Researchers Conference is ideal, as this conference is a powerful demonstration of the research community's interest in vehicles like SpaceShipTwo."

[Robotbeat]

Nice!

[Garrett]

From their Payload Users' Guide:

Exposure to 3-5 minutes of high quality microgravity per flight aboard SS2

I wonder if the microgravity phase (i.e. weightlessness), whether it be for passengers or payloads, will be closer to the 3 minute mark or the 5 minute mark?
If it's the former, then to me it seems like it'll be difficult to have the time to unbuckle and float around.

[Danderman]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/alexknapp/2012/02/27/virgin-galactic-and-nanoracks-team-up-to-conquer-space-science/

Virgin Galactic And NanoRacks Team Up To Conquer Space Science

"Virgin Galactic has announced that it’s signed a deal with NanoRacks, a company that’s developed modular lab equipment that standardizes research payloads for the International Space Station. The deal provides that NanoRacks will developed standardized laboratory racks for Virgin’s sub-orbital flyer SpaceShip Two. By developing standardized research payloads, Virgin will make it much easier for its customers’ scientific researchers to make use of the spaceship for microgravity experiments."

"Virgin estimates that each flight of SpaceShip Two can hold 1,300 pounds of scientific payload, and the rack setup will include window access for the collection of spectrographic and other data. The racks will also be designed so that some non-standardized scientific payloads can be utilized in addition to the standardized payloads."

[Garrett]

Virgin Galactic aims to test fly ship in space this year
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/02/28/us-space-business-idUSTRE81R04Z20120228

Virgin Galactic, an offshoot of Richard Branson's Virgin Group, expects to test fly its first spacecraft beyond the Earth's atmosphere this year, with commercial suborbital passenger service to follow in 2013 or 2014, company officials said on Monday.
...
"We hope to have the rocket motor in the spaceship later this year and start powered flight testing," Virgin Galactic chief test pilot David Mackay told the conference.
...
We flow pretty quickly from first powered flight to first flight to space and then it's not terribly long from there until we have our first commercial flight to space," Pomerantz told reporters later.
He said passenger service could begin in 2013 or 2014, depending on the results of the test flights and other factors, such as pilot training.

Even though nothing is really new in this, there are two things I noticed:
 - Mackay points to having the rocket motor in place later this year, which is less specific than VG's previous talk about having it in place later this summer.
 - there's confirmation that they expect only a short interval between the first powered flight and the first flights to space.

[Robotbeat]

...
 - there's confirmation that they expect only a short interval between the first powered flight and the first flights to space.

Makes a lot of sense. After all, even SpaceShipOne had only 6 months between first powered flight and going to space (and only 2 months between the second powered flight and space).

[Danderman]

Seamless NanoRacks Coming To SpaceShipTwo

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_channel.jsp?channel=space&id=news/asd/2012/02/29/06.xml&headline=Seamless%20NanoRacks%20Coming%20To%20SpaceShipTwo

Virgin Galactic will be able to offer the potential of a “seamless” transition for scientists doing long-term microgravity experiments on the International Space Station and short-term suborbital flights aboard Virgin Galactic’s SpaceShipTwo under an agreement with NanoRacks.

The accord, outlined Feb. 27 at the 2012 Next Generation Research Conference here, will offer researchers the option to have a researcher fly with their experiment or for it to be fully automated, says Virgin Galactic Vice President William Pomerantz, head of special projects.

The racks will share the same size and interface characteristics as Mid-Deck racks on the space station to ease planning requirements for researchers.

NanoRacks has modified the space shuttle mid-deck racks to retain the same capacity for Virgin Galactic while reducing weight to make them appropriate for suborbital flights, says Senior Vice President/Business Development Rich Pournelle.

The company has accumulated more than 30 customers, some with multiyear deals, since it was formed two years ago. It has a backlog of more than 60 racks, he says.

[yg1968]

Playboy and Virgin Galactic future plans for a space station:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/02/27/playboy-club-virgin-galactic_n_1304381.html

[docmordrid]

Wonder if I could get a discounted membership due to being a former Key Card holder? Hmmmmm....

[Chris Bergin]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

 

March 5, 2012

 

The Spaceship Company announces qualified aerostructure suppliers to build Virgin Galactic spaceships

 

MOJAVE, Calif. ― The Spaceship Company (TSC), the aerospace production joint venture of Sir Richard Branson’s Virgin Galactic and Scaled Composites, continues to make strides in making commercial space travel a reality with the qualification of three primary aerostructure suppliers. Each approved company is now officially qualified to fabricate structural composite components for the WhiteKnightTwo and SpaceShipTwo space tourism vehicles.

 

TSC’s qualified primary aerospace structure suppliers include:

 

Applied Aerospace Structures Corp (AASC)
3437 South Airport Way
Stockton, CA 95206

 

GFMI Aerospace & Defense
17375 Mount Herrmann St.
Fountain Valley, CA 92708

 

Triumph Aerospace Systems – Wichita

9323 E 34th Street N

Wichita, KS 67226-2621

 

This designation has been awarded to these three companies in recognition of their demonstrated ability to meet or exceed the requirements of TSC Qualification Process TSCP-740. This process determines a supplier’s commitment to fabrication excellence and quality through a facilities survey, examination of each company’s quality management system and a thorough evaluation of representative structure fabricated by their teams.

 

“Our goal is to produce the highest quality and safest commercial spaceflight systems and these well-qualified suppliers will help us achieve that goal,” said Enrico Palermo, Vice President of Operations for The Spaceship Company.

 

TSC’s Director of Supply Chain Bob Marks says that a request for quote package for the first outsourced structures is currently being prepared for release.

 

“On behalf of everyone here at The Spaceship Company, I personally welcome AASC, GFMI Aerospace and Defense, and Triumph Aerospace systems to TSC and look forward to working together to bring access to space within everyone’s reach,” said Marks.

 

 

 

About The Spaceship Company

Headquartered at Mojave Air and Space Port, The Spaceship Company is the aerospace production company, founded by Sir Richard Branson’s Virgin Galactic and Scaled Composites, which is building the world’s first fleet of commercial spaceships (SpaceShipTwos) and carrier aircraft (WhiteKnightTwos) intended to make regular, commercial, manned space travel a reality.

 

About Virgin Galactic

Virgin Galactic, owned by Sir Richard Branson’s Virgin Group and Aabar Investments PJS, is on track to be the world’s first commercial spaceline. The new spaceship (SpaceshipTwo, VSS Enterprise) and carrier aircraft (WhiteKnightTwo, VMS Eve) have both been developed for Virgin Galactic by Mojave-based Scaled Composites. Founded by Burt Rutan, Scaled developed SpaceShipOne, which in 2004 claimed the $10m Ansari X Prize as the world’s first privately developed manned spacecraft. Virgin Galactic’s new vehicles share much of the same basic design, but are being built to carry six customers on sub-orbital space flights, allowing an out-of-the-seat, zero-gravity experience and offering astounding views of the planet from the black sky of space. The VSS Enterprise and VMS Eve test flight program is well under way, leading to Virgin Galactic commercial operations, which will be based at Spaceport America in New Mexico.

 

About Scaled Composites

Founded in 1982, Scaled Composites specializes in the design, fabrication and flight testing of prototype aircraft and spacecraft from composite materials. Scaled is a project-oriented company that offers services within a concept-to-completion environment. Our services include conceptual design, aerodynamic and structural analysis and design, tooling, fabrication, structural testing, flight testing and simulation

[Zond]

Draft Environmental Assessment for the Launch and Reentry of SpaceShipTwo Reusable Suborbital Rockets at the Mojave Air and Space Port

[Garrett]

Ashton Kutcher set for space trip
http://www.sen.com/dailynews/20032012.html

Excerpts:
Ashton Kutcher has signed up for a trip into space with Virgin Galactic. Kutcher is the 500th person to sign up with the commercial spaceline.
...
Kutcher will share his journey to space with five other astronauts ...
...
...the spaceline hopes to complete the first powered test flight to space by the end of 2012.

500 people times a ticket price of $200,000 = $100 million
That's a lot of money that will be pumped into the space industry.

[Herb Schaltegger]

Ashton Kutcher set for space trip
http://www.sen.com/dailynews/20032012.html

Excerpts:
Ashton Kutcher has signed up for a trip into space with Virgin Galactic. Kutcher is the 500th person to sign up with the commercial spaceline.
...
Kutcher will share his journey to space with five other astronauts ...
...
...the spaceline hopes to complete the first powered test flight to space by the end of 2012.

500 people times a ticket price of $200,000 = $100 million
That's a lot of money that will be pumped into the space industry.

That's less than the price of one commercial comsat launch to GSO.

[Danderman]

500 people times a ticket price of $200,000 = $100 million
That's a lot of money that will be pumped into the space industry.

Yet there are analysts who think that we need to find some "killer app" for space development. Hmmmm..