Shuttle Q&A Part 5

• #360 by brettreds2k on 07 Aug, 2009 14:47
• LOL, I know that, But I was wondering if its coated extra there or something so the heat doesnt scortch through
• #361 by Aobrien on 07 Aug, 2009 16:30
• Hey I have a question about the OBSS Inspection. As far as I know the OBSS inspection does not inspect the belly. It only inspects the RCC and nose and the OMS pods. Am I mistaken. The OBSS video on L2 shows only that but there is a diagram i saw from somebody that showed them scanning like the whole belly. Is there a video like the one on L2 that I can show somebody on the SSM forum. Thanks
  
  Here is the pic.

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• #362 by Jim on 07 Aug, 2009 17:27
• Quote from: brettreds2k on 07 Aug, 2009 14:47

  LOL, I know that, But I was wondering if its coated extra there or something so the heat doesnt scortch through
  

  
  Just the appropriate thickness of foam.  It works both ways, it ablates and insulates.
• #363 by ChrisGebhardt on 07 Aug, 2009 17:34
• Quote from: Spaceboy7441 on 07 Aug, 2009 16:30

  Hey I have a question about the OBSS Inspection. As far as I know the OBSS inspection does not inspect the belly. It only inspects the RCC and nose and the OMS pods. Am I mistaken. The OBSS video on L2 shows only that but there is a diagram i saw from somebody that showed them scanning like the whole belly. Is there a video like the one on L2 that I can show somebody on the SSM forum. Thanks
  
  Here is the pic.
  

  
  You are mistaken.  For ISS flights, the OBSS only looks at the RCC WLE and Nose Cap. But for STS-125 -- which is the image you posted -- they didn't have the ability to do the RPM at the ISS so they used the OBSS to thoroughly scan the Orbiter's underbelly. 
  
  Check the L2 section on 125. There are many, many, many presentations there.  Also, refer to the multitude of articles published before 125 in July/August/September 2008 and March/April/May 2009.  They should be sufficient.  Other than that, search videos for "125."
• #364 by ChrisGebhardt on 07 Aug, 2009 17:46
• Quote from: LMSenus on 07 Aug, 2009 13:58

  Please forgive me if this has been asked before, but what is the protocol for flying the shuttle flags?  Are the flags flown only when the shuttle is on orbit, or once the stack is rolled out?
  

  
  Are you taking about these flags?
  
  If so, then they are flown when the specific vehicle they represent is at the pad or on orbit.

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• #365 by Aobrien on 07 Aug, 2009 17:48
• Thanks Chris. That is actually exactly what I thought. What it is is on SSM-2007 it has you put the end of the arm under the belly for a short inspection.(Full inspection not yet here)  and I was telling them on the forum that I didn't think it was right.So I was actually correct because I f I understand you than all flights carrying the OBSS except for STS-125 don't scan the under belly. Let me know Thanks!
• #366 by smith5se on 07 Aug, 2009 18:26
• Just an off question from the most recent NSF article... IF there is a roll back, what happens to the payload, taken out of the shuttle of course but does the canister come back out to get it, or does it sit at the RSS (hopefully not during hurricane season)? If so, doesn't this pose a higher risk of getting the payload "dirty" (not sure if contamination is the correct term)?
  
  Second question, I googled the payload room at the RSS and I noticed in pictures everyone is in full protective garb but THEY AREN'T wearing gloves!!! Why? (I would post pictures but I'm at work atm and they frown upon us saving pictures)
• #367 by Jim on 07 Aug, 2009 18:40
• Quote from: smith5se on 07 Aug, 2009 18:26

  IF there is a roll back, what happens to the payload, taken out of the shuttle of course
  
  1.   but does the canister come back out to get it, or
  
  2.  does it sit at the RSS (hopefully not during hurricane season)?
  
  3.    If so, doesn't this pose a higher risk of getting the payload "dirty" (not sure if contamination is the correct term)?
  
  4.  Second question, I googled the payload room at the RSS and I noticed in pictures everyone is in full protective garb but THEY AREN'T wearing gloves!!! Why? (I would post pictures but I'm at work atm and they frown upon us saving pictures)
  

  
  1.  That is an option
  
  2.  can do that too.  It depends on a lot of factors.
  
  3.  no more than any other facility
  
  4.  They aren't touching the payload so no need for gloves.  Also not a payloads have the same sensitivity to contamination.  Especially, ISS payloads, they aren't like spacecraft with optical surfaces.
• #368 by smith5se on 07 Aug, 2009 18:52
• Thanks for the answers Jim... if you don't mind a few more silly questions; how do they determine which option to do? You mentioned it depends on a lot of factors, is the type of payload one of them?
  
  Also could you explain what you mean by optical, I'm not to sure how it is used in context with the space shuttle, but when I hear it I think lens type sensitivity.
• #369 by Aobrien on 07 Aug, 2009 18:57
• Quote from: smith5se on 07 Aug, 2009 18:52

  Thanks for the answers Jim... if you don't mind a few more silly questions; how do they determine which option to do? You mentioned it depends on a lot of factors, is the type of payload one of them?
  
  Also could you explain what you mean by optical, I'm not to sure how it is used in context with the space shuttle, but when I hear it I think lens type sensitivity.
  

  I think optical means like equipment for Hubble or anything for a telescope or maybe even a satellite. Hubble payload always goes under extreme clean room.
• #370 by Jim on 07 Aug, 2009 19:46
• Quote from: smith5se on 07 Aug, 2009 18:52

  Thanks for the answers Jim... if you don't mind a few more silly questions; how do they determine which option to do? You mentioned it depends on a lot of factors, is the type of payload one of them?
  
  Also could you explain what you mean by optical, I'm not to sure how it is used in context with the space shuttle, but when I hear it I think lens type sensitivity.
  

  
  The payload drives the requirements.  Solar arrays, radiators, sun sensors, star trackers, mirrors, thermal surfaces, sensors, etc all have varying optical properties and are susceptible to particle fallout and NVR
• #371 by ChrisGebhardt on 07 Aug, 2009 21:24
• Quote from: Spaceboy7441 on 07 Aug, 2009 17:48

  Thanks Chris. That is actually exactly what I thought. What it is is on SSM-2007 it has you put the end of the arm under the belly for a short inspection.(Full inspection not yet here)  and I was telling them on the forum that I didn't think it was right.So I was actually correct because I f I understand you than all flights carrying the OBSS except for STS-125 don't scan the under belly. Let me know Thanks!
  

  
  Correct. All flights to the ISS (since STS-114) do not scan the TPS underbelly as part of their normal inspection routine.  However, they all have the ability to scan the underbelly in case of Focused Inspection -- as was seen on STS-118.
• #372 by LMSenus on 08 Aug, 2009 19:27
• Quote from: ChrisGebhardt on 07 Aug, 2009 17:46

  Quote from: LMSenus on 07 Aug, 2009 13:58

  Please forgive me if this has been asked before, but what is the protocol for flying the shuttle flags?  Are the flags flown only when the shuttle is on orbit, or once the stack is rolled out?
  

  
  Are you taking about these flags?
  
  If so, then they are flown when the specific vehicle they represent is at the pad or on orbit.
  

  
  Yes, Chris, those are the flags.  I have small versions for my office, and I have been displaying the appropriate flag while the vehicle was on orbit.  Then I realized they might also be flown while the vehicle is at the pad, and I didn't want to be incorrect in my use of the flags.  I'll need to put out my Discovery flag when I get into the office on Monday.    Thanks!
• #373 by BenB5150 on 10 Aug, 2009 00:44
• Quote from: LMSenus on 08 Aug, 2009 19:27

  Quote from: ChrisGebhardt on 07 Aug, 2009 17:46

  Quote from: LMSenus on 07 Aug, 2009 13:58

  Please forgive me if this has been asked before, but what is the protocol for flying the shuttle flags?  Are the flags flown only when the shuttle is on orbit, or once the stack is rolled out?
  

  
  Are you taking about these flags?
  
  If so, then they are flown when the specific vehicle they represent is at the pad or on orbit.
  

  
  Yes, Chris, those are the flags.  I have small versions for my office, and I have been displaying the appropriate flag while the vehicle was on orbit.  Then I realized they might also be flown while the vehicle is at the pad, and I didn't want to be incorrect in my use of the flags.  I'll need to put out my Discovery flag when I get into the office on Monday.    Thanks!
  

  
  Where can you get the small versions or any version?
  
  Thanks
  Ben
• #374 by LMSenus on 10 Aug, 2009 13:30
• Quote from: BenB5150 on 10 Aug, 2009 00:44

  Quote from: LMSenus on 08 Aug, 2009 19:27

  Yes, Chris, those are the flags.  I have small versions for my office, and I have been displaying the appropriate flag while the vehicle was on orbit.  Then I realized they might also be flown while the vehicle is at the pad, and I didn't want to be incorrect in my use of the flags.  I'll need to put out my Discovery flag when I get into the office on Monday.    Thanks!
  

  
  Where can you get the small versions or any version?
  
  Thanks
  Ben
  

  
  I found images of the flags here:  http://flagspot.net/flags/us-shut.html  The Atlantis flag I had to draw up based on photos.
  
  I print them out as needed.  It's not ideal, but until I find actual flags, I'm stuck.  Anybody know if the shop at KSC sells them?  In any case, even with the paper version, anybody walking by my cubicle knows which vehicle is on the pad or on orbit.  I'm just doing my bit for space program awareness 
• #375 by padrat on 10 Aug, 2009 14:18
• The flags are flown out here when the bird rolls out until the bird is back on the ground.
• #376 by padrat on 10 Aug, 2009 14:25
• In response to the payload questions, We don't have to wear gloves unless you are on a J-hook or any other position where you might touch the orbiter or payload, or any flight hardware.  Also you can wear a full face hood unless you have facial hair in which you have to wear an eye hood. The only exception since I've been working here has been Hubble, where everyone in the PCR had to have gloves and eyehoods. Concerning weather, if possible they don't really like to keep the payload in the PCR during a hurricane because , even though it is a clean room, it isn't water tight and there have been instances of water getting in  there. It's much safer to just leave it in the orbiter with the doors shut. They will usually only remove the payload if they might de-stack for some reason, or if the payload contains something like batteries that requires servicing every couple days. We do have different rain covers/gutters that we install in the PCR depending on if the orbiter is at the pad or not.
• #377 by Hobbs on 10 Aug, 2009 16:11
• Ive looked and had no luck googling this but what design are the ROFI sparklers that are used for the shuttle, having looked at several launch vids ive noticed a whirring noise that happens about 15 seconds before launch which would lead me to suspect they have something spinning in them, perhaps an angle-grinder and friction pad thing, is this the case or are they some kind of pyrotechnic device? would anyone happen to have a schematic on these (or maybe a pad-technician document on them if such a thing exists)
• #378 by Jim on 10 Aug, 2009 17:01
• Quote from: Hobbs on 10 Aug, 2009 16:11

  are they some kind of pyrotechnic device?
  

  
  Yes and DeltA IV uses them also.
• #379 by Hobbs on 10 Aug, 2009 20:41
• oh ok do they need to be replaced then between firings?, seems like that could be a problem if theres an RSLS abort or something like that