Author Topic: 6-Engined Ares V?  (Read 49743 times)

Offline clongton

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #100 on: 07/12/2008 02:40 PM »

The arrangement of the 6 engines leaves a rather interesting engine sized hole in the centre  ;D

Six engines in such proximity to the SRB's already drives the base heating environment very close to the limit, if not already over the top. If they stay with it, the only way I know of to address the problem in this confined an area would be the regen nozzle. And if they fill that hole with a 7th engine, I see no alternative but to go to the regen design.
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I started my career on the Saturn-V F-1A engine

Offline guru

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #101 on: 11/20/2008 05:28 PM »
Has NASA come up with any good solutions to deal with flume impingement against the SRBs inherent in the Ares VI design lately?

Offline amaturespacecase

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #102 on: 11/23/2008 10:57 AM »
Has NASA come up with any good solutions to deal with flume impingement against the SRBs inherent in the Ares VI design lately?

They'll probably end up ripping up at least one of the pads and starting fresh with a better suited trench design for Ares V. Money isn't there for it right now but I'm sure they'll get it in the interest of thinking about future needs.
NASA's FY 2009 budget request- Ok bend over!

Offline Blackstar

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #103 on: 12/06/2008 08:31 PM »
Does anybody have any info on the Wide Body Centaur discussed a couple of years ago?

One problem with using Ares V for planetary exploration is that the upper stage options are long and thin and waste space in the payload fairing.  A short, squat upper stage is more useful.  But Lockheed-Martin no longer has links to papers mentioning the proposed 5-meter Wide Body Centaur.

Offline renclod

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #104 on: 12/06/2008 11:47 PM »
...
One problem with using Ares V for planetary exploration is that the upper stage options are long and thin and waste space in the payload fairing.  A short, squat upper stage is more useful.  ...

Question here:
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=15159.0

The cargo-Altair is a orbital stage, optimized for the 10 m Ares V payload shroud, robotic spacecraft capable of a lunar orbit insertion followed by lunar landing.

The cargo-Altair would be designed to carry any payload on its 8 m dia deck, from launch to lunar landing, keeping it alive until some other system (Athlete) unload that ~14mT payload once on lunar surface.

The cargo-Altair should be easily transformed into a robotic planetary injection stage conformal to Ares V/EDS.

The only problem is, people are used to consider Altair as a manned lunar exploration element. Which is false. Altair is a robot, one hydrolox engine, large throttle-down capability, planetary navigation.





 

Offline Antares

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #105 on: 12/07/2008 12:27 AM »
But Lockheed-Martin no longer has links to papers mentioning the proposed 5-meter Wide Body Centaur.

Are these the papers you're talking about?
http://www.ulalaunch.com/index_published.html
If I like something on NSF, it's probably because I know it to be accurate.  Every once in a while, it's just something I agree with.  Facts generally receive the former.

Offline Blackstar

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #106 on: 12/07/2008 11:12 PM »
I've looked through those briefly.  Those might be the ones referenced by others (the old links give me 404 errors).  However, I'm not sure because nobody quoted titles, just a website. 

I'll have to look through those to see if there is any reference to a Wide Body Centaur.  One of the relevant links is dead however, and that might be the one I am looking for.

Offline mrryndrsn

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #107 on: 12/08/2008 12:10 AM »
I've looked through those briefly.  Those might be the ones referenced by others (the old links give me 404 errors).  However, I'm not sure because nobody quoted titles, just a website. 

I'll have to look through those to see if there is any reference to a Wide Body Centaur.  One of the relevant links is dead however, and that might be the one I am looking for.
Try http://www.ulalaunch.com/docs/publications/Atlas/Evolved_Atlas_To_Meet_Space_Transportation_Needs_2005-6815.pdf
for a short description of the wide-body Centaur.
There's more in the Atlas Mission Planner, section 8, found at http://www.ulalaunch.com/docs/product_sheet/Atlas_Mission_Planner_14161.pdf, if you don't mind a 30 Meg download.


Offline Blackstar

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #108 on: 12/08/2008 03:02 AM »
That's great.  Thank you very much.

Offline kraisee

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #109 on: 12/08/2008 02:45 PM »
Does anybody have any info on the Wide Body Centaur discussed a couple of years ago?

One problem with using Ares V for planetary exploration is that the upper stage options are long and thin and waste space in the payload fairing.  A short, squat upper stage is more useful.  But Lockheed-Martin no longer has links to papers mentioning the proposed 5-meter Wide Body Centaur.

All those documents moved to United Launch Alliances website after the merger of Atlas/Delta programs.   They are currently all available here:

http://www.ulalaunch.com/index_published.html

The actual link on that page doesn't appear to be working correctly, but the document I believe you are looking for is here:-

http://www.ulalaunch.com/docs/publications/Atlas/Atlas_Centaur_Extensibility_to_Long-Duration_In-Space_Applications_2005-6738.pdf


Ross.
« Last Edit: 12/08/2008 02:48 PM by kraisee »
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Offline Blackstar

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #110 on: 12/12/2008 07:49 PM »
Many thanks.  A study that I was recently involved in identified an issue with the lack of room in the Ares V shroud for a payload if an existing upper stage was added.  A lot of room would get wasted with a long thin upper stage in a wide shroud.  So I'm curious about any proposals for wider upper stages.

Offline Blackstar

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Re: 6-Engined Ares V?
« Reply #111 on: 12/12/2008 07:50 PM »
On another note, I saw on L2 (I think) a schematic showing the evolution of the Ares V design concept.  Has anybody done the same for Ares V?

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