Space Ship Two - General Thread

[douglas100]

If you zoom in on the nose of SS2 in that pages pic you can see the new winglets.

Landing pic....

+ Crop, Zoom & Contrast pic....

I think there is something rather more significant than winglets, which I frankly don't see.

SS2 has acquired a hump.

Well spotted!

[Jason1701]

Another glide flight. They're all very short now.

The totals so far: 2 in October, 1 in November, 1 in January, 2 in April, 4 in May, 5 in June.

Flight:    68 / GF15
Date:    27 Jun 11    Flight Time:    7 min, 39 sec
SS2 Pilot:    Siebold    SS2 CoPilot:    Nichols
GS Crew:    Tighe, Bassett, Inks, Verderame, Persall, Knupp, Zeitlin, Reid

Objectives:
Continued airspeed flutter susceptibility envelope expansion

Results:
All objectives achieved. Dynamic pressure envelope further expanded.

[mto]

AviationWeek.com - An Inside Look At A New Spaceship Factory

[bluedack]

Anybody help !
I am wondering how space ship two get five minutes weightless condition.
 

[jabe]

Anybody help !
I am wondering how space ship two get five minutes weightless condition.
 

I replied to something similar
here
jb

[Garrett]

As mentioned by yg1968 on the Virgin Galactic Updates thread, the latest SS2 test flight had some stall issues:

Flight:    73 / GF16
Date:    29 Sep 11   Flight Time:    7 min, 15 sec
SS2 Pilot:   Stucky   SS2 CoPilot:   Nichols   SS2 FTE:   Persall
GS Crew:   Alsbury, Verderame, Kalogiannis, Vannoy, Glasser, Reid, Inks, Tighe, Bassett

Objectives:
Post maintenance functional check flight
Clean release
Evaluate stability and control
Flutter expansion
Previous flutter point validation
Increased weight landing (using water ballast)
Pilot proficiency

Results:
Test card called for releasing the Spaceship from WhiteKnightTwo and immediately entering a rapid descent. Upon release, the Spaceship experienced a downward pitch rate that caused a stall of the tails. The crew followed procedure, selecting the feather mode to revert to a benign condition. The crew then defeathered and had a nominal return to base. Great flying by the team and good demo of feather system.

This is a Space.com article that yg1968 linked to:
http://www.space.com/13297-virgin-galactic-spaceshiptwo-test-flight-glitch.html
And as noted by simonbp on the VG thread, this was the first three-person flight of SS2.

If anybody can shed light on why this flight had an off-nominal downward pitch rate then that would be welcome. Would the weight of a third person have been the cause, i.e. a center of gravity issue? I'm presuming that the issue is easy (relatively speaking) to solve, maybe by modifying the pitch of WK2 during the drop maneuver for example?

[Herb Schaltegger]

As mentioned by yg1968 on the Virgin Galactic Updates thread, the latest SS2 test flight had some stall issues:

Flight:    73 / GF16
Date:    29 Sep 11   Flight Time:    7 min, 15 sec
SS2 Pilot:   Stucky   SS2 CoPilot:   Nichols   SS2 FTE:   Persall
GS Crew:   Alsbury, Verderame, Kalogiannis, Vannoy, Glasser, Reid, Inks, Tighe, Bassett

Objectives:
Post maintenance functional check flight
Clean release
Evaluate stability and control
Flutter expansion
Previous flutter point validation
Increased weight landing (using water ballast)
Pilot proficiency

Results:
Test card called for releasing the Spaceship from WhiteKnightTwo and immediately entering a rapid descent. Upon release, the Spaceship experienced a downward pitch rate that caused a stall of the tails. The crew followed procedure, selecting the feather mode to revert to a benign condition. The crew then defeathered and had a nominal return to base. Great flying by the team and good demo of feather system.

This is a Space.com article that yg1968 linked to:
http://www.space.com/13297-virgin-galactic-spaceshiptwo-test-flight-glitch.html
And as noted by simonbp on the VG thread, this was the first three-person flight of SS2.

If anybody can shed light on why this flight had an off-nominal downward pitch rate then that would be welcome. Would the weight of a third person have been the cause, i.e. a center of gravity issue? I'm presuming that the issue is easy (relatively speaking) to solve, maybe by modifying the pitch of WK2 during the drop maneuver for example?

The article, as otherwise-void of details as it is, has the answer right there: the tails stalled.  Without lift from the tails (in this case, the vector of that lift is downward, creating a positive pitch rate), the nose dropped.  The question is REALLY, "Why did the tails stall?"  Where they set at an improper angle at release?  Was release too slow? Etc.

[Garrett]

The article, as otherwise-void of details as it is, has the answer right there: the tails stalled.  Without lift from the tails (in this case, the vector of that lift is downward, creating a positive pitch rate), the nose dropped.  The question is REALLY, "Why did the tails stall?"  Where they set at an improper angle at release?  Was release too slow? Etc.

Funny, I read it the other way as it says: "the Spaceship experienced a downward pitch rate that caused a stall of the tails"
So for me it was the initial downward pitch that caused the tail stall and not the other way around. Though I'm no pilot, so I'm not really sure how it works.

[Nomadd]

 I wouldn't take some nitwit's "hurtling out of control" headline too seriously. They could have just been exploring the edge of the envelope, and found it. That's part of flight testing.

[Garrett]

I wouldn't take some nitwit's "hurtling out of control" headline too seriously. They could have just been exploring the edge of the envelope, and found it. That's part of flight testing.

Yeah, of course it's quite possible that a stall was expected and planned for, but that the reporter, eh, accidentally forgot to inform his readers

[IW1DGG]

Hi, I will be in the Mojave area tomorrow, does someone knows it there is any flight test planned? Would be very nice to be able to see it!
Thanks

[Jason1701]

Hi, I will be in the Mojave area tomorrow, does someone knows it there is any flight test planned? Would be very nice to be able to see it!
Thanks

Almost certainly not, due to the last one having an anomaly and the vehicles' flight to New Mexico last week.

[IW1DGG]

Thanks for the answer...
no luck this time! let's hope for the future...

[gam]

Hi there all.

Firstly, I would just like to say this is the best website I have ever come across!!!!!!!

I'm just wondering how far the next Spaceshiptwo,(VSS Voyager) is coming along in it's production and how long before we see it.

Thank's in advance
gam

[mr. mark]

First off, I'd like to say that Branson needs to stop the PR machine until his bird is flying and in the air. Space is hard but, bad planning makes it worse. People are starting to tire off the we're only 2 years away sentiment. Spaceport America's runways will be sitting there with no space plane to launch from it. Last time I read my history they had airplanes before they had airports not the other way around. Anyone have any ideas where they are with engine testing? Was the hybrid motor a failure because of instability issues? 

[Garrett]

First off, I'd like to say that Branson needs to stop the PR machine until his bird is flying and in the air. Space is hard but, bad planning makes it worse. People are starting to tire off the we're only 2 years away sentiment. Spaceport America's runways will be sitting there with no space plane to launch from it. Last time I read my history they had airplanes before they had airports not the other way around. Anyone have any ideas where they are with engine testing? Was the hybrid motor a failure because of instability issues? 

The last I heard, the rocket motor hot fire testing was finished. They are supposed to be working on integrating the motor into SS2 at the moment, assuming they're ok with SNC's reports of the tests.

I'm actually getting a bit tired of the comparisons been made between commercial airplanes and commercial spaceships. I think by now we should all just agree that it's a whole different ballgame. Sure, there may be some crossover, but it's just not the same. If you want to use analogies, then maybe the building of railroads to the west coast of the US could be used: government/private partnerships to build infrastructure across virgin territory to the frontiers of civilisation.

[vt_hokie]

I'm actually getting a bit tired of the comparisons been made between commercial airplanes and commercial spaceships. I think by now we should all just agree that it's a whole different ballgame. Sure, there may be some crossover, but it's just not the same.

I think it's a stretch to call a suborbital vehicle like this a "spaceship" but I guess given its use of RCS thrusters, however briefly, it is one as much as the NF-104 or X-15 could be called a spaceship at least...

[iamlucky13]

Hi there all.

Firstly, I would just like to say this is the best website I have ever come across!!!!!!!

I'm just wondering how far the next Spaceshiptwo,(VSS Voyager) is coming along in it's production and how long before we see it.

Thank's in advance
gam

Welcome to the site!

I don't recall seeing any updates from TheSpaceShip Company, Virgin, or elsewhere on second spacecraft. Generally if anyone is privy to interesting details like that (and isn't forbidden from discussing it as an employee of a relevant company), they go ahead and post it, so if you don't find anything I've forgotten when you read back through the thread, assume nothing is known.

[Garrett]

I'm just wondering how far the next Spaceshiptwo,(VSS Voyager) is coming along in it's production and how long before we see it.

Forgot to say welcome earlier, so welcome

I don't recall seeing any updates from TheSpaceShip Company, Virgin, or elsewhere on second spacecraft.

It's been known for a while that Virgin has ordered five SpaceShipTwo's and two WhightKnightTwo's (see this article from 2005 for example: http://www.space.com/1356-richard-branson-burt-rutan-form-spacecraft-building-company.html)

In September of this year, VG's and Scaled's joint venture, The Spaceship Company, opened their assembly facility at Mojave:
http://www.thespaceshipcompany.com/media/press_releases/the_spaceship_company_opens_assembly_facility

[The facility] completes the infrastructure needed to manufacture a fleet of TSC’s two core products: the SpaceShipTwo (SS2) sub-orbital spaceship and the WhiteKnightTwo (WK2) carrier aircraft. The facility is specifically sized to support fabrication of SS2 and WK2 with room to produce at least two of each ship at the same time

I think that's all we know for now, though we can probably assume that parts for new craft are already being manufactured.

[iamlucky13]

Right. I mean any details beyond the fact that they plan to build a fleet of them.

For VSS Enterprise, we've seen had a semi-regular stream of updates and photos as work progressed. I'm unaware of any indications that construction of VSS Voyager has even started. Obviously the bulk of their attention is on supporting testing of VSS Enterprise. That's only logical since they can't hand over the spacecraft to Virgin until it's licensed.

Beyond that, it's hard to guess how they're managing the project without hints from them.

They could have started building and plan to incorporate any necessary changes by modification to work already done, or they could be holding off until testing advances to a certain point in order to minimize post-construction changes, as well as minimize near term labor.

It also depends on what Virgin wants - do they want to hit the ground running and get multiple spacecraft operational in short order, or iron out their operations and equipment before trying to ramp up their flight rate.