XCOR and the Lynx rocket

[tegla]

The also mention LOX/Alcohol, when I'm pretty sure the Lynx is LOX/Kero.

~Jon

The video shows Jeff himself saying LOX+alcohol (at 3:46). The machine he's pointing to doesn't look like the Lynx, though.

[Jason1701]

The also mention LOX/Alcohol, when I'm pretty sure the Lynx is LOX/Kero.

~Jon

The video shows Jeff himself saying LOX+alcohol (at 3:46). The machine he's pointing to doesn't look like the Lynx, though.

This settles it:
http://www.xcor.com/products/engines/5K18_LOX-kerosene_rocket_engine.html

[jongoff]

The also mention LOX/Alcohol, when I'm pretty sure the Lynx is LOX/Kero.

~Jon

The video shows Jeff himself saying LOX+alcohol (at 3:46). The machine he's pointing to doesn't look like the Lynx, though.

This settles it:
http://www.xcor.com/products/engines/5K18_LOX-kerosene_rocket_engine.html

Yeah, I've seen the engine hardware from a few feet away (back when I was still down in Mojave), and had seen videos of firings.

~Jon

[Spiff]

It seems the photographers are more interested in the model than in the model.

The best way to tell a lynx from a cougar is the ears.  It's rare for both to be in the same place within their native habitat at the same time.  Fortuitous happenstance. 

Seriously though, that Lynx would be a fun ride!  Reminds me a bit of the tiny James Bond jet (some Roger Moore one).  I can hardly wait to see what XCOR has on the drawing board for eventual orbital flights. 

The model btw (the girl, not the spacecraft ) might be dutch fashion model Doutzen Kroes who is an ambassador for space experience curacao. Although it's hard to say looking at that picture.
Another ambassador is world famous DJ Armin van Buuren who is supposedly going to compose music to go along with the ride.
Others are listed here

All this is useless trivia of course.

[mlorrey]

Mike, can you provide some examples of supersonic aircraft that went from first flight to operational service within a year? None come to mind. Even if there were some I doubt XCOR would want to use them as a model to emulate.

Pretty much everything built before the 1970's did.

You are very much mistaken on this point.

This depends on whether you count all models of a given type as one model (i.e. If you count the F-102 and YF-102A as the same plane, which it wasnt), and whether you count company flight testing or both company flight testing and air force flight testing.

[Jim Davis]

This depends on whether you count all models of a given type as one model (i.e. If you count the F-102 and YF-102A as the same plane, which it wasnt)...

<chuckle>

Yes, when flight testing reveals the necessity for a complete redesign it does tend to push back the service entry date.

...and whether you count company flight testing or both company flight testing and air force flight testing.

<chuckle again>

Of course. In the 1950s it was standard procedure to do a lot of unnecessary flight testing to delay service entry.

[mlorrey]

http://nsrc.swri.org/

Register to win a free flight on XCOR's Lynx vehicle...

[Robotbeat]

http://nsrc.swri.org/

Register to win a free flight on XCOR's Lynx vehicle...

Have to pay to register in order to be entered in the contest... Oh well!

[Comga]

http://nsrc.swri.org/

Register to win a free flight on XCOR's Lynx vehicle...

Have to pay to register in order to be entered in the contest... Oh well!

Does this not constitute a raffle with a $95K prize and a several hundred dollar ticket?
Second place prize is entry to the conference.  Number of secondary prizes equals the number of entries.

[mlorrey]

http://nsrc.swri.org/

Register to win a free flight on XCOR's Lynx vehicle...

Have to pay to register in order to be entered in the contest... Oh well!

Does this not constitute a raffle with a $95K prize and a several hundred dollar ticket?
Second place prize is entry to the conference.  Number of secondary prizes equals the number of entries.

The registration is for a conference, the ride ticket is a door prize.

[Comga]

http://nsrc.swri.org/

Register to win a free flight on XCOR's Lynx vehicle...

Have to pay to register in order to be entered in the contest... Oh well!

Does this not constitute a raffle with a $95K prize and a several hundred dollar ticket?
Second place prize is entry to the conference.  Number of secondary prizes equals the number of entries.

The registration is for a conference, the ride ticket is a door prize.

Don't be daft.  Of course that's what it is.  The question is both appearance and legalities.  Let's leave it at that.

[NotGncDude]

Jim, the fact that XCOR can do four flights a day with Lynx if need be means  explicitly that they can conduct a flight test program at LEAST four times faster than Scaled can...

Mike, can you provide some examples of supersonic aircraft that went from first flight to operational service within a year? None come to mind. Even if there were some I doubt XCOR would want to use them as a model to emulate.

And even if one came close, it was probably an experienced outfit that had developed many many aircraft before from scratch.

[baldusi]

Xcor reveals Lynx test schedule

Spacecraft designer Xcor has revealed details of a plan to achieve first flight of the Lynx Mk1 later this year and to expand the suborbital market far beyond space tourism.

First flight for the Lynx already has been delayed by two years after XCor discovered a deep stall problem with the original Lynx design. That issue has now been overcome through design changes to the wing, allowing Xcor to begin final assembly within a few weeks.

The first major piece of structure - the fuselage of the Mk1 version -- will be delivered to Xcor the week of 16 January, said Andrew Nelson, chief operating officer and vice president of business development.

Next month, Xcor will tender work packages for building the cockpit pressure vessel and strakes in February, with delivery of the two subassemblies scheduled in April in May, said Khaki Rodway McKee, the Xcor programme manager.

Roll-out of the Mk1 is scheduled in July or August from Xcor's hangar in Mojave, California, she said.

Taxi tests are scheduled to begin in October or November, which will be quickly followed by a short hop and finally a brief first flight by the end of the year.

The Lynx Mk1 design will be limited to flight tests. For commercial operations, Xcor will roll-out a Mk2 version about nine months later with two major changes. The Mk2 aeroshell will be made with different material that is easier to maintain in the field. Secondly, the metallic liquid oxygen fuel tanks on the Mk1 will be replaced by a non-flammable composite material, McKee said.

Finally, a Mk3 version of the Lynx is still being designed. It will introduce a 3.4m-long, circular payload pay mounted on top of the fuselage. The added feature will allow the Lynx to launch satellites weighing up to 650kg into low-earth orbit.

Xcor has discovered the Mk3 will require more extensive design changes than first thought. The landing gear must be strengthened and aerodynamic effects may drive the designers to make tweaks to the outer mould line, Nelson said.

As first flight approaches, Xcor also has released a detailed market projection for its new product. Company officials are seeking to break the popular notion that suborbital spaceflight is aimed solely at the space tourism market.

Tourism will account for less than 10% of the roughly $6 billion "addressable market" Xcor anticipates for the Lynx by 2015, when the company envisions a growing fleet launching into space several times a day.

Another $1.1 billion in yearly sales is projected for launching payloads, as well as $1.4 billion in revenue for launching small satellites. Xcor also projects a $2.8 billion market for vehicle and equipment sales to third parties, including the possibility of selling the rocket engine to the United Launch Alliance as a replacement for the Pratt & Whitney RL10.

[Robotbeat]

The talk of selling Lynx's engine to ULA seems to imply that one of the Lynxes (Mk 3?) will use hydrogen/LOx. Alternatively, the $6 billion "addressable market" refers to XCor as a whole, not just Lynx.

EDIT:One thing I really like about XCor is that they really get "design for operations." They're targeting really, really often flights with very little maintenance between flights (they have a few patents on rocket engines made for many, many firings between maintenance and their commitment to not operationally field a Lynx which can't be maintained easily seems very prudent, especially since they seem to be trying to sell/lease a lot of Lynxes to third parties). The hydrogen work plays well into their long-term plans for an orbital RLV.

[baldusi]

For me, the interesting part is the MkIII version. Form XCOR site they quoted as:

Total payload capacity for the external dorsal pod is 650kg

So stating now that they could launch 650kg satellites (Falcon 1 could do 670kg), is sort of misleading. But it would be very interesting if they could 640kg upper stage that could put a 10kg satellite. If they could do this for 100k that would be a real breakthrough for small satellite manufacturers.

[RanulfC]

The talk of selling Lynx's engine to ULA seems to imply that one of the Lynxes (Mk 3?) will use hydrogen/LOx. Alternatively, the $6 billion "addressable market" refers to XCor as a whole, not just Lynx.

Uhm that might be jumping to a conclusion, don't forget they have done a LOT of work on LOX/Methane which opperationally may be a better deal than LH2.

Randy

[Robotbeat]

The talk of selling Lynx's engine to ULA seems to imply that one of the Lynxes (Mk 3?) will use hydrogen/LOx. Alternatively, the $6 billion "addressable market" refers to XCor as a whole, not just Lynx.

Uhm that might be jumping to a conclusion, don't forget they have done a LOT of work on LOX/Methane which opperationally may be a better deal than LH2.

Randy

Prior talk of cooperation between XCor and ULA was on the topic of XCor building a pump-fed hydrolox engine for ULA of about the RL-10 thrust class. Sure, they've done methane work, but I find it unlikely that ULA would be nearly as interested in that since its Isp is much, much less than hydrogen (methane's Isp is a lot closer to kerosene's Isp) and thus would do poorly for the typical, profitable high energy trajectories that launch providers often make their bread and butter on. Switching to a different propellant class for the upper stage would greatly affect the design of the EELVs.

[docmordrid]

For me, the interesting part is the MkIII version. Form XCOR site they quoted as:

Total payload capacity for the external dorsal pod is 650kg

So stating now that they could launch 650kg satellites (Falcon 1 could do 670kg), is sort of misleading. But it would be very interesting if they could 640kg upper stage that could put a 10kg satellite. If they could do this for 100k that would be a real breakthrough for small satellite manufacturers.

Payload in the pod doesn't need to he a launcher - they have a deal with the Planetary Science Institute to fly the Atsa Suborbital Observatory.

http://www.xcor.com/press-releases/2011/11-07-12_Planetary_Science_Institute_selects_XCOR_for_Atsa.html

[baldusi]

For me, the interesting part is the MkIII version. Form XCOR site they quoted as:

Total payload capacity for the external dorsal pod is 650kg

So stating now that they could launch 650kg satellites (Falcon 1 could do 670kg), is sort of misleading. But it would be very interesting if they could 640kg upper stage that could put a 10kg satellite. If they could do this for 100k that would be a real breakthrough for small satellite manufacturers.

Payload in the pod doesn't need to he a launcher - they have a deal with the Planetary Science Institute to fly the Atsa Suborbital Observatory.

http://www.xcor.com/press-releases/2011/11-07-12_Planetary_Science_Institute_selects_XCOR_for_Atsa.html

But in the updated schedule they stated 650kg satellite. I think that those 4.6min of microgravity might be great for lots of researchers. And the possibility of doing above atmosphere observation is also very useful. I'm sure they will find more uses, too.

[QuantumG]

But in the updated schedule they stated 650kg satellite.

Flightglobal are obviously wrong.. it wouldn't be the first time.

Proof: http://xcor.com/images/vehicles/lynx/PUG-overview_MK-II_v02-bigtext.jpg last modified: 11 August 2011