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Commercial and US Government Launch Vehicles => SNC Dream Chaser Section => Topic started by: Burninate on 10/02/2014 05:28 PM

Title: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Burninate on 10/02/2014 05:28 PM
Here's my article, using some of the good L2 info we had, with the media releases and a bit more L2 info.

http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2014/10/dream-chaser-eyes-rides-with-under-review-stratolaunch-system/
Thought this deserved its own thread, as it is essentially a new vehicle, at about half the mass.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Rocket Science on 10/02/2014 08:16 PM
Here's my article, using some of the good L2 info we had, with the media releases and a bit more L2 info.

http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2014/10/dream-chaser-eyes-rides-with-under-review-stratolaunch-system/
Thought this deserved its own thread, as it is essentially a new vehicle, at about half the mass.
Hey I gave you your 100th like! :) I say we call her Dream Chaser MK II for now... ;)
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Nindalf on 10/02/2014 09:13 PM
I say we call her Dream Chaser MK II for now... ;)
"Drm Chasr" is exactly 75% of the length of "Dream Chaser", if you count the space.

...or "Dream Car", or "Dr. Chase".
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: TrevorMonty on 10/02/2014 09:28 PM
How about Dream Chaser Mini Me DCMM.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: JasonAW3 on 10/02/2014 09:28 PM
Here's my article, using some of the good L2 info we had, with the media releases and a bit more L2 info.

http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2014/10/dream-chaser-eyes-rides-with-under-review-stratolaunch-system/
Thought this deserved its own thread, as it is essentially a new vehicle, at about half the mass.
Hey I gave you your 100th like! :) I say we call her Dream Chaser MK II for now... ;)

How about the Day Dreamer?
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Rocket Science on 10/02/2014 11:45 PM
Dream Avenger 8)
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: A_M_Swallow on 10/03/2014 12:08 AM
Or the military version - Chaser.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: rayleighscatter on 10/03/2014 12:14 AM
Or the CIA version: [Redacted]
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: bubbagret on 10/03/2014 12:19 AM
Dream Sneaker...
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Pipcard on 10/03/2014 12:58 AM
A person known as n0mad23 envisioned a fictional modified version of the X-37B (http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=5430) (for a story he was writing) that would carry two astronauts and be air-launched from a modified B-52 (http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=5377).
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: R7 on 10/03/2014 06:25 AM
Mk I: Dream Chaser

Mk II: Dream Chaser

Mk III: _ _

Mk IV: .

Mk V: well it's hard to see but it'll piggyback on nanosat.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Pipcard on 10/03/2014 06:28 AM
A BOR-4 sized vehicle for small experiments?
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Burninate on 10/03/2014 08:19 AM
A person known as n0mad23 envisioned a fictional modified version of the X-37B (http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=5430) (for a story he was writing) that would carry two astronauts and be air-launched from a modified B-52 (http://www.orbithangar.com/searchid.php?ID=5377).

X-37B is ~5000kg, which is right in the same range as miniDC - but it likely loads small satellites, robotic arms, & fuel for in-space boosting rather than humans, life support, and abort functionality.

There are actual proposals for a 6-person X-37C, should we desire it - albeit vertical launch and probably in the 15-20T weight range.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: space_dreamer on 10/03/2014 09:03 AM
Rather than it be called a "smaller" Dream Chaser. It should be the sports version or the coupe.

Also (looking for the silver lining) the fact that it carry's half the passengers could be seen as a good thing. As,   compared to the "standard" Dream Chaser launched on a Atlas 5, The Dream Chaser coupe doubles the flight rate.

Once you've got the Stratolaunch it make sense to use it as often as possible.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Rocket Science on 10/03/2014 09:33 AM
Rather than it be called a "smaller" Dream Chaser. It should be the sports version or the coupe.

Also (looking for the silver lining) the fact that it carry's half the passengers could be seen as a good thing. As,   compared to the "standard" Dream Chaser launched on a Atlas 5, The Dream Chaser coupe doubles the flight rate.

Once you've got the Stratolaunch it make sense to use it as often as possible.
Dream Chaser GT (Global Transport)... ;D
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: llanitedave on 10/03/2014 05:28 PM
Remember, just because it's a smaller vehicle doesn't mean it has to have a smaller name.

"Daydream Believer, and a Homecoming Queen"
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: M_Puckett on 10/11/2014 04:38 PM
Dream Weaver.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Prober on 10/15/2014 02:11 AM
Dragon Slayer :D
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: RanulfC on 10/16/2014 08:54 PM
Dragon Slayer :D

3-passengers versus 7 and something like twice the cost? Not seeing that as a viable name :)

Randy
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: RanulfC on 10/16/2014 08:59 PM
What I'd really love to see come out of this is a more VIABLE Stratolaunch LV design coupled with the smaller DC design but I'm seriously doubting that's going to happen.

Randy
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Burninate on 10/16/2014 09:36 PM
What I'd really love to see come out of this is a more VIABLE Stratolaunch LV design coupled with the smaller DC design but I'm seriously doubting that's going to happen.

Randy

What's more viable?
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: RanulfC on 10/16/2014 10:10 PM
What I'd really love to see come out of this is a more VIABLE Stratolaunch LV design coupled with the smaller DC design but I'm seriously doubting that's going to happen.

What's more viable?

Probably should have been more "affordable" or "efficent" rather than viable :)

Randy
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: rusty on 10/22/2014 07:08 AM
Let me know if this sounds familiar;
TSTO lifting body launches with booster from a mother ship, carrying two or three to orbit. If you guessed a mini-Dream Chaser, you'd be correct.
(http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Z714.jpg)
(http://www.tacking-outrigger.com/mig-spiral3.jpg)
If it was thirty some-odd years ago, a small turbojet for powered landings and variable wings for subsonic flight were added, you'd probably guess SPIRAL. This design first flew - flown, not glided - as the Mig-105 and later the suborbital BOR testbeds with revised wings.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/89/Mikoyan-Gurevich_MiG-105_EPOS_(8911845093).jpg/320px-Mikoyan-Gurevich_MiG-105_EPOS_(8911845093).jpg)
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: RanulfC on 10/22/2014 04:35 PM
Let me know if this sounds familiar;
TSTO lifting body launches with booster from a mother ship, carrying two or three to orbit. If you guessed a mini-Dream Chaser, you'd be correct.
(http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Z714.jpg)
(http://www.tacking-outrigger.com/mig-spiral3.jpg)
If it was thirty some-odd years ago, a small turbojet for powered landings and variable wings for subsonic flight were added, you'd probably guess SPIRAL. This design first flew - flown, not glided - as the Mig-105 and later the suborbital BOR testbeds with revised wings.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/89/Mikoyan-Gurevich_MiG-105_EPOS_(8911845093).jpg/320px-Mikoyan-Gurevich_MiG-105_EPOS_(8911845093).jpg)

Just to be technical, the SPIRAL had a hypersonic air-breathing stage, (staged at Mach-6) followed by a two-stage rocket powered stage and the Mig. Mini-DC has a subsonic air-breathing stage with a THREE stage rocket then the mini-DC. Also the Mig carried only one (1) person (in an escape capsule no less) while the mini-DC is supposed to carry "three people and some small cargo" to LEO.

IIRC didn't someone point out that part of the inspiration for the DC itself was the Mig/BOR? :)

Randy
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Prober on 10/22/2014 04:50 PM
Dragon Slayer :D

3-passengers versus 7 and something like twice the cost? Not seeing that as a viable name :)

Randy

3-4 passengers might have been a more viable spacecraft. 8)
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: RanulfC on 10/22/2014 05:23 PM
Dragon Slayer :D

3-passengers versus 7 and something like twice the cost? Not seeing that as a viable name :)

3-4 passengers might have been a more viable spacecraft. 8)

Actually agree with that but everything is pretty much in place for the 7-passenger Dragon V2 where it isn't for the 3-4 passenger Mini-DC :)

Not that I think they have any way to do it but frankly I see the Mini-DC concept being less adaptive to the StratoLauncher and more in need of something like the ALTO/CRoSSBoW. Mini-DC has everything needed to control everything from Take Off to Launch through Landing if coupled with a more efficent LV and remote controlled Aircraft system. On the other hand this is really one of the few viable ways I see of keeping the DC alive :)

Randy
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: SirThoreth on 11/12/2014 10:01 PM
Rather than it be called a "smaller" Dream Chaser. It should be the sports version or the coupe.

Dream Chaser Superleggera.  Should appeal to the ESA that way, too. :)

Quote
Also (looking for the silver lining) the fact that it carry's half the passengers could be seen as a good thing. As,   compared to the "standard" Dream Chaser launched on a Atlas 5, The Dream Chaser coupe doubles the flight rate.

Once you've got the Stratolaunch it make sense to use it as often as possible.

My question, and it's not entirely addressed in the original article, is what they see as the expected mission/customer for the DC Superleggera, though.  Would ISS still be an option?  Standalone flights?
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: yg1968 on 11/13/2014 01:07 PM
For the record, Stratolaunch and SNC actually call it the scaled Dream Chaser.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: yg1968 on 11/13/2014 01:12 PM
See post below:

This isn't a new article but it has some encourging quotes on the chances that Paul Allen will choose DC as its spacecraft.

Quote
“The whole point of Stratolaunch is to open up and really allow a fuller exploitation (of space) commercially,” said Stratolaunch executive director Charles Beames. The Dream Chaser is something like a “space Corvette,” he added. “It has Paul’s attention. He’s very excited about it.” Allen is expected to make a decision about whether to partner with Sierra Nevada before the end of the year, Beames added.

http://sen.com/news/paul-allen-s-stratolaunch-eyes-sierra-nevada-dream-chaser-space-plane

P.S. See also the article linked below:
https://www.nbcnews.com/science/space/sierra-nevada-stratolaunch-team-dream-chaser-space-plane-n215386

Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: grakenverb on 11/13/2014 01:27 PM
See post below:

This isn't a new article but it has some encourging quotes on the chances that Paul Allen will choose DC as its spacecraft.

Quote
“The whole point of Stratolaunch is to open up and really allow a fuller exploitation (of space) commercially,” said Stratolaunch executive director Charles Beames. The Dream Chaser is something like a “space Corvette,” he added. “It has Paul’s attention. He’s very excited about it.” Allen is expected to make a decision about whether to partner with Sierra Nevada before the end of the year, Beames added.

http://sen.com/news/paul-allen-s-stratolaunch-eyes-sierra-nevada-dream-chaser-space-plane

From the article:

"Stratolaunch’s Dream Chaser would be about 75 percent smaller, with seating for a pilot and up to two passengers, or a combination of passengers and crew."

75 percent smaller, wow, that is going to be one tiny spaceship.  ;D
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Rocket Science on 11/13/2014 06:44 PM
See post below:

This isn't a new article but it has some encourging quotes on the chances that Paul Allen will choose DC as its spacecraft.

Quote
“The whole point of Stratolaunch is to open up and really allow a fuller exploitation (of space) commercially,” said Stratolaunch executive director Charles Beames. The Dream Chaser is something like a “space Corvette,” he added. “It has Paul’s attention. He’s very excited about it.” Allen is expected to make a decision about whether to partner with Sierra Nevada before the end of the year, Beames added.

http://sen.com/news/paul-allen-s-stratolaunch-eyes-sierra-nevada-dream-chaser-space-plane

From the article:

"Stratolaunch’s Dream Chaser would be about 75 percent smaller, with seating for a pilot and up to two passengers, or a combination of passengers and crew."

75 percent smaller, wow, that is going to be one tiny spaceship.  ;D
Yeah, the astro-mice on board the ISS will test fly the mini-DC upon return... ;D
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Kaputnik on 11/26/2014 09:49 PM
Speculation: could scaled DC use a miniature docking system, requiring the ISS to host an adapter?
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: Bob Shaw on 11/26/2014 10:05 PM

IIRC didn't someone point out that part of the inspiration for the DC itself was the Mig/BOR? :)

Randy

"Inspiration" is hardly the word for it, it's NASA's revenge for Buran!
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: robertross on 11/27/2014 01:47 AM
Speculation: could scaled DC use a miniature docking system, requiring the ISS to host an adapter?

Then it would essentially be dedicated to DC. Also, it is something would have to be brought up on another vehicle.

Lots of added cost for an adpator to a station that many partner nations seem to be disinterested in now due to the recurring costs and limited national budgets. It's a rather sad situation.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: ChrisWilson68 on 11/27/2014 02:00 AM
Speculation: could scaled DC use a miniature docking system, requiring the ISS to host an adapter?

Then it would essentially be dedicated to DC. Also, it is something would have to be brought up on another vehicle.

Lots of added cost for an adpator to a station that many partner nations seem to be disinterested in now due to the recurring costs and limited national budgets. It's a rather sad situation.

Lets not forget that NASA already had a chance to pick Dream Chaser but turned it down.  NASA has chosen two other commercial crew providers whose development they are funding, plus Russia has their own vehicle they will continue to use.  How many different crew vehicles are really needed to service a single station?

It's really grasping at straws to suggest mini-DC for ISS missions.  The fact that Orbital and Stratolaunch talk about it so much with respect to mini-DC just highlights the fact: mini-DC has no customers.  Even if Paul Allen decides to fund its development, after it's built, it will still have no customers.

The problem isn't that we lack crew vehicles for getting between the surface of the Earth and LEO.  We'll soon have many of them.  The problem is we have very little for them to do.  Lets work on that and stop wasting time and effort on yet another crew transfer system.
Title: Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
Post by: A_M_Swallow on 11/27/2014 03:46 AM
Speculation: could scaled DC use a miniature docking system, requiring the ISS to host an adapter?

Then it would essentially be dedicated to DC. Also, it is something would have to be brought up on another vehicle.

Lots of added cost for an adpator to a station that many partner nations seem to be disinterested in now due to the recurring costs and limited national budgets. It's a rather sad situation.

Miniature docking system - could the Dream Chase dock using a suit port?
Possibly fitted sideways.