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General Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: sandrot on 02/19/2007 03:25 PM

Title: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: sandrot on 02/19/2007 03:25 PM
As the Space Shuttle will be retired in 2010, is there a future for the three MPLM's?

I read that their structure bears commonality with the ATV pressurized section.

I read also that European ISS modules are built to be possibly launched with the Space Shuttle and with traditional launchers.

Ideas? Proposals?
Title: Re: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: bobthemonkey on 02/19/2007 03:31 PM
this has been discussd a humber of times before, but to give the short answer, No. The show-stopper seems to be a lack of micrometeroid protection. Have a serach, especially in the ISS section for more info.
Title: Re: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: sandrot on 02/19/2007 04:11 PM
Ok, I found this thread:

http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/forum/forums/forum-view.asp?fid=8

I see proposals for permanent attachment to ISS and use as lunar base module.

What instead about reuse for ATV?

I believe the MPLM's share a lot as structure with the Columbus module, which is built for a long stay in space.

I don't see the micro meteoroid protection as a show stopper, if it can be retrofitted.
Title: Re: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: Jim on 02/19/2007 04:19 PM
Quote
sandrot - 19/2/2007  12:11 PM

Ok, I found this thread:

http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/forum/forums/forum-view.asp?fid=8

I see proposals for permanent attachment to ISS and use as lunar base module.

What instead about reuse for ATV?

I believe the MPLM's share a lot as structure with the Columbus module, which is built for a long stay in space.

I don't see the micro meteoroid protection as a show stopper, if it can be retrofitted.

Not worth the effort.   Cheaper to start from scratch
Title: Re: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: sandrot on 02/19/2007 04:32 PM
Quote
Jim - 19/2/2007  12:19 PM

Quote
sandrot - 19/2/2007  12:11 PM

Ok, I found this thread:

http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/forum/forums/forum-view.asp?fid=8

I see proposals for permanent attachment to ISS and use as lunar base module.

What instead about reuse for ATV?

I believe the MPLM's share a lot as structure with the Columbus module, which is built for a long stay in space.

I don't see the micro meteoroid protection as a show stopper, if it can be retrofitted.

Not worth the effort.   Cheaper to start from scratch

You are right! Starting from scratch is the top priority at NASA: stick, J2X :)  :)  :)

I know I know... those two items have already so many changes that bear no resemblance to the original.

It was just to say that "cheaper to start from scratch" doesn't seem to weigh just that much. Sometimes "proven" is the driver.
Title: Re: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: Jim on 02/19/2007 04:49 PM
Quote
sandrot - 19/2/2007  12:32 PM

It was just to say that "cheaper to start from scratch" doesn't seem to weigh just that much. Sometimes "proven" is the driver.

Proven? A pressure shell is not that hard to build.    The MPLM and Node 2&3 are of the same design.  That is what is proven.

Redesigning and refitting the shell is not that advantages.  There is nothing to gain.  Anyways how is it to get to the ISS.

Let's stop this thread.  It has been hashed over and over
Title: Re: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: sandrot on 02/19/2007 05:09 PM
I don't disagree that it may be cheaper to do from scratch. I've been working on projects that were mothballed and restarted, or that changed their scope of work.

My point was based on:
1 - MPLM's shells have been tested in space
2 - commonality with existing modules
3 - they supposedly can be launched by other launchers (Ariane, Proton)

I read on other threads that an ISS permanent docking is not possible, so I was curious to see if there were other ideas around for reuse.
Title: Re: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: Jim on 02/19/2007 05:45 PM
Quote
sandrot - 19/2/2007  1:09 PM
My point was based on:
1 - MPLM's shells have been tested in space
2 - commonality with existing modules
3 - they supposedly can be launched by other launchers (Ariane, Proton)

1.  Not really anything special or to any advantage.  Also any mods to the existing MPLM would invalidate this.  Stick a new one in a vacuum chamber and you achieve the same thing.  

2.  Common designs. Not actual common pieces.  They are all different.  MLPM use CBM's, ATV has a docking probe.
It is much like having a common wing design.  But one aircraft has one engine installation and the other has two.  The wings can not be swapped between aircraft but they still are "common"

3.  Not the MPLM's
Title: Re: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: hektor on 02/19/2007 08:01 PM
possible reuse of MPLM : recycle the aluminum as beer cans ?
Title: Re: Retrofit/Reuse of MPLM's
Post by: nacnud on 02/19/2007 08:28 PM
Probably the wronge type of aluminum ;)