LIVE: SpaceX Falcon 1 Launch 5 (RazakSat) - July 13/14

[William Barton]

My messages are not meant to be a "gripe" or complaint.  I only intend to point out that SpaceX could do much better at communicating with the press - and that has little to do with their web site.

Anyone reading this who is a U.S. taxpayer is a "SpaceX customer".  SpaceX has an opportunity to "wow" these "customers", by telling them how it might be able to save them money, for example.

 - Ed Kyle

Yes. And every time they did, in the past, the either got laughed at or accused of "hype" (to put it politely).

If they used good corporate communication practices, they could tell their story factually and still do the "wow" thing. 

 - Ed Kyle

No offense, but that is simply a form of "spin." Quite honestly, hereabouts SpaceX supporters of any stripe are treated in a way recognizably similar to the way DIRECT supporters are treated in certain segments of the blogosphere, i.e., "amazing peoples." It's "not a given," "are you an engineer?" etc. When people made comparable remarks about Sea Launch, for example, nothing of the kind occurred, and yet Sea Launch is now in Chapter 11, just where non-SpaceX supporters confidently predict SpaceX will wind up. I will tell you, the only reason ULA is a "given" and will not wind up in Chapter 11 is because DoD will not permit it (a la the Lockheed bailout of a few decades back). And the only reason SpaceX is not a "given" is because no one with the governmental authority to do so has said, "Make it so."

In my remarks about SpaceX, when discussing the possible future of SpaceX, I have been careful to include the phrase "when and if, if and when, if ever"* but to no avail. "SpaceX is not a given." Now, SpaceX has proven they can design and fabricate a launch vehicle, and use it to place a satellite in low earth orbit. And they have a government fee-for-service contract. What's not "given" about that? They could easily fail, but it's much more about cash flow than engineering now.

* The phrase has a literary antecedent. I think from a novel by the late A. Bertram Chandler (Rim Worlds stories), but my old books are packed away.

[edkyle99]

Now *this* is what I'm talking about.  Something important has been happening on a tiny island in the western Pacific.  These two images speak volumes. 

SpaceX have a remarkable story to tell, and they've done a good job of it over the years, but they've been slow to tell it this week, of all weeks, for some reason.   

But enough about all that.

 - Ed Kyle

[cixelsyD]

If you're on this website, you're likely one to want ANYTHING to do with spaceflight to succeed as efficiently as possible, ULA, Orbital, Russians, Chinese, ESA etc. Spacex gets such "amazing peoples" likely from people like me, who want anything space to succeed, it doesn't matter really where it comes from. Having a successful spacex is not mutually exclusive to having success for everyone else. Can't people just be happy when they see good news about spaceflight, why should they get sneered at?

SpaceX is also a lot more ambitious, or at least open about it, which means it's very easy to get behind them and want them to succeed. Wouldn't it be a great thing if they could launch 7 people to the ISS on a rocket in the future? If that is successful, wouldn't it change spaceflight for the better? The way I see it, the more ambitious something is, the more people will want to see it work. That doesn't mean people are blind to failure, it just means they hope for the best.

I guess I just don't understand why wanting SpaceX to succeed is a bad thing...

The only gripes I have with spacex's media coverage is that they don't provide enough status updates on their progress. Is this due to a lack of transparancy due to being a private company? I'm not so sure. It feels like everyone in the space industry keeps very tight lipped.

[stockman]

If you're on this website, you're likely one to want ANYTHING to do with spaceflight to succeed as efficiently as possible, ULA, Orbital, Russians, Chinese, ESA etc. Spacex gets such "amazing peoples" likely from people like me, who want anything space to succeed, it doesn't matter really where it comes from. Having a successful spacex is not mutually exclusive to having success for everyone else. Can't people just be happy when they see good news about spaceflight, why should they get sneered at?

SpaceX is also a lot more ambitious, or at least open about it, which means it's very easy to get behind them and want them to succeed. Wouldn't it be a great thing if they could launch 7 people to the ISS on a rocket in the future? If that is successful, wouldn't it change spaceflight for the better? The way I see it, the more ambitious something is, the more people will want to see it work. That doesn't mean people are blind to failure, it just means they hope for the best.

I guess I just don't understand why wanting SpaceX to succeed is a bad thing...

The only gripes I have with spacex's media coverage is that they don't provide enough status updates on their progress. Is this due to a lack of transparancy due to being a private company? I'm not so sure. It feels like everyone in the space industry keeps very tight lipped.

agree 100%...

[braddock]

Those aerial launch shots are incredible.  How did they get them?  I wouldn't think anything could be flying within miles of the launch.

[stockman]

Those aerial launch shots are incredible.  How did they get them?  I wouldn't think anything could be flying within miles of the launch.

Why not... It is probably flying at a safe enough distance to avoid any mishap... Probably using a long range camera as well. I have to say seeing the Falcon just haning there in mid air is quite beautiful...

This one is my personal favourite...

[Antares]

It's the irrational expectation of success or the irrational planning of how things will go post-success-that-hasn't-happened yet.  That's what people get griped at for.

Conversely, the only thing I think that's improperly nit-picked is this post-launch press release.  They should be subject to the same technical scrutiny as anyone else.

And, something I thought of regarding the ULA comparison above: how many more people can name the CEO of SpaceX than can name the CEO of ULA?

[cixelsyD]

I love the last picture, it's my new desktop. I like seeing the tiny island that the launch takes place from. It seems as far as you can get from the giant launch complexes at the cape, instead of a huge steel complex, just vegetation and a pristene ocean.

[cixelsyD]

It's the irrational expectation of success or the irrational planning of how things will go post-success-that-hasn't-happened yet.  That's what people get griped at for.

Conversely, the only thing I think that's improperly nit-picked is this post-launch press release.  They should be subject to the same technical scrutiny as anyone else.

And, something I thought of regarding the ULA comparison above: how many more people can name the CEO of SpaceX than can name the CEO of ULA?

Well, the reason I can get hyped about spacex is because I actually didn't expect the F1 flt 5 to succeed just due to it's record. With the Shuttle or other rockets, there's not as much excitement as wonder; with spacex, i'm on the edge of my seat wondering if there's going to be a problem. I guess that just says if you want to make your rockets exciting have the fail half the time =/

I reckon people know a lot more about SpaceX just because it's a lot smaller, it's easier to get to know a company that's up and coming, than a huge corperation ex: it's easier to know the workings of Apple than Microsoft. It's also very new, people like me learn about the company because it grows with them, when I started learning about the space industry ULA was already in place, it just feels a bit intimidating...

Musk like Apple, is a bit of a hype generator, I actually think he spends more time with Tesla than SpaceX, but he really spends his time selling is product. Whether he should spend more time building and managing spacex better rather than selling it better, is beyond me to answer.

I'm a little suprised that people expect SpaceX to succeed, especially when they've had a pretty rocky start. Stating that SpaceX will be successful as a *fact*, that's going too far IMHO.

[HOTTOL]

Did you notice the fairly large dent in the interstage rim just after stage sep ? !
I'm nearly sure to see both stages shaking a bit at the beginning of stage sep sequence. Some lock being ruptured at that point ?

[kevin-rf]

I thought that was ice on the camera lense... (your reffering to the big white cloud like chunk missing from the interstage, right?)

[nooneofconsequence]

It doesn't suit Space-X to crow at the moment. They are playing at a bigger game you are not looking at.

When they do next crow, it will be deafening. Need not worry about them someway losing their voice or having a personality transplant ...

[mmeijeri]

Can you say more Gandalf?

[cixelsyD]

I dunno what you mean by "bigger game" I think they're really concentrated on getting COTS done properly. They may have dreams of something bigger, but I don't think they'll try anything else until Dragon's up and running.

[HOTTOL]

I thought that was ice on the camera lense... (your reffering to the big white cloud like chunk missing from the interstage, right?)

Yes Kevin, this is what I'm refering to.

[HMXHMX]

I thought that was ice on the camera lense... (your reffering to the big white cloud like chunk missing from the interstage, right?)

Yes Kevin, this is what I'm refering to.

It was ice or other debris.  It's pretty clear on the video.

[Nascent Ascent]

Regarding fawning and crowing...

I can understand this and sympathize with this more than I can the nitpicking.

Frankly, it's exciting to think about a vigorous and successful private company being able to launch hardware and humans into space.

It's particularly exciting to think about this in light of the fickle and inconsistent support of our Federal government.

This 40th anniversary drives home this point even more so.

We've seen decades of wasted opportunities and half-hearted attempts.  And even the good concepts - were squandered by cost cutting and numerous changes of direction by new Presidential administrations.  It's now more a political football that gets kicked around from time to time. 

And I'm really afraid Obama is going be an un-supporter and do very little - and this is really ironic considering the massive nonsense pork spending he and his Democratic friends are currently engaging in.

So, yeah,  I'm kind of burned out with our US manned space program.

Therefore, I can understand why someone might be a bit of SpaceX pollyanna. It's refreshing to see someone (Musk) with deep pockets and a vision and the chutzpah to back up his words with REAL action.  Yes, SpaceX has made some mistakes and they'll make more.  But at least they are doing something.

And I'd much rather fawn and crow over a good or mediocre plan implemented now, than a half-baked plan watered down and implemented on an ever-changing budget.  We've had enough of that over the past 35 years, thank you very much.

NA

[stockman]

Regarding fawning and crowing...

I can understand this and sympathize with this more than I can the nitpicking.

Frankly, it's exciting to think about a vigorous and successful private company being able to launch hardware and humans into space.

It's particularly exciting to think about this in light of the fickle and inconsistent support of our Federal government.

This 40th anniversary drives home this point even more so.

We've seen decades of wasted opportunities and half-hearted attempts.  And even the good concepts - were squandered by cost cutting and numerous changes of direction by new Presidential administrations.  It's now more a political football that gets kicked around from time to time. 

And I'm really afraid Obama is going be an un-supporter and do very little - and this is really ironic considering the massive nonsense pork spending he and his Democratic friends are currently engaging in.

So, yeah,  I'm kind of burned out with our US manned space program.

Therefore, I can understand why someone might be a bit of SpaceX pollyanna. It's refreshing to see someone (Musk) with deep pockets and a vision and the chutzpah to back up his words with REAL action.  Yes, SpaceX has made some mistakes and they'll make more.  But at least they are doing something.

And I'd much rather fawn and crow over a good or mediocre plan implemented now, than a half-baked plan watered down and implemented on an ever-changing budget.  We've had enough of that over the past 35 years, thank you very much.

NA

Another great summary and  statement that I fully agree with.. well said.

[mlorrey]

Better than the school girl gushing and fawning that occurs more often

Honestly, the fawning and nitpicking are about the same on the annoyance scale.

Well some of us grew up being taught "if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all..." I'd much rather be a gusher than a trasher, particularly about people who are also positive, and forward looking, and energetic, and moreover, not wasting my money on bureaucratic games.

Which would you rather be around, the bubbly positive girl who works her way through school and pays her own way, or the bitchy snobby girl who expects you to pay for everything?

[MP99]

SpaceX have a remarkable story to tell, and they've done a good job of it over the years, but they've been slow to tell it this week, of all weeks, for some reason.   

The only gripes I have with spacex's media coverage is that they don't provide enough status updates on their progress. Is this due to a lack of transparancy due to being a private company? I'm not so sure. It feels like everyone in the space industry keeps very tight lipped.

When they were assembling Falcon 9 at the Cape early this year, the updates seemed nearly continuous - and it was great.

The contrast with this, where they have only their second successful flight (and by no means a foregone conclusion that it would succeed IMO) is astonishing - hard to believe it's the same company. Although they're plainly focusing all their effort on F9, this is a big step forward for that programme, too - it validates common components, construction methods, procedures, design principles, and edges forward my personal hope that F9 flight 1 will perform to the level of F1 flight 2 - a partial launch success, most major systems demonstrated, lots of test data generated so that flight 2 has a chance of reaching orbit and at least testing Dragon re-entry.

Musk like Apple, is a bit of a hype generator, I actually think he spends more time with Tesla than SpaceX, but he really spends his time selling is product. Whether he should spend more time building and managing spacex better rather than selling it better, is beyond me to answer.

Well, "Musk like Steve Jobs" - and look what happened to Apple's share price when he took ill.

Not saying Musk is ill, but is he having to spend so much time with Tesla at the moment that he can't even do a bit of hype for only SpaceX's second successful launch?

The noise on this thread is justified to the extent that this is a complete change of MO for a company not shy of publicity before. Could this be in some way to do with the COTS relationship with NASA?

cheers, Martin