COTS D in the On-Deck Circle...

[A_M_Swallow]

Am I leaving out anything?

ULA getting the Atlas V or Delta IV man rated.

[Jim]

Am I leaving out anything?

ULA getting the Atlas V or Delta IV man rated.

To what standards? 

[bad_astra]

Honestly if a rocket is safe enough to put a gigabuck spysat on, can't we maybe just add LAS and risk it? The astros are in more danger driving to the mall in Houston.

[A_M_Swallow]

Am I leaving out anything?

ULA getting the Atlas V or Delta IV man rated.

To what standards? 

Good question.

[HMXHMX]

Honestly if a rocket is safe enough to put a gigabuck spysat on, can't we maybe just add LAS and risk it? The astros are in more danger driving to the mall in Houston.

Loathe am I to quote Griffin (or agree with him) for most any reason, but I'll make an exception. 

From Jeff Foust's comprehensive article in Space Review (14 Mar 2005): 

http://www.thespacereview.com/article/339/1

While Griffin is a backer of heavy lift, he does not ignore the need for smaller launchers that could carry cargo and crew. “We desperately need much more cost effective Earth-to-LEO transportation for payloads in the size range from a few thousand to a few tens of thousands of pounds,” he said in October 2003. “In my judgment, this is our most pressing need, for it controls a major portion of the cost of everything else that we do in space.”

Griffin made an identical comment in his March 2004 testimony, but added that “Again, shuttle-derived systems, particularly emphasizing use of the RSRB [Reusable Solid Rocket Booster], may offer a useful approach.” The Planetary Society report makes mention of such a vehicle, proposed by ATK Thiokol, that could be used to launch the CEV into orbit. (See “CEV: a different approach”, The Space Review, September 13, 2004)

In other testimony, Griffin has made it clear that he is not opposed to using EELV vehicles effectively unmodified from their current versions to launch crewed vehicles. In a May 2003 hearing by the House Science Committee’s space subcommittee on NASA’s Orbital Space Plane (OSP) program—a short-lived effort to develop a manned spacecraft that was superseded by the CEV—Griffin noted that the term “man rating” dated back to efforts in the 1950s and 1960s to modify ICBMs to carry capsules. “This involved a number of factors such as pogo suppression, structural stiffening, and other details not particularly germane to today’s expendable vehicles. The concept of ‘man rating’ in this sense is, I believe, no longer very relevant.”

He argued that EELVs and other expendable vehicles are already called upon to launch high-value unmanned payloads. “What, precisely, are the precautions that we would take to safeguard a human crew that we would deliberately omit when launching, say, a billion-dollar Mars Exploration Rover (MER) mission?” he asked. “The answer is, of course, ‘none’. While we appropriately value human life very highly, the investment we make in most unmanned missions is quite sufficient to capture our full attention.”

The Atlas 5 and Delta 4 EELVs, he noted, have a specified design reliability of 98 percent, in line with experience with the premier expendable vehicles to date. If such a vehicle was used to launch a crewed spacecraft equipped with an escape system of just 90 percent reliability, he noted, the combined system would have a 1-in-500 chance of a fatal accident, “substantially better than for the Shuttle.”

[yg1968]

SpaceX's CCDev proposal is for a LAS.

[robertross]

SpaceX's CCDev proposal is for a LAS.

Is that in concert with Orbital & ULA & the others as a joint venture?

[dad2059]

SpaceX's CCDev proposal is for a LAS.

BTW, has anyone heard anything about the CCDev money and who got picked?

[robertross]

SpaceX's CCDev proposal is for a LAS.

BTW, has anyone heard anything about the CCDev money and who got picked?

Hasn't been announed yet.

[yg1968]

SpaceX's CCDev proposal is for a LAS.

Is that in concert with Orbital & ULA & the others as a joint venture?

My information comes from this article:

http://www.spacenews.com/civil/091113-discussions-commercial-crew-development-dollars.html

SpaceX’s proposal, industry sources said, involves development of a launch escape system the company needs in order to transform its reusable Dragon cargo capsule into a crewed vehicle. SpaceX spokeswoman Emily Shanklin declined comment.

[robertross]

Thanks.

[Bernie Roehl]

Am I leaving out anything?

AIO50

I didn't think that was a manned spacecraft, even though the design is based on Gemini.  I had the impression it was instruments only.

I could be mistaken on that (and let me know if I am).

[bad_astra]

It's manned.

(and the best spacecraft design to come out of Huntsville, lately)

[Bernie Roehl]

It's manned.

(and the best spacecraft design to come out of Huntsville, lately)

Cool.  I wish them success!

[HMXHMX]

...
Lockheed has been testing a winged rlv of some kind at Spaceport America. Can't imagine that was done for no reason.

Really? Do you have any details on this?

http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/080424-lockheed-spaceplane-test.html

That has nothing to do with CCDEV.  It is IR&D for USAF flyback boosters, in case there is an RFP on that subject during the next year or two.

[Robotbeat]

...
Lockheed has been testing a winged rlv of some kind at Spaceport America. Can't imagine that was done for no reason.

Really? Do you have any details on this?

http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/080424-lockheed-spaceplane-test.html

That has nothing to do with CCDEV.  It is IR&D for USAF flyback boosters, in case there is an RFP on that subject during the next year or two.

Yay! Flyback boosters are even more interesting to me than another COTS capsule/spaceplane project.
From the spaceDOTcom article:
""This is a test a little, fly a little" effort, Simpson said. "You grow and build up over time. That way you are buying down risk incrementally ... not trying to leap into what I call the big system development right off the bat," he said."
YES!

""The key here is let's actually prove it [rapid, responsive, and lower-cost launch] ... that there is a path here as opposed to making statements in Powerpoint," he added."
YES, and YES!!!

This guy Simpson at Lockheed really gets it. Sorry about the off-topic-ness.

[Smoothie]

...
Lockheed has been testing a winged rlv of some kind at Spaceport America. Can't imagine that was done for no reason.

Really? Do you have any details on this?

http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/080424-lockheed-spaceplane-test.html

That has nothing to do with CCDEV.  It is IR&D for USAF flyback boosters, in case there is an RFP on that subject during the next year or two.

I realize that but someone asked about it so I posted the link.

[bad_astra]

A flyback booster is quite cool. Did not know that.

[Ben the Space Brit]

AIO50

Could you give me a link to the details of this vehicle? I can't find anything with a Google search - the name unfortunately is identical to a recent popular release of a bit of scientific software.

[docmordrid]

http://www.aio50.org/  ?